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Balancing Baron Buff

Robin Song Robin·3/23/2015, 9:45:13 PM·16 votes·2,138 views

(Try saying that three times fast!)

Since the beginning of season 5, the updates to Hand of Baron have done a great job of opening up an opportunity for a team to break through their enemy's nexus. The changes to how it affects lane minions provides a clear path for the final stage of the game; Push lanes -> take baron -> return to pushed lanes and win the game.

However.

While I understand Hand of Baron is supposed to be a 'wrecking ball' tool to get inside the enemy's base, I don't believe it should be a mechanic without counterplay. The way I see it used most consistently is with a team who has taken baron, 4 of the players go mid, and the 1 most suited to split pushing goes top or bot to maximize the enhanced minion effect from the buff, and create more pressure on the enemy base.

The reason that strategy is so effective is twofold: First, Baron empowered minions are so strong, that a lone lane of them unanswered will quickly build up and melt a tower, even without the active attacks of the split pusher enabling them. How easy is it for Zed to shove top lane with baron buff, then juuuust slightly back out of range of the enemies who are forced to deal with the empowered minions, but not out of range of the minions he is empowering? Second: the +40 AD/AP buff from Hand of Baron makes every member of the team with Baron Buff significantly more powerful. This means a team with baron can usually fight 4v5 and still come out even. Also: the splitpusher with Hand of Baron (if he couldn't before) can now 1v1 anyone on the enemy team, which makes him that much harder to deal with.

So, without a numbers advantage (send someone to deal with the splitpusher), the team playing against a baron buff will lose fights. And with a numbers advantage (all 5 force a fight mid), the team without baron will lose a side-lane inhibitor.

As it stands, there is no way to face Baron Buffed sieges other than buckle down in base and hope the enemy fucks up hard.

I'm not saying Hand of Baron needs it's kneecaps (knuckles?) beaten with a nerf bat until it cries, I just think it could be retouched so that a baron fight is no longer the full-stop of a game, with killing the nexus a bracketed afterthought. I suggest the 40 AD/AP buff be changed to 'gain 10 AD/AP for each nearby ally champion'. With this change; 1 person who has baron alone recieves 0 bonus AD/AP, two people together gain 10 AD/AP each, increasing to a full team of 5 get 40 AD/AP each. This allows the 'group 5, slam a lane' strategy to remain unchanged, but adds counterplay to the '1 splitpush, 4 mid' strategy by making it easier to fight off a lone splitpusher, and (while not making a team with baron buff weaker) makes a team which doesn't group properly after baron not as strong.

So what do you think? Do you agree that Baron Buff is a bit too strong on live? Should the adjusment be stronger/weaker/completely different? Please discuss your thoughts! ^.^

21 Comments

FarRockBF3/23/2015, 9:48:10 PM24 votes

I agree slightly. The minions should scale with how many Baron holders are around them. One champ should only slightly buff them.

GhostButter013/23/2015, 9:50:39 PM2 votes

I like the baron buff the way it is. Most of the time Baron buff is required to finish a game so it doesn't got into that stupid 50min+ each team keeps trading throws crap.

I hate, hate, hate, games that go much past 30 minutes.

I personally think that at the 45min mark, player deaths should be permanent.

But yeah, I like baron buff the way it is because it does a lot to keep games shorter in duration.

Minrog3/24/2015, 5:10:04 AM2 votes

I think it needs to be a little bit stronger maybe. Right now, teams with strong waveclear are still able to turtle up at the inhibitor towers for too long even with the Hand of Baron buff on the other team. The purpose behind it is to prevent 70+ minute games where neither team can unlock the other side's stalemate. With the 5 Dragon buff + Hand of Baron I think it's working fairly well except in edge cases like Xerath+Jinx where they can block multiple lanes in the late game.

Maybe giving the minions that have Hand of Baron stronger defenses against AOE waveclear abilities would help it.

Dengeden3/24/2015, 4:33:41 AM2 votes

Honestly? I wholeheartedly disagree. How do you obtain baron? By sneaking it or winning a team fight. If the former is the case, you lost a lot of lane pressure and probably dragon (5 stacks baybee). If the latter is the case, you could've pushed like heck anyway.

Setting up split push is a lot harder than you're implying. The risk of getting 5v4'd or 1v2+'d is pretty great unless you have close to perfect vision (which takes a lot of time).

Llanite3/24/2015, 6:10:10 AM2 votes

I actually like the current baron.

To maximize the effect, team needs to split, whilst the other one should have better chance 5v4.

n810m3/24/2015, 7:31:24 AM2 votes

It's a good idea and not one of the "nerfing numbers solves problems" ones but there are some points to be made. Baron is quite hard to get and if you get it, you usually deserve it. Plus there's the fact that the duration is 3 minutes now. You do have a great point though and I really like the idea of the minions needing more champions to have the buff to become super OP winion status. Maybe ranks by 1/2/3 champs? It gives more meaning to surviving after taking a Baron with your team instead of 1-3 people. Makes sense since the Baron got a lot easier to take after patch 5.1 (see commentary on the recent TL vs CST and TSM vs CLG games).

The Yetii Rider3/24/2015, 1:58:12 PM2 votes

Yes. Baron should empower the team to fight together. It should encourage the team to group as five and smash through a turtling defenders team, or if it was stolen by the losing team, encourage them to group as five and close the gold gap between the two teams and destroy them 5v5, with enough time for the survivors to push and take at least one objective.

It should not benefit split pushers nearly so much. Especially since the shields on inner lane turrets were weakened.

qetzel3/24/2015, 11:45:25 AM1 votes

I think you just mentioned th counterplay. If they don't have a splitpusher they aren't making full use of the Baron, if they do, win a 5v4 (you should be able to) then collapse on the spitter. If you can't win the 5v4 you are so far behind that you should have already lost.

Father Cthulhu3/24/2015, 3:38:49 PM1 votes

There IS counterplay. Have proper objective control and ward coverage, and contest Baron properly.

It Hertz When IP3/24/2015, 2:33:05 AM1 votes

I think it's fine as is. This is what vision is for; if you do nothing else all game with your yellow, at the very least keep Baron warded. I've stolen Dragon from 5 enemy champs using Vel'koz's ult before, and I can only assume similar stealing strategies will work with Baron.

It's all objective control. That, and nerfing Baron will just encourage stagnating gameplay.

Kögâ3/24/2015, 3:57:02 AM1 votes

I kinda like how baron is just a contestable nexus that you have the slightest chance of still winning even if you don't get baron.

2 much sauuuce3/24/2015, 8:00:44 AM1 votes

Baron is considered THE highest contested objective on the map for a reason.

Even suggesting nerfing it's power is ridiculous.

If your team let the other team get free baron uncontested, or you can't prevent them from taking baron (and especially if you don't even try) then your opponents deserves EVERY OUNCE OF POWER the baron buff provides.

Why should your opponents suffer for your teams lack of objective control and, more importantly, why should your team reap benefits for lack of objective control???

Amarajah3/23/2015, 10:45:41 PM1 votes

I feel like what should keep games shorter are higher respawn timers earlier, not baron buff's ridiculous pushing power