Why current mana fixes don't work from a balance perspective

Zalinthel·2/19/2015, 9:17:48 PM·3 votes·771 views

The issues with mana in the day and age stem from a combination of high mana costs and small mana pools. Spells take large chunks of total mana each, which causes most mages to burn out rather quickly. The normal fix to this has been regen items like Athene's that out-regen the expenditure. This, of course, wasn't healthy, because casters could spam forever.

Instead, increasing mana totals (with a splash of regen) could be a healthier alternative. Having more mana available means that your spells eat less percentage wise per cast, increasing your time/casts before running dry. This also has the side effect of making regen more powerful; the larger your pool, the more time the regen has to work.

Currently, pure mana options like Tear and RoA often fall short due to ramp up times and power-spike delay that most mages simply can't afford. However, a Mage with a Seraph's can cast a lot longer than normal, which, again, makes his regen matter more, and increases his time doing stuff, but more importantly does not stop him from eventually running dry.

This is a healthy interaction. Offering mages CDR options that promote mana pool rather than regen could make this problem better for both ends of the argument. Items like Morello's could be differently itemized to support their intended usages rather than being "buy this->lolmana."

Thoughts and suggestions are welcome.

Some notes:

Currently, stacked Tear+Athene's basically means your mana bar stops existing, but is too weak in raw power stats to matter.

A possible suggestion would be to take off some/all of Athene's regen in exchange for adding raw mana to it (which increases the value of its mana font anyways) to help solidify its intent as the "cast for a long time" item, without pushing it back into unlimited mana for one purchase. This also increases the synergy with Seraph's, which is fine because currently the items want to play nice currently but just...don't. Seraph's+Athene's would cause endless mana, but it takes a lot of time for that to happen, and in the meanwhile makes you have to pay for the investment before you're stacked. This is fine because of the trade off and risk, in exchange for potential reward.

6 Comments

MrSprichler2/19/2015, 9:36:19 PM1 votes

I think that there's no good fix for this. I can only see a best of a bad situation type thing going on.

More mana and cooldown vs more mana regen and cooldown. either one you can still spam spells, your rate is just going to vary. There is no balanced fix for this because either way it gets to the same thing at a certain point in the game: make sure you have all your mana and abilities off cooldown for the next fight. and in those situations well you either win or die for the most part, then limp back to base to heal up and spend gold. where it all heals up anyways. I think mana cost on some spells could be looked at as too high, but that in itself is the most effective way to impact the ability to spam spells, which is of all the easiest way to balance it. if it's too expensive to use forever, it won't be able to be done forever.

Make the players use the resources they have carefully. its ugly, but it works. kinda.

Erockandroll2/19/2015, 9:51:02 PM1 votes

The thing with Maximum mana is that it has not been extensively explored. We have no Idea how introducing new items for mana will effect the game.

considering that mana Crystal only builds into 4 items. Sheen is not built for the mana, and is hardly ever built right away. RoA and Glacial Shroud are more Tankier items, that don't help APC's and much. And then theirs tear, which needs time to scale.

Here's my Hypothesis, The new Mana Items will be more short term Mana fixes, (compared to the long term fix with MP5). This will give more options to casters, it would also scale better with Chalice since the mana font now scales with Max Mana.

SmokingPuffin2/19/2015, 10:54:20 PM1 votes

Ryze is the elephant in the room when it comes to pure +mana itemization. That's why so many "mana items" are implemented as regen items, and why it's not practical for a mage to efficiently stack mana.

I do agree that large mana pool with moderate regen is a healthier late game state than moderate mana pool with large regen.