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@Meddler, can we talk about the state of Yorick?

Bherrias·2/25/2017, 8:39:01 PM·96 votes·5,649 views

Yorick was released back in September. Since then he's seen absolutely no play in professional games and is sitting at less than 2% pick rate in SoloQ. He has not received a single buff since his release and I haven't heard anyone saying anything about him.

Currently Yorick has a range of problems that are just completely unjustifiable. His ultimate's cooldown, for whatever reason, starts after the Maiden dies; yet Ivern's ultimate, which was released less than a month after Yorick, has a cooldown that starts after the ability is cast and not after Daisy dies and a lower overall cooldown. This causes the downtime on Yorick's ultimate to be far too high; especially since the point of the ability is that the Maiden lasts until killed.

Also, for whatever reason, his minions are programmed to die immediately after being basic attacked. Elise's spiderlings, Zyra's plants, Heimer's turrets etc. all have health bars that actually behave like health bars. Yorick's ghouls dying immediately after being basic attacked completely defeats the point of then having a health bar that scales with Yorick's maximum health in the first place; and good players know this and will take advantage of it so Yorick can hardly ever provide threat in lane.

I'd really like to see Riot address these issues; Yorick is one of the coolest champions with so much potential but is completely ruined by so many stupid "features" that aren't present on any other champion that has minions.

161 Comments

GigglesO2/25/2017, 11:54:58 PM29 votes

Welcome to the club of long forgotten champions.

Mordekaiser Vladimir Urgot Sion

BastionKross2/26/2017, 1:28:35 AM24 votes

As it turns out, giving a significant portion of a champion's damage to mentally challenged AI-controlled minions is not a good way to balance that champion.

Malzahar "Who could have seen that coming?"

Also, throw the guy a bone in RGM modes that don't have (m)any minions like Poro-King or Ascension. When Nasus laughs at your performance in a mode with no minions, you know you need help.

Nasus "I can at least build AP and be useful without farm, what are you going to do?" Yorick "Feed."

xWaters2/25/2017, 9:25:42 PM20 votes

I just want a %heal on his Q. The heal currently is very underwhelming.

ModKnightsKemplar2/25/2017, 8:44:04 PM19 votes

http://champion.gg/champion/Yorick

So... yorick is decently strong. You mention some parts of his kit that I could see being annoying, but if they buff him, he'll need nerfs somewhere else to keep him balanced.

As for the pro scene, Meddler stated that Yorick is a niche champ, and they don't evaluate success of a design by play percentage. He never has to see ranked play to be a good champ.

He doing quite well in the hands of people who play him often. Just because his minions and ult work a little differently than other champs doesn't really mean much, does it?

I mean, I'm up for discussing me being wrong here. But the stats and statements from Riot don't really corroborate your argument, imo.

SirLapse2/26/2017, 12:30:35 AM11 votes

I will definitely agree about the ultimate, because I hesitate to pop it despite it giving me such a huge advantage in a fight or duel just due to it not having a CD from cast. I'm more likely to use it when I'm closer to dead or about to get screwed because at least it'll be up again sooner when I need it.

I cannot agree about his minions however. When you're using Yorick's E in tandem with his minions, all you have to do is hold the lane until you find it proper to summon them and boom. You've likely gotten 20% or more of the enemy champion's HP in two abilities. Combine with Yorick's W and you really can guarantee that people will not be able to fight him 1v1 under normal scenarios. I've regularly seen Renektons knocked around by Yorick unless they know the matchup. If you use Yorick's ultimate, if you're in any minion wave whatsoever, you'll be the most broken champion in the game if their HP bars don't decay unless the enemy has waveclear (which not every comp will).

Yorick already goes positive 1v1 vs. Camille simply due to his troll wall. He can do this even vs. Fiora who you'd expect to not be affected, but all he has to do it cast it on himself whenever he expects the Fiora to go at him. If she popped ultimate for that then you've essentially made her waste it in one basic ability. Can trade Flash for Flash at that point or proceed to ult and kite back.

I'm inclined to say that Yorick's wall poses a balancing problem if his minions are ever truly scaling, so yeah. Minions don't need changing.

Niyumi2/26/2017, 4:12:38 AM6 votes

[{quoted}](name=GA Aviril,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kR2LIOVs,comment-id=,timestamp=2017-02-25T20:39:01.626+0000)

He has not received a single buff since his release and I haven't heard anyone saying anything about him.

That means he's more or less balanced. Who would have thought Riot could pull that one off? He has strengths and weaknesses, is fun, and has counterplay. Why does he need changes?

Currently Yorick has a range of problems that are just completely unjustifiable. His ultimate's cooldown, for whatever reason, starts after the Maiden dies; yet Ivern's ultimate, which was released less than a month after Yorick, has a cooldown that starts after the ability is cast and not after Daisy dies and a lower overall cooldown. This causes the downtime on Yorick's ultimate to be far too high; especially since the point of the ability is that the Maiden lasts until killed.

Ivern ult:

  • Limited range from Ivern

  • Has a timer

  • Doesn't do much damage outside of the knockup

Yorick ult:

  • Infinite range from Yorick

  • Auto creates ghouls from EVERY corpse that dies near it

  • Auto pushes a lane

  • Adds % max health damage to your attacks (you can solo herald, baron and even elder with it)

  • Has no set duration (lasts until it dies or you do)

  • Long range AAs from maiden

Can you see why Yorick's ult has a CD after it dies, and Ivern's doesn't?

Also, for whatever reason, his minions are programmed to die immediately after being basic attacked. Elise's spiderlings, Zyra's plants, Heimer's turrets etc. all have health bars that actually behave like health bars. Yorick's ghouls dying immediately after being basic attacked completely defeats the point of then having a health bar that scales with Yorick's maximum health in the first place; and good players know this and will take advantage of it so Yorick can hardly ever provide threat in lane.

Yorick's ghouls hit four times harder than any of those, minus Heimer turrets. If they had 1000 health and you EVER get hit by Yorick's E, you're literally automatically dead. They need some form of counterplay. Even though they die with one auto, you still out-trade people with them, since they can't kill them all at once.

I'd really like to see Riot address these issues; Yorick is one of the coolest champions with so much potential but is completely ruined by so many stupid "features" that aren't present on any other champion that has minions.

He's fine and doesn't need any changes. Just leave him as is.

Edit:

Here's a picture of me being rank 7 Yorick, to back up me saying he's fine (even broken).

http://i.imgur.com/2X9XE5t.jpg

CancerBasedGod2/25/2017, 8:43:17 PM5 votes

Yes, fix please.

US Red Cross2/27/2017, 5:35:15 AM5 votes

I was the happiest camper ever playing Yorick, he felt right, I could do something, I could fight Teemos as an AD character for once, I could stay in lane for a while and actually split push, I could help a carry who just died to help us finish the game.

Now I go top lane, I struggle to do anything until 6 because any top laner will make it hell to kill any minions especially with my Q and even if I do the cool down takes hours to get a 2nd or 3rd grave and by that time any top laner will harass me into recalling.

When I do reach level 6 and can actually fight the enemy top laner, what happens is A. They use an aoe ability to kill my ghouls, then kill the maiden quickly B. My maiden is fighting minions and moves so slow its just not viable to have her at all if she does help me in a fight C. The Enemy laner has an ultimate that doesn't take 4 years of extensive positioning to pull off and just kills me before my ult does anything D. I did it I got them trapped in my W and I E'd them I have all my minions on them, I go in for the Q and they flash and use a disengage then kill my ghouls making me wait 3 minutes to try and do that again, for a whole 3 minutes to just hopefully farm under tower

Another big complain it, Pentakill Yorick looks so badass but they didn't change his W AT ALL, It irks me so hard to see that ALL of his abilties turn into this cool orange then they just gave up on his W completely throwing off the color scheme, Its like changing Dunk Master Darius's Dunk ability into a slow pat.

Pros of Current Yorick -Can be useful in a really lucky situation -Is good for portable ZZ'rot portal Cons -Basically useless if you own any other split pusher, take your pick, Trynd, Olaf, Renekton, Sion

Pros of Old Yorick -Actually could split push -His ult actually helped the team -Had a lantern -Very fun for beginners in league -Had many different playstyles Cons -Very Mana dependant -Not good late game -Had bad visuals -Got a little boring

I can easily bet that 90% of old Yorick players don't like this clunky weak monk man and would much rather have ghoulfriend grave digger back.

PokladnicaZla2/26/2017, 12:06:31 PM4 votes

The only thing he really needs is his ¨Maiden of the Mist˝to be controllable and maybe the max.number of mist walkers to be increased at later lvls.

Overlord Forte2/27/2017, 7:18:08 AM4 votes

The main issue I feel is Yorick's kit is in a state that, even if he's winning, he isn't actually winning. He doesn't carry snowball forward, and he doesn't have a degree of useful utility (his wall has potential, the Maiden is useless for split pushing by herself). In situations he can pull something off in early game, he actually plays quite well with ups and downs. The problem is no amount of advantage translates into something tangible--every meta top laner will come to step on and invalidate him later in the mid/late game.

If there was a way of giving him more permanency with whatever gains he gets later on, I think he'd be in a good, working spot. The main issue I see is that he might become that 'unstoppable split pusher', even though that is literally his primary schtick. The second he loses the Maiden down a lane, he's lost a massive amount of agency in his decision making and a noticeable loss in power until she's available to summon again. So, either he pushes with her, or goes across the map elsewhere. Both situations end up putting him in a bad spot because he's not strong enough to merit one or the other. (The former means he gets ganked, so he has to abandon the Maiden. The latter means the Maiden isn't a tangible solo threat to turrets, so he has no reason to try and force attention away from her).

K7Insanity2/26/2017, 11:31:55 AM3 votes

To be fair, Yorick is still in a better spot than Vladimir, Mordekaiser and Vladimir. I would include Aatrox but he's getting some work done on him soon™.

Still, just like almost every other champion that isnt Jayce, he's having a really hard time surviving the lethality prostitution that is currently happening in league. If you dont have extreme mobility and a consistent CC train ( Irelia, Jax ) you're not going to be playable the way the game is currently going.

The ult is probably one of the dumbest things about Yorick. I get that it's intended as a powerful moment for him, but giving it such an outrageous cooldown when its already pretty weak outside a 1v1 situation is outright stupid. It feels like Riot is trying to put him into that "not really viable, but still barely playable for the most invested players in the community"-spot that Mordekaiser is currently in.

SweedishGunner2/25/2017, 9:50:57 PM2 votes

He went from being niche to being niche. What did you expect to happen? Overall he's probably more healthy now.

Ariel the Cruel2/26/2017, 10:05:17 AM2 votes

Try him support. It's not terrible. Not great, but not terrible.

Q - Sustain and stacks with relic. W - pseudo J4 ult on 15 second CD. E - non-scaling damage & slow, Pseudo vision (mark is visible even if target isn't). R - Banner of command.

He also fills the niche of an "AD support" that the forums were asking about not long ago.

Randomonium2/26/2017, 6:12:04 PM2 votes

I agree with the changes that should be made to his kit. However, a champion not being played on the pro scene does not mean that they are bad, it just means they are a niche champion. LCS teams are naturally going to devote their time to champions with a lot of flexibility.

MunchCrunchLunch2/25/2017, 9:33:30 PM2 votes

his ghouls are way stronger than malzahar voidlings or elise spiderlings. I've outtraded him multiple times. he runs away from me. and his ghouls do something like 900 damage to me early game.

hes strong as hell.

I hope riot aren't idiotic to even consider a yorick buff

Papa Andrei2/26/2017, 6:52:16 AM1 votes

Can we talk about why Yorick should be reverted utterly instead? that would be much better than some power shift.