She was already the dominant pick in the previous patch... but now that's about to increase.
Well guess what: Frozen heart got nerfed, Randuins got nerfed (changed, but against Botrk vayne it's a nerf). And what did we get in return? MR item buffs. Ye that will teach her.
"Her early game is really strong"
thanks riot for what you've done to the bot lane meta that VAYNE HAS A STRONG EARLY GAME
VAYNE STRONG EARLY GAME VAYNE
3 months ago only the vayne mains could even get out of lane without feeding, now I win pretty much every Vayne lane as long as I don't pick her into shit like Draven.
Konckback, Stun and invisibility on a adc with % health true damage. Thats bullshit.
I'm just offering my thoughts as unranked player - so consider them with respect to my average experience and capabilities.
I play some Vayne and while there has been a definite increase in her popularity recently, I don't think she needs nerfs. Here are a few points which I think address this issue:
I think the crux of the issue is not that Vayne is too strong but rather that she hit her power spike faster. I tend to think of Vayne as weak early, strong late, but even stronger mid. She shines in the midgame, when opponent carries are building completely offensively and opponent tanks have built maybe 2/3 items with one of them usually being mr or boots. During this mid game enemy opponents are often so focused on building items they don't buy a pink ward or upgrade red trinket. Vayne is strongest imo at this point - when she has bork + greaves, kiting opponents who don't invest 100 gold to expose invisibility and somewhat nullifying the sunfire/tabi/armor rush with her silver bolts procs. During this same mid game, team fights are more likely to occur in the jungle instead of lane phase, allowing Vayne to utilize brush + ult stealth to exploit more ways to get the stun of condemn as there is simply more terrain.
This brings me to what I said earlier: Vayne hits her power spike earlier. See with BoRK, which costs less than IE and builds out of cheaper components (though most don't Vayne can do the 3 pot Long sword start to rush vamp scepter), and Greaves, which is quite cheap AS, Vayne dishes out a lot of dps - especially with her ult ad steroid. With 1400 gold, Vayne can sustain decently in lane and with Tier 1 boots she can play more safe. These items are relatively cheaper than the ones conventional ADC's rush.
But I don't think these issues remove her weakness (which is still her undesirable lane phase); they just help her get out of it faster. The solution? Honestly, I'm not sure. The obvious answer is to nerf her kit but I am personally against that without more lategame compensation. BoRK was changed into an ADC item instead of caster item (active nerfed, passive changed instead of 5% max health to 8% current); the best solution is probably to revert the changes or at least make BoRK are much more disputable pick for ADC's in general.
Ever since Cinderhulk was introduced, aggressive early junglers such as Lee Sin and Elise were slowly replaced by later scaling tanks such as Sejuani and Gragas. Thus, Vayne faced far less early pressure because her opposing jungler took longer to clear, tended to have less mobility, and relied more on providing utility to their team instead of high base damage/execute play potential. This jungle shift is simply not as punishing early, and late game will suffer because they are simply building tank to which Vayne will shred.
With nearly every top laner running teleport its too risky for enemy bot lane to dive as your own top laner can tp to a lane minion or bush ward or just the turret and give Vayne some help; she might still die but because of that tp she might get enemy summoners or kill/assists. Of course since the enemy top laner is likely running tp if Vayne dives she takes that risk - but as we have all heard Vayne has a weak early - its far more likely she is pushed in than pushed out.
As the meta is simply becoming more late game focused, Vayne is given more freedom to farm and scale. Team compositions have changed - diving an enemy Vayne with your Amumu is harder early than with your Lee.
Furthermore AP Offensive supports are far less common - support Nautilus in particular is so amazing. With top lane /jungle tanks like Shen and Naut coming to the bot lane, Vayne doesn't have to deal with a squishy lane partner, but rather an initiator who can peel while Vayne kites. Early poke like Morgana and Sona while valuable seem to pale in comparison with your Alistar's constant heals and flash q w into turret.
This shift in meta is to me, a Vayne player, simply more freeing and forgiving.
To me, this is the crux of the issue at hand. Vayne has some of the lowest base stats and is utterly auto attack reliant (i think of Condemn as a long cool down aa enhancifier) - she cannot wave clear and she cannot kill towers. Vayne might be able to 1v1 any ADC late game, but she can't kill towers faster than Trist or Jinx. Graves and sivir can clear waves with 1 q 12 mintues into game, which Vayne cannot match without sacrificing an item slot for relatively weak shiv. There are a lot of ways to pressure Vayne that don't involve fighting her - if you can apply pressure to her tower then roam mid lane or invade enmy jungle. Map and objective pressure should be exploited so that Vayne is punished for having such duelist kit. Call your mid laner and jungler and gangk bot; intimidate her so early she will think twice of ever choosing her again.
Vayne is sort of the Nasus of ADC's. They have lategames which are time dependent - not as much kill/gold dependent. To them kills and towers are useful but not necessary if they can drag out the game even 10 more seconds to scale into later.
These are just my thoughts - please respond.
Can someone enlighten me what is wrong with Vayne?
A late game hyper carry pooping on people late game? What's the issue?
Pre-bork she's complete ass (from what i've seen) and post-bork she's usually meh
Post-bork/PD(or shiv..or BT or IE w/e she gets after bork) and boots is usually when they become a nightmare and that's perfectly reasonable that if she gets 3-4 items she starts scaling hard. That's what is suppose to happen is it not?
She has a weak early game. That phase may not last as long as someone like Tristana but it's still relatively weak.
The does what she's supposed to do: eat tanks. The counter to her (besides moderate/hard CC) is HP and attack speed reduction (Roduins, Frozen Heart, Exhaust).
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