PBE Sylas (and what those of us who play him actually WANT)

Neverm0re·12/14/2019, 9:15:25 PM·29 votes·14,641 views
Do you want sylas to be balanced as an AP assassin or an AP bruiser/skirmisher?

The goons have spoken. Sylas has been roaming the Rift for almost a year and the recent PBE changes might just kill him. Not because he won't be powerful enough (in fact, I'd say the changes being made to him put him at an ideal power level if not slightly too good) but because nobody will want to actually play him. After discussing extensively with the rest of the Sylas community, this is my verdict:

With the 100% AP scaling on his E2 currently being tested on the PBE, Sylas is moving away from a bruiser playstyle and further towards a full AP assassin who onebangs you once his E2 absolutely chunks you. Furthermore, the removal of his auto attack resets from W and E seek to "reduce the skill floor" of his kit, which makes absolutely no sense to me or anyone else who currently plays Sylas. Why is it OK for other mechanically complex champs like Riven to have these mechanics but Sylas isn't allowed them because they make his kit not "accessible" enough? Removing these core elements make him feel clunky to play and way too slow to be fun any more.

The changes have resulted in dedicated Sylas players like myself not even recognising the champion any more: why is his E2 so ludicrously powerful but his passive still does no damage? Why are his resets gone? Why is he being balanced like an assassin when the majority opinion of Sylas players would rather see him as a bruiser, where these resets would actually be useful to proc Conqueror faster?

I would describe the changes as "one step forward, two steps back". One step forward: reduced cooldowns, more focus on scaling and higher mana costs means Sylas is incentivised to build ROA now which should be the core item on a mana-using AP bruiser like him. Two steps back: he still gets too much reward for building full AP and none for building AP-tank, and his passive (his main sustained DPS tool) still sucks while his E does absolute metric tonnes of damage for no reason whatsoever. There are very good parts to these changes (the Q and W changes in particular are beloved by us and a step in the right direction) but they are overshadowed by the bizarre decision to dramatically overjuice his E2 to make it do ludicrous amounts of damage if you build full AP.

The PBE changes for Sylas at the moment could do with some changes to better fit this more beloved bruiser play style. With the Sylas main community as my witnesses, I suggest the following amendments to it: -Give the passive a base damage again. Maybe make it scale with level like Camille's Q instead of AP to keep it under control while not letting it be useless. Scrap the third charge, nobody needs or wants it. -Dramatically reduce E2 damage, especially the AP scaling. 100% is absolutely absurd and total overkill. Depending on how dramatic this reduction would be, a short reduction to E's cooldown may be in order, although a better way to retain his power budget while keeping enfranchised Sylas players interested would be... -Bring back resets! Cutting E2 damage right down to the bone would allow room for good Sylas players to make use of this mechanic that's existed in their kit from the start and give that rewarding learning curve top that other champions like Riven and Fiora get to enjoy. They make him play so much more smoothly and to lose them would be a disservice to Sylas and his players.

Thank you!

34 Comments

Infernape12/14/2019, 9:33:04 PM12 votes

A lot of his problems is in his itemisation. He has none aside from going full AP. Sylas either tries to build AP and durability and does no damage or builds full AP and either becomes a nuisance because he needs ridiculous and frustrating amounts of shielding and healing to even be functional (release Sylas anyone?), or he just explodes because his kit is designed to work when he's in someone's face and weaving spells and AAs.

I don't know why Riot's solution to everything is just MOAR DAMAGE! Sylas on the PBE is capable of basically half healthing squishies with E2 into W. Those two abilities maxed out with 500 AP will deal 1500 damage in an instant.

Honestly, removing Sylas' resets is akin to removing Riven's ability to animation cancel (which funnily enough is _actually _ a bug). It makes him needlessly clunky. E into AA into W into AA will basically freeze him in place in between W and his next AA. It feels horrible to play with. Especially on a champion that is a fighter. It honestly reminds me of when Riot reworked LeBlanc and how clunky it was waiting for her passive to proc.

Crescent Dusk12/15/2019, 1:36:25 AM6 votes

He's an AP bruiser, don't need him to be yet another AP assassin.

The problem is Riot were idiots and nerfed him because he was viable top when they shouldn't have.

It was fine to nerf his waveclear so he couldn't trivially wave push and roam 24/7, but they should have never touched his shield and made it an AP only shield; it made him worthless.

Just revert the nerf to the shield and his healing. Make landing the sweet spot of his Q more rewarding, it barely does any damage.

His AP ratios and base damage for some ults also needs to be fixed. He steals Zed ult and a complete rotation during Zed ult is so sad it pops the mark and only does like 20-30% of a target's damage as opposed to Zed's real ult.

VänilläTrëës12/15/2019, 5:34:11 AM3 votes

personally i feel like Sylas felt the best on release.Sylas

LightswornLance12/15/2019, 2:09:33 AM3 votes

At first glance it seems like they made him an assassin with all those AP ratios, you expect to just be able to do the classic E E2 Q AA W AA combo and kill someone. But in reality they actually made him a bruiser. They decreased his reliance on Q and gave E and W shorter cooldowns and made it so that you cant just throw all your abilities in 1 second then just walk around aimlessly like how every Sylas player ( including myself ) currently plays him. It's good balance wise but feels shit to play. TBH I wouldn't even mind him being balanced as an Assassin with him oneshotting in E E2 Q AA W AA like how every other assassin one shots with their combo. Because in the live version of Sylas what ends up happening if you build like a bruiser, by mid - late game you end up not doing any damage AND not even being that tanky and dying 1v1 to anybody.

EDIT: Actually he 100% is a bruiser in this new iteration. Look at those fucking base stats. 2480 base HP at level 18 literally the highest in the game ( Galio current highest is 2466 ) 61.75 MR at level 18 also highest in the game, his armor is 95 at level 18, which isnt the best but pretty average for a bruiser ( same as jarvan, mundo, and lee sin ).

Bisaknosp12/15/2019, 12:20:37 PM2 votes

what about those who have to play vs him? hes cancer and can stay dead forever for all i care

Okraki12/15/2019, 6:27:35 AM2 votes

Our votes mean nothing, riot does not read these boards, let alone act on peoples out cry's.

Frontline Fury12/15/2019, 7:55:56 AM2 votes

I wish i could just keep playing my tank Sylas.

PzyXo12/15/2019, 11:35:56 AM2 votes

Sylas is like AP Rhaast (Darkin Kayn), I love to play him because he doesn't do much damage + he's tanky. I didn't play him in a while but I miss him ngl

BLIGHTBRINGER12/15/2019, 9:21:55 AM2 votes

Sylas doesn't really have the required mobility of traditional assassins to compete, thus why I think they should just keep him as an AP bruiser.

But I agree with what others are saying, his issues are in his itemisation. Most of the AP Items offer too much offence power (MR Pen and % Magic Pen and just additional damage of Ludens and Lich). They need to add more bruiser type AP Items, Rod is sort of mediocre at best.

14daysuspensionk12/15/2019, 11:50:05 AM2 votes

Why tf is every AP champion bneing turned into a burst champ. Why is Riot so obsesses with this??? Why do they think it's the only thing that makes money???

Fear the Kayn12/16/2019, 8:12:02 PM1 votes

He should also be a jungle/mid.

Acemaster8112/15/2019, 12:41:09 AM1 votes

Please come comment on a post I've made recently, I feel I noticed something and I want to hear your opinions about it. It is about new champions and reworks and I tried to be thoughtful about this situation when I was typing it. My writing is not an essay, but it describes my feelings and hopefully yours too.

The Stripy Bag12/15/2019, 5:48:31 AM1 votes

You know I just realize there is no point to this. I mean I want him to be a Bruiser/Skirmisher as much as the next Sylas player but Riot ain't gonna listen. It's not like they go onto the Boards much these days or try to listen to feed back unless maybe it's on a really popular champion. What's the point in voicing discontent when they are gonna do it or not based off of if they feel like it. Not like most of them even play the game let alone Magical All for One.

Remilia is Male12/15/2019, 9:21:08 AM1 votes

Just change name already to "League of assassins" other classes are forgotten by riot mostly in favour of assassins, just stop this already, gut em all to the ground.

RavenMagus12/15/2019, 10:57:13 AM1 votes

"Do you want sylas to be balanced as an AP assassin or an AP bruiser/skirmisher?"

Vote bruiser so that he can have the damage of an AP assassin but tankier and with more CC That's what 'balanced as a bruiser' means these days

Malix Farwin12/15/2019, 11:24:36 AM1 votes

Theres starting to be a trend with riots mini reworks lately. They seem to be more interested in balance and less interested in gameplay which to be quite honest with you is a very sad thing to see.It just ends up with people moving on to more fun things and less willing to try new things that will just end up being unfun in the future.

FSRER12/15/2019, 12:43:02 PM1 votes

Sylas is getting the Aatrox treatment. Was designed as something specific, failed at that and forced to become something that he is not The same way that Aatrox from a Drain Duelist became Riven, the same way Sylas from a battlemage (more sustain less burst) becomes a Katarina (goes in bursts you down while healing, goes out)

Ugly Naked Guy12/15/2019, 3:58:06 PM1 votes

I personally think that riot should make sylas a true jungler. Wish this changes makes him a good jungler.

RyzeRework12/16/2019, 10:07:26 AM1 votes

Honestly sylas passive seems to be like a last minute kerfuffle. It's like the dude that made spaghetti and was like fuck dude what if we took some of this cheese and shredded it on there

9mm Valentine12/16/2019, 2:14:45 PM1 votes

He's a slayer but people keep thinking he's supposed to be a bruiser with a ton of health. His kit is designed to win duels like Fiora, Yasuo, Yi, etc.