Is something ever going to be done about Relic and Allies?

Kubox·6/8/2018, 5:52:51 AM·36 votes·13,556 views

Maybe I've just been unlucky but it seems that the moment I show up to a lane with full stacks allies just go full monkey and kill everything in sight.

I don't care if you keep the mechanic for laning phase, but once that's done, something needs to be made so that the support player is not at the absolute mercy of whether the rest of their team has a brain or not.

Like, I don't know, maybe add an effect to the fully upgraded item where a minion only has to die in close proximity (150-300 range?) of the support to proc the effect. Makes it so supports still have to sit in the minion wave to get stuff without necessarily turning it into Coin 2.0

46 Comments

Tesladin6/8/2018, 6:37:27 AM18 votes

I agree the mechanic only means something more to worry about - can you get last hits before Yasuo and Sivir delete the lane. Honestly there has been a massive number of occasions when I don't get a single last hit with it time and time again.

Teridax686/8/2018, 1:06:48 PM6 votes

I agree with this. I think there are three major problems with the Relic Shield line at this point: number one, it's the only support income item that specifically relies on allies playing well in order to work, and it does so by having allies do something they normally wouldn't do, i.e. hold off on CS. This leads to the support getting screwed over when allies farm absent-mindedly, which is especially common in uncoordinated games. Number two, it's an item line whose passive only really makes sense in lane, because after the laning phase the support is usually expected to go out and ward, not join their allies to farm (and if they try that, the waves are usually cleared before they get there). Number three, because the item line's balanced heavily around team coordination, it's affected it to such a degree that it generally feels awkward to use in pubs, while being so good in pro play that even the marksman will sometimes take a Relic Shield as well at the start.

Because of this, I think it might be better to give the item a buddy mechanic as with Taric's W or Knight's Vow, so that both players get to share gold from their minion kills, to at least some extent. It might even be worth sacrificing some of the item's other bonuses, such as its heal or passive Gp10, and adding conditionals to prevent overlap with Ancient Coin, such as a short leash range that increases with game time, but otherwise it could help smooth over the item's problems, while still encouraging teammates to coordinate.

IcyPepper6/8/2018, 4:22:09 PM5 votes

Why not just make your autos "mark" a minion after you've completed the quest, like Quinn's passive or something? You can only mark one minion at a time, and if an ally champion last hits before you, you get the gold and heal like if you executed it?

It won't get you the whole wave, but it might help out.

Nankyoku6/8/2018, 4:23:04 PM4 votes

It's funny when they deny you like 100g per wave, then you have no gold to buy items to keep them alive and they die. "noob support"

Wild Geese6/8/2018, 4:18:29 PM3 votes

As somebody who only plays like Taric and TahmKench when I play support I've been waiting for a chance to say how much I despise this item...

The gold/5 is lower than any support item, you rely on last hitting cannon minions all Laning phase (which you're easily punished for)-- past the Laning phase you're lucky to get any tribute procs at all..

Nevermind that it encourages tank supports to push, when you don't really want to push since going on the offense could mean diving a turret...

The whole targon line just annoys me, bring back heart of gold instead. Or replace the dumb gimmick that causes it to be nerfed so hard because it's op in the LCS (is it? I don't watch it, but I'll assume that's why)...

Pika Fox6/8/2018, 1:51:34 PM3 votes

Make it so if an ally kills a cannon and you have a proc, it uses your proc. Not every minion, just the cannon. Relic was nerfed so heavily because of cannon buffs that missing a cannon completely cripples relic users.

PhDs Nuts6/8/2018, 4:25:52 PM2 votes

They could give the completed Relic item a small aura that procs charges when minions in the AoE die. It wouldn't need a radius any larger than a melee autoattack. That would still give the support some control over which minions it gets used on.

Or, when a charge is available, make your AA mark a minion for X seconds like said above.

Bob the Toastr6/8/2018, 3:53:41 PM2 votes

Totally agree with the proximity procs. Especially when I'm playing Nasus and a support comes by I'm torn between sharing the gold or getting those sweet, sweet stax.

Spacesuit Spiff6/8/2018, 8:39:18 PM2 votes

People have been saying this for years now, idk why riot doesnt think its a problem.

Theyre probably concerned about using it to hardpush but really, in what world is that going to matter outside of laning? Even for clearing supers its nothing special.

ChaddyFantome6/8/2018, 1:27:43 PM1 votes

Back before riot killed sight stone, relic procs had increased attack speed to help you get em faster.

Like most things that happened in that update, no clue ehy they removed it.

ModPeriscope6/8/2018, 4:37:42 PM1 votes

I disagree with the proximity procs, unless there’s an exception. It should not proc by proximity when the enemy has baron or banner on a minion. That is, there shouldn’t be an execute by proximity.

It is a frustrating mechanic, for sure. But I do get that sometimes clearing the wave quickly takes priority over getting all of your procs.

LuthianDelphi6/8/2018, 6:08:23 PM1 votes

Tbh spellthiefs need more help, i can be poking constantly in lane lvls 1-5 back for t2 and only be 70-120 gold ahead of the enemy support with coin. spellthiefs tho actually requires you to interact w/ the enemy and you can't gain gold from it passively while your team clears waves unlike coin and relic and it feels like u risk alot less going coin than you stand to gain from spellthiefs. Especially considering usually the enemy is semi-competent enough to zone you back or fight back so unless your absolutely stomping theres a good chance the coin user is gaining more.

My Waifu Vanilla6/9/2018, 1:38:29 PM1 votes

When you upgrade and finish the quest (or buy the eye and finish the quest doesn't matter) the execute ratio should just be buffed through the roof tbh. At that point you aren't laning and while I wait for melee creeps and cannons to reach 1/3 health STILL my mid laner cleared the whole wave. Relic users already typically have garbage attack speed so constantly having your auto attack cancelled because the creep died doesn't help.

After the nerfs Relic already makes less gold than coin on live. I shouldn't have to be punished further by not making ANY gold after laning phase.

BakedLotion6/8/2018, 9:24:14 PM1 votes

Why not just make it so spells from melee champions can proc it if its at the threshold

Or at a reduced threshold

SpecterVonBaren6/8/2018, 9:38:41 PM1 votes

Prepare for people coming in saying "Hey when I need to shove the wave so we can't start sieging don't complain about me doing my job!"

Of course that's your job! But it's not your job to blast a wave when you're just clearing it while waiting for people to group. Us supports are not talking about when you're pushing, we aren't stupid, it's that all of you guys do this even when it costs NOTHING to you or the game to just let the support execute some minions.

Verxint6/8/2018, 10:36:52 PM1 votes

Make it so when you ping the item after sightstone quest it shows remaining charges not remaining wards. Previously my strategy was to dump every ping I was allowed onto my relic/targon repeatedly until I got the stacks, people usually figured it out after 4 screens full of "Face of the mountain: 4 charges remaining"

ModCaptainMårvelous6/9/2018, 12:09:50 AM1 votes

"Please let me last hit cannon." "Please for gods sake"

uses every single CD to last hit the cannon

IJSDOIJDOISJD)A(SI_A(I)(FJCIJAOISJOIJS

Nea1046/9/2018, 4:27:32 AM1 votes

It's a big downside indeed... And still they keep nerfing that item :/

SanKakU6/8/2018, 3:22:17 PM1 votes

They are PTSD sufferers that are deluded into thinking there are no Relic Shield stacks swirling around the allied champ coming near to the minions.