Boards›Gameplay

ARAM vote cancel/auto balancing

Linuxpenguin2·6/9/2018, 3:36:10 AM·22 votes·9,726 views

So we had an ARAM where we had Udyr, Warwick, Rammus, Riven, and Renekton...... That is 100% a lose, and a waste of time for everyone involved. I understand ARAM is supposed to be "luck of the draw" but when you get 5 melee champs against poke ranged, you literally cant not win; unless the enemy team is entirely incompetent. Its a waste of time for everyone involved, and is frankly kind of garbage.

Two solutions

  1. auto balance. Make sure both teams have equal number of AP casters, ranged AD, and melee types. This would be ideal, albeit probably difficult for those that "tailor" their accounts to only have certain champs. 5 Melee vs 5 melee would be EXTREMELY fun, but 5 melee vs 5 poke is not fun at all.
  2. Allow a vote withdrawal. Require 5 votes to forfeit match, count as a loss, and not waste our time playing with a horrendous team comp.

I know the purists will complain about how its "random" but... fairness should be taken into consideration imo. One game I played, we had WW, maokai, and jax vs karthus, xerath, velkoz, vayne, and lucian. It was the most unfun game possible. Since these game modes are supposed to be "fun", getting stomped for 15 minutes really is against that spirit of "fun".

32 Comments

JavelinJoe6/9/2018, 3:44:16 AM13 votes

purists will complain about how its "random"

If anyone is saying that ARAM is at all random, then they are mistaken. It is random for only about 50% because it pulls from a intentionally stocked limited pool of specificly OP champions that players make accounts for.

Calabera6/9/2018, 5:58:29 AM7 votes

I think the recent patch made the balance even worse. Rerolling bad champions isn't the only option anymore, you can now reroll decent champions to see if you get better ones for yourself or your teammates -- and if you don't you can simply swap back to the champs you rerolled. This means that there's more chances to roll better champions and get a stronger comp as there's no longer a penalty to rerolling, I personally have been seeing more xerath, ziggs, and lux in my matches and less low tier ARAM champs since the change.

VonToothskie6/9/2018, 7:18:56 AM6 votes

2 things: First, its not that melee vs ranged is a loss. put Galeo, Mundo, Garen, Braum, and Trundle/Sion on a team and I dare you to lose. Ive won several all melee games vs adcs/mages, and its honestly easier cause they just cant kill you fst enough Second, youre assuming that its possible to categorize and balance team composition in ARAM, but it is not possible. many champions are their own thing entirely, with no equivalent opposite, and Champs are god tier in some comps and struggle in others for a dozen reasons. its primarily synergy that wins games. synergy of abilities/design amongst champs and synergy of playstyle amongst players. the other big thing is stupidity/trolling teammates. for example if your tank is hiding behind the rest of the team, youre going to lose. if your mage is building ap without mana (so they cant cast after the first engage) you will lose. if a teamate wont participate and only comes in to snipe kills(like waiting till team matesare dead to ensure they get kills) you will lose. if people AFK until after first blood, you will lose. to me all of that is more important than team comp

5041545249434BOD6/9/2018, 5:57:13 AM5 votes

{quoted} we had WW, maokai, and jax vs karthus, xerath, velkoz, vayne, and lucian. It was the most unfun game possible.

Never knew Arams loaded 3v5s.

Naramiel6/9/2018, 1:25:03 PM4 votes

Honestly, tanky melee teams do great in the late game in ARAM. Yes, it can be hard to get that point if up against the most abusive teams... but the longer the game goes, the better melee does versus poke comps.

Nea1046/9/2018, 4:30:34 AM4 votes

With all the stats they get, or could easily get, there should be "tiers" for Aram. So that you're never gonna face Lux, Veigar, Ziggs all together.

MEXICOMAN6/9/2018, 7:59:27 AM3 votes

I think the point is, for you who don't understand, is that melee champs are being sorely beaten down by ranked poke/cc champs. ARAM has become unfun since before last season because of the changes that are being made AGAINST melee champs in the game as a whole.

And Riot once claimed that they will never change aram or how it works in any way, but obviously removing items and nerfing common melee used items doesn't count? Total B.S.

Poorly Dressed6/9/2018, 8:03:47 AM2 votes

You can win as melee vs. poke but it takes a lot of effort and team coordination which usually doesn't happen and people tend to give up or rage within the first few minutes. I have played a lot of ARAM games (over 2k) and kiting/healing is straight obnoxious because the map isn't wide enough to engage from the side/flank. The new ghost walking boots help a bit but it's still not enough. Melee waveclear is the biggest issue along with too much damage in the game overall (people on SR complain too). There is also the issue that support champions are balanced around having very low income which isn't a problem on ARAM at all (Karma, Soraka, Sona, Zyra, etc.) and the damage and utility they get from items and gold is just unreal. Soraka or Sona usually totally heal a main damage champion away - completely negating them. The removal of Warmogs is terrible and it could have been solved by for example making it melee only.

Disulfiram6/9/2018, 8:38:49 AM2 votes

What about mixing the two teams?

Explanation:

  1. Matchmaking makes 2 teams (as it does now)
  2. Everyone gets a random champ (as it is now) 3. The system re-mixes the players in these two teams to make them as balanced as it can (example: one team has 4 fighters and the other has 4 adcs -> the system will switch the team for 2 of the adc players and 2 of the fighter players, along with the champion they rolled)
  3. Champ select actually starts (the players are not shown the 3 steps above)
  4. The rest plays out as usual

This small change (the addition of step 3) should make the teams more balanced before rerolls are applied, which in turn should make one-sided champ-select-stomps less common.

Mr Dalloway6/9/2018, 7:49:59 AM2 votes

{quoted}

So we had an ARAM where we had Udyr, Warwick, Rammus, Riven, and Renekton..... I know the purists will complain about how its "random" but... fairness should be taken into consideration imo. One game I played, we had WW, maokai, and jax vs karthus, xerath, velkoz, vayne, and lucian. It was the most unfun game possible. Since these game modes are supposed to be "fun", getting stomped for 15 minutes really is against that spirit of "fun".

So none of you had a RR?

Cait Main6/9/2018, 3:39:24 PM2 votes

I've won games with all melee vs lux,zyra,ez, teemo,and some other unimportant melee champ and it was before they gave melee champions an option to walk through walls. I'm not saying get good but you are overreacting that those games are unwinnable 100% of the time. Also its just a for fun game mode so removing random chance just so that its fair sounds super boring. I have a blast losing playing kled or losing on lux its just in how you look at the game.

LordGeovanni6/9/2018, 5:47:42 PM2 votes

If you play back line poke it is a loss but if you realise that towers cant keep the enemy safe after level 5 then its an easy fight every fight

ahferroin76/9/2018, 5:37:58 PM1 votes

I think the vote is a good idea, but not the auto-balancing. Trying to balance the teams will have to involve matchmaking, which in turn will likely significantly extend queue times.

Now, that said, your comp is not an auto-loss. If you can survive early with a comp like that, and people go tank instead of derpy cheese builds, you will outscale and run over pretty much anybody who gets in your way. It's only a guaranteed loss if they have someone ranged who does %HP true damage and is actually good as that champ.

Yes, some comps are functionally guaranteed wins if played right, but very few are true guaranteed losses.

Acheron166/9/2018, 12:50:12 PM1 votes

Early surrender at 7 minutes.

It is still 7 minutes of torture, but there's that option atleast. If someone refuses, have no qualms about leaving. Just refuse the match and say "no, I'm not playing this completely one-sided match".

PermaJinxed6/9/2018, 6:05:49 PM1 votes

One of my favorite ARAM memories was J4(me), xin(a friend), Panth, Jax, and an afk/dced Riven vs 4 ranged and a tank. We crushed them outright.

The tank could not stop the massive dive.

rtbf2216514126/9/2018, 6:21:48 PM1 votes

Warwick was your initiate. You could have made it work. He would have to be the main tank.

The removal of Warmogs made it so that he has to hit his ult perfectly every time though.

Mr Dalloway6/9/2018, 11:30:46 PM1 votes

Melee champs are fine in ARAM. That isn't to say that sometimes there are comps that are very difficult to play with if your entire team is melee or if the entire enemy team has amazing CC but the biggest problem I see is people who just don't know how to play melee champs in ARAM.

Mr Dalloway6/11/2018, 1:38:44 AM1 votes

I understand the context. Sometimes you get a bad draw. It happens. I used to get games like that before Warmogs was removed. It didn't really help the situation.

Sometimes if you can hang back and not feed long enough for your tanks and bruisers to get tanky you can make a come back. Sometimes you can't. An enemy team that can chain CC you is even worse than just the poke. But I have had games where the first 8-10 minutes we are just stuck under tower dodging enemy projectiles and not seeing a way out and then suddenly we hit a point where we are tanky enough to engage and it turns in our favor. I have also had games where people were so beat down by the first few minutes that they continue to make bad choices or give up.

I have probably played a million ARAM games in the past 5 or so years and have seen it all. I don't see much difference since the removal of Warmogs.

Soƒia6/11/2018, 2:00:38 AM1 votes

Yeah worst part about ARAM is how most of the best picks (in terms of winrate) are supports/poke while the actual hard carry champs tend to do pretty bad (assassins, duelists, shorter ranged adcs and mages).

And sitting at the highest at 70% winrate of course, Sona

Ratpie6/11/2018, 2:22:55 AM1 votes

A few things:

First off melee kicks arse in ARAM. I will take a tanky team over a pure poke team in ARAM anyday. In reality the best is a well balanced comp 2 bruisers/tanks 1 adc, and then damage casters/supports. THe only reason I like the ADC in it is for quick turret takedowns.

Dicing and constant pressure is how you win in ARAM. Problem is when a lot of people get tank teams they stand back and let themselves get poked down. You have to get in their face fast.

This is the most balanced I haver ever seen ARAM and I got like 2k+ games.

I will say there are still dumpster champs that should be an instant reroll, but if someone wants to play them even though it means a loss it is still a fun game. Wins and losses mean nothing in ARAM, it is about learning lots of champs and sometimes trying interesting things out. If I get a crap comp, then I just set my sights on playing so hard that either we still pull off a win, or we do a hell of a fight and I often get games where the other team say things like, "that was a hell of a lot harder than it should have been, GG!"

If you only care about winning, go play ranked SR where it matters. ARAM is about doing your best realizing that there will be times the round will be completely stacked in your favor (you roll a Sona), or they are against you (you get stuck with Rek). You just try to do your best, learn and improve.