Riot, reconsider that Lee Sin retune you came up with AND MAKE IT LIVE.

Ezreal Wright·Jan 20, 2015·184 votes·8,638 views

Here it is if you forgot it Riot.

Flurry • Attack Speed bonus increased to 40/60/80/100% (at levels 1/6/11/16) from 40% at all levels

Sonic Wave • Damage changed to 15/35/55/75/95 (+0.5/0.6/0.7/0.8/0.9 Total AD) from 50/80/110/140/170 (+0.9 Bonus AD)

Resonating Strike • Damage changed to 15/35/55/75/95 (+0.5/0.6/0.7/0.8/0.9 Total AD) from 50/80/110/140/170 (+0.9 Bonus AD) • Now deals up to 50% bonus damage (150% total damage) based on the target’s missing Health instead of 8% of the target’s missing Health

Safeguard • Cost increased to 100 from 50 • Cost is now reduced by 50% if cast on an allied champion (including self)

Tempest • Damage changed to 25/50/75/10/125 (+0.6 total AD) from 60/95/130/165/200 (+1.0 Bonus AD) • Now deals physical damage instead of magic

Dragon’s Rage • Damage changed to 50/150/250 (+0.75/0.875/1.0 Total AD) from 200/400/600 (+2.0 Bonus AD) • For each enemies target collide with would make target take 25/75/125 (+0.375/0.4375/0.5 Total AD) extra damage"

Riot please. It was perfect. Don't listen to these filthy Lee Sin mains. Please apply this retune. I'm so tired of seeing Lee Sins in every single fucking game because he's the perfect jungler everybody wants.

180 Comments

VaurenJan 20, 201563 votes

I thought the whole reason they didn't nerf Lee Sin was because of the overwhelming community backlash against it? And now they are having an overwhelming community push to nerf Lee Sin. If I were in Riot's shoes I'd be confused as heck at the moment.

I'm all for nerfing/tuning him a bit myself though.

MrBuffingtonJan 20, 201519 votes

Apparently (as I learned in another thread) there is a huge Lee Sin community overseas and the backlash was severe, like far, far worse than anything on NA. This is all hear-say though, so I can't say for certain.

I'd rather they just rework him into being less of a generalist. Like, keep his ability to make plays or whatever but remove some of the random, unnecessary stuff from his kit. Make Lee Sin still fun to play for his players but make him really have to work to get anything done; maybe make the rewards higher for his successful play but make it really difficult for him to be successful, so plays actually are highlight worthy instead of just another run of the mill inSec. Also just give him more of a niche so he isn't always a good pick, idk something like making him basically incapable of farming jungle early and forcing him to gank to do anything in the game, so if the enemy team is just playing safe champions Lee Sin can't do anything or has to play super, super risky to do anything (I think Shaco is kind of like this? Not the incapable of farming part; he's actually quite good at that, but the need to gank early or become irrelevant later)

Ezreal WrightJan 20, 201515 votes

{quoted}

Apparently (as I learned in another thread) there is a huge Lee Sin community overseas and the backlash was severe, like far, far worse than anything on NA. This is all hear-say though, so I can't say for certain.

I'd rather they just rework him into being less of a generalist. Like, keep his ability to make plays or whatever but remove some of the random, unnecessary stuff from his kit. Make Lee Sin still fun to play for his players but make him really have to work to get anything done; maybe make the rewards higher for his successful play but make it really difficult for him to be successful, so plays actually are highlight worthy instead of just another run of the mill inSec. Also just give him more of a niche so he isn't always a good pick, idk something like making him basically incapable of farming jungle early and forcing him to gank to do anything in the game, so if the enemy team is just playing safe champions Lee Sin can't do anything or has to play super, super risky to do anything (I think Shaco is kind of like this? Not the incapable of farming part; he's actually quite good at that, but the need to gank early or become irrelevant later)

Yes, that Lee Sin community is called Reddit, the cry babies who reverted Lee Sin's retune.

MrBuffingtonJan 20, 20155 votes

Oh, I heard some overseas communities had some pretty severe backlash as well

OneriosJan 20, 20157 votes

I would not put the blame totally on Reddit, there are enough complaints about him there.

Champion SkinJan 20, 20158 votes

Well with the mobility he has they could possibly at least lower his movement speed from 350 as that is a bit high given his mobility

TheI3igDaddyJan 20, 20154 votes

By overseas, do you mean South Korea? Or everyone else like Europe, Australia, etc?

I mean, Riot's shown already that they're perfectly fine doing reworks that fanbases don't really like, but the fact that they* aren't touching Lee Sin is just absurd.

MrBuffingtonJan 20, 20153 votes

I was being vague on purpose since I honestly don't know; the person I heard this from wasn't certain on the region so I didn't want to mention anything because I want to avoid spreading too many rumors. And the way they said "it wasn't well received" made me think like, Riot was getting legitimate death threats or something crazy like that (again, I don't have first hand experience on this, but this would be my guess; Lee Sin has some pretty die hard fans).

Some Reds have mentioned elsewhere that they do want to look at Lee Sin a bit more (others say they can't touch him; maybe it's just concerns if they actually were threatened, I don't know; it generally seems to be a pretty touchy topic); I'm generally in favor of a rework that emphasizes his strengths and gives him some real weakness.

(A little tangent: The problem I see with Riot's retune OP brings up is that it just seems like across-the-board nerfs, which I don't think Lee Sin needs; as much as people might love to see him gutted (I think everyone has champions they want to see gutted or removed from the game), realistically if they're trying to bring him into balance, they need to give him a niche. Something where he excels at this certain area or playstyle, and crucially, is weak in other areas and has ways to counterplay, etc. On a scale of 10, Lee Sin is like a 8 or 9 in a few areas, but then like a 6 in almost everything else, where most [balanced] champions are like, 9 or 10 in a some areas, a ~5-7 in most areas, and then 2 or 3 in a few other areas, or something like that. My interpretation is that Lee Sin isn't across-the-board overpowered, or arguably at all, he just lacks weaknesses like other champions have)

I do think Riot will rework Lee Sin eventually, but atm there are more pressing issues (Urgot, Yorick, etc) that I personally would rather they finish first, since there's a pretty hefty backlog of champions that (imo) more urgently need work, especially with stuff that comes up (removal of DFG requiring a lot of light mage/assassin reworks, for example)

TheI3igDaddyJan 20, 20153 votes

I'm just really eager to see Lee Sin soft-reworked to get Rek'Sai's tremor sense, but permanently. Lower his field of view to like auto-attack range, and have Tempest and Sonic Wave reveal all who are hit by it for the duration of the spell. With his current numbers, I actually feel like he may balanced in this state.

MrBuffingtonJan 20, 20152 votes

Lol it'd be interesting, that's for sure. I don't think Rek'Sai's tremor sense is as much of a disability as you think it is, though; she can 'see' over walls; it's super powerful. Especially on Lee Sin since he's carrying a Sightstone to ward jump anyways, plus he'll have two ways of gaining vision instead of just Rek'Sai's burrowed Q.

TheI3igDaddyJan 20, 20152 votes

Honestly I just want ward-hopping to be removed; I thought Riot didn't intentionally create it, but the Kat/ Jax / Lee players loved it and wanted it to stay in the game.

MrBuffingtonJan 20, 20152 votes

Dunno, I think ward hopping is pretty cool too (before you check, no I don't particularly play Jax, Kat, or Lee, nor am I personally particularly good at ward jumping). I'd rather have that than just more skillshot dashes or something.

TheI3igDaddyJan 20, 20153 votes

The big reason I hate it now is due to trinkets and Sightstones. Now these three champions have a free flash as long as their trinket's up, or in Lee's case when buying Sightstone, he has like 4 charges he can use to instantly jump where he wants, including behind you in order to kick you away from your turret.

MrBuffingtonJan 20, 20151 votes

That's true, especially with how cheap the trinket upgrade is now (gives you a ward every 60 seconds). I still think it's a pretty cool think to have in the game, maybe it's unbalanced, who knows, I'm not a Red or anything, lol.

JefftiffyJan 20, 20151 votes

{quoted}

That's true, especially with how cheap the trinket upgrade is now (gives you a ward every 60 seconds). I still think it's a pretty cool think to have in the game, maybe it's unbalanced, who knows, I'm not a Red or anything, lol.

It kind of is unbalanced especially because blue has always been under powered and the Reds ignore that every patch. How long until they realize its league of Yellow trinket vs. Red trinket. Why? Because under what situation does a ward do less for you than a blue? Only for chasing and that's about it.

MrBuffingtonJan 20, 20155 votes

Blue trinket is actually the preferred mid-late game trinket for ADCs and certain mid laners in pro play; imls also thinks junglers should get it as well. You can buy green wards and pink wards or smite wolves/raptors or kill scuttlecrab to gain/deny vision over certain areas, but not many items (especially inexpensive and universally accessible items) give the same effect as blue trinket (sure, twin shadows can give arguably better vision, but you can't buy that on an ADC).

AlorasenceJan 20, 20154 votes

There was community backlash because those changes were stupid.

He needs nerfed badly though.

bahamutkaiserJan 21, 20154 votes

With millions of players, every subject is going to have a huge amount of supporters and objectors... Riot just picks and chooses which ones to validate, and which problems to fix.

Long Dong WukongJan 20, 201523 votes

A boy can dream, but good luck getting them to nerf Lee Sin. He is the king, others are nerfed to stay beneath him.

DrogmyreJan 20, 201521 votes

If Riot was interested in actually balancing their game they'd do this.

BrothaJan 20, 201511 votes

Those nerfs completely destroyed Lee Sin hence why multiple LCS players spoke out against them. They weren't fair and the only people who wanted them were people who want Lee to be effectively deleted.

If Riot really wanted to balance Lee Sin they would:

Punish Lee for missing his Q. Give it a high energy cost early game with a passive energy refund on the resonate portion if you're resonating to an enemy champion.
Revert the nerfs on his W to allow him to dash around minions. This nerf did nothing to Lee in the jungle but really hurt Top Lee which was never a problem.

Instead completely remove the free spellvamp Lee get's from the 2nd portion of his W. This would hurt Lee's sustain in the jungle making him more susceptible to enemy invades. Also hurts his counter jungling as he will be lower from camps.

Revert Nerf on E, return the attack speed debuff as it was a utility debuff with a short duration. Again, hurt top Lee and didn't touch jungle Lee.
Give Lee Sin's ultimate a meaningful cooldown. The problem with Lee lategame is that his ultimate is ALWAYS up. With 30% cdr his ultimate is a meager 39 seconds. Granted I don't feel it should be a Garen length cooldown but I do not see why such a powerful early game ultimate should not share the same cooldown as an ultimate like Nautilus or Malphite. Lee needs to use his ultimate WISELY not just kick bitches in the chin whenever he wants cause fuck you.

Ezreal WrightJan 21, 20155 votes

{quoted}

Those nerfs completely destroyed Lee Sin hence why multiple LCS players spoke out against them. They weren't fair and the only people who wanted them were people who want Lee to be effectively deleted.

If Riot really wanted to balance Lee Sin they would:

Punish Lee for missing his Q. Give it a high energy cost early game with a passive energy refund on the resonate portion if you're resonating to an enemy champion.

Revert the nerfs on his W to allow him to dash around minions. This nerf did nothing to Lee in the jungle but really hurt Top Lee which was never a problem.

Instead completely remove the free spellvamp Lee get's from the 2nd portion of his W. This would hurt Lee's sustain in the jungle making him more susceptible to enemy invades. Also hurts his counter jungling as he will be lower from camps.

Revert Nerf on E, return the attack speed debuff as it was a utility debuff with a short duration. Again, hurt top Lee and didn't touch jungle Lee.

Give Lee Sin's ultimate a meaningful cooldown. The problem with Lee lategame is that his ultimate is ALWAYS up. With 30% cdr his ultimate is a meager 39 seconds. Granted I don't feel it should be a Garen length cooldown but I do not see why such a powerful early game ultimate should not share the same cooldown as an ultimate like Nautilus or Malphite. Lee needs to use his ultimate WISELY not just kick bitches in the chin whenever he wants cause fuck you.

That would be nice. Or, I would give it a much higher cooldown at later ranks, making him vulnerable if he misses it.
No, that was justified. 7 seconds cooldown before CDR 600 range dash on any allied minion is just crazy.
No no no no, never never never. Attack speed slow on Lee Sin is just way too overloaded for me. Impossibke to fight back early game and it's AoE, so late game, he just needs to press E in the middle on the fight to automatically win? No. Even on Top Lee Sin. Why would you give such dueling power to a champion with extreme mobility, extreme early game dominance, extreme sustain, extreme wave-clear, extreme utility and extreme damage?
Yes. That ult's cooldown is just way too short. I think something like 115/100/85 seconds seems something fair for him.

DokuseiJan 20, 20158 votes

ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ Daily reminder to keep this thread going starts now

Sightless66Jan 20, 20158 votes

No. Fuck that change. Fuck making the attack speed on his passive the core mechanic of the kit. Fuck removing the insec kick by majorly increasing the energy costs on the jump. Fuck the stupid "you have to kick half their team to make anyone take any damage" mechanic. Fuck the stupid total AD focus and the "smoothing his power curve" generic bullshit it brings. Fuck. That. Kit. It's terrible. It's one of the worst design abominations Riot ever shat out.

Lee Sin needs nerfs, and he's needed them for a while, but he doesn't need his entire playstyle gutted and left to die. We should not argue for Riot to Olaf champions anymore. It's never been a good thing for the game, and killing Lee Sin wouldn't be good either, no matter how much you hate him. We can nerf him without implementing this terrible fucking design. There is no reason to get attached to such a horrible rework proposal when any random Boards member could come up with a better one.

JefftiffyJan 20, 20158 votes

The problem with this "retune" its a complete damage gut with no compensation. Its not a "retune" you are claiming its readjusting him instead of straight up nerfing him. Lee cannot operate without an early game. Take away the only part of the game he has and it's gg. I mean I can counter jungle him with Gragas at level 2, what's so hard about dealing with him?

Lee Sin is just very flexible he has no strengths outside of early game. If he doesn't snowball he fails. His late game is pretty garbage if you have a normal team comp and your bruisers actually peel him. Making Lee do AS is not only weird, it just doesn't work on bruisers. Bruisers are not DPS, that is what the ADC and mages are for.

Yes this isn't a retune. Average base AD at 18 is 100. So adding in base AD does nothing to make up for the 100ish lost damage and makes him lose the only thing keeping him viable early game. And making his safeguard cost half his energy... just lol. And on top of this gutting his tempest damage and making it magic. All of this for an extra 60% AS at 18 where he has already lost over 400 damage in an average rotation.

Riot threw this away for a reason. It wasn't just a nerf. It was taking Lee from one of the best spots in the game to Urgot tier in one update. I would prefer they stick with the slow steady nerfs than the "NERF CANNON GO" attitude players have.

Kobila2000Jan 21, 20153 votes

Um, Shyv, Rek'Sai, Udyr, Olaf, Trundle, WW, Skarner, Nocturne? lol there most definitively are bruisers that rely on dps. Curiously, plenty of those bruisers also tend to be in a bad spot in the League of Mobility. Mages are also divided by dps and burst. Orianna is dps, Annie is not.

AltricadJan 21, 20157 votes

I hope you're all misunderstanding how total AD works...

At level 1, let's say lee sin has 60 AD ( no bonus AD from masteries), comparing it to when it's based on bonus AD.

Sonic Wave/Resonating Strike ( accounting that lee has 60 AD and doesn't get even a single bonus AD) 15/25/55/75/95( +.5/.6/.7/.8/.9) -> 45/71/97/123/149 ( total overall damage)

Srsly, if you're going to argue that ~16 damage is going to break or make lee sin, then this champion should be disabled right away.

The numbers may seem scary, but this nerf technically makes it so that if lee sin gets 1 kill, he doesn't instagib you with his stupid bonus AD ratios, And that late game, he can ACTUALLY duel someone ( 100% attack speed is goooood)

You know, Zed 's full rotation at level 3 has a bonus ratio of 2.3 Bonus AD. Talon has 2.7 Bonus AD at level 3. Lee on the other hand, has a 2.8 Bonus AD with a 8% missing health execute. Wtf? Plus some of it is magic damage. Which other early game jungler has an AD scaling magic damage?

JarvanIV Khazix Pantheon none of them have an AD scaling magic damage

This reminds me of when people said Khazix 's level 3 damage was stupid and he could easily kill anyone in the jungle. But yeah, Riot decided to smash him with the nerf bat repeatedly. Reason being Kha scales well into late ( which is true), but an HIGH threat early game champion that is UNCATCHABLE needs a compensation.

let's look at Shaco , a champion that either carries or feeds based on his early game. Shaco is as slippery as lee and has enough in his kit to counter jungle, but let's look at Shaco's late. it's pure garbage and people are forced to splitpush with him as he has no usefull cc in teamfights. ANd lee? CC, LOADS of CC, and a teamfight disrupting ulti.

This makes it so that lee becomes one of two things

1 . So, either LeeSin has to fall off, A LOT more, than he currently does i.e Shaco level ( pls don't do dis riot )

gets a smoother transition, so that he doesn't become overbearing with just 1 kill.

Don't get me wrong, LeeSin 's kit is really fun, it's unique and I LOVE his backstory! Even Morello said it, that his kit is totally fine and that his damage is just plain stupid. Morello also said the reason Lee wasn't being nerfed was because of other annoying early game junglers cough Elise cough. Well, now it's Lee's time. This change HAS to go through

I'd rather have Lee go a smoother transition and be much more use in late than have a totally uncontrollable early.

fr15ky2xJan 20, 20155 votes

Bring on the down votes I know I will get them. Lee's balance is fine, he has such a high skill cap to compensate for it; if you miss your q you missed your gank, if you can't string AA in between your abilities you have pretty much wasted his passive. You kick the wrong way and you have just cost your team a kill or got your ADC shredded. Yeah he is very dominate in the early game but outside of that a lot of jungle champs scale better than him. I think it is mostly a mind set people see a lee on the other team and its immediately "gg guys they have lee" and everyone plays like crap. I have seen plenty of lee's get rekt in games. Instead of just nerfing a champ because he beats you try to figure out a way to beat them be creative instead of looking for riot to solve all your problems by gutting a champs kit.

Ulquiorra995Jan 20, 20159 votes

{quoted}

Bring on the down votes I know I will get them. Lee's balance is fine, he has such a high skill cap to compensate for it; if you miss your q you just use your absurd MS and ward hop to catch up anyway, if you can't string AA in between your abilities you have pretty much wasted his passive which he does not need in 90% of situations because of high-damage low-cost skills. You kick the wrong way and you have just cost your team a kill or got your ADC shredded. Yeah he is very dominate in the early game but outside of that a lot of jungle champs scale better than him in damage, because mobility and CC never fall off. I think it is mostly a mind set people see a lee on the other team and its immediately "gg guys they have lee" and everyone plays like crap. I have seen plenty of lee's get rekt in games, I've also seen Zed and old Lucian get rekt, they must be balanced too. Instead of just nerfing a champ because he beats you try to figure out a way to beat them be creative instead of looking for riot to solve all your problems by gutting a champs kit, being creative will surely help agains a champ who has literally everything.

Fixed that for you.

Spacesuit SpiffJan 20, 20154 votes

Lois: Lee Sin is OP crowd cheers Lee Sin crowd cheers Leeeeeeee crowd holds breath Sinnnnn crowd cheers

Sirin GioroJan 20, 20154 votes

Inb4 every high ELO Lee Sin mains suffer huge LP deficit

+999999999999999

Kobila2000Jan 21, 20151 votes

Yeah, I find it funny how ridiculously often I see Lee Sin in the "most played" section of high elo players' account.

MetalrichdogJan 20, 20153 votes

I'm not a Lee Sin main, but I can already say that these changes would break the champ pretty badly. Hell, if I were in Riot's position I'd nerf his base damage at higher levels, but keep his lower level base damage pretty much the same. This in turn causes Lee Sin to really rally his early game damage, otherwise he'll become far less useful later in the game. In my opinion, Lee Sin should be an early game jungler, but with his current snowballing power and scalings, he kind of becomes oppressive if he gets a lead or builds largely into damage

lvl 2 lagspikeJan 21, 20153 votes

LOL are you serious? You literally GUT every single one of his abilities for a small pathetic buff on his passive? There are much more unbalanced champ in the game right now.

Lee was nerfed so many times, little by little riot keep nerfing him and you ppl still whine about him. He is already sitting at ~45% winrate...

AltricadJan 21, 20155 votes

Zed is at ~48 win rate. Do we buff him?

Duchess of DeerJan 21, 20153 votes

No offense i don't play lee sin but these changes are really harsh i personally don't find him that trouble some they juts need to tone down his damage and utility a bit

AshleyTheNekoJan 20, 20152 votes

So you're telling me, Riot thought Lee Sin deserved such huge damage nerfs, yet they let him remain so blatantly overpowered because the community didn't what it?

What

The

Fuck

Isn't the community now begging for him to be nerfed?

Sightless66Jan 20, 20156 votes

The community was begging for him to be nerfed then too. Then, Riot showed this kit. All of the memories of Olaf and Eve and Urgot came flooding back, and people got kind of pissed that Riot was looking to do it again. As it turns out, people don't have fond memories of all the times Riot has blatantly overnerfed someone and left them to rot, so they weren't exactly ecstatic that it was happening again.

G0ONJan 20, 20152 votes

Okay, nerf his base movement speed? Its perfectly fine. Everyone wants to nerf Lee because he is optimal for the new jungle. Really annoying how junglers complained about being ganked by lee sin or just common or good junglers in general. That's a junglers job, to gank. Yes its annoying lee sin can gank like a god but isnt it your job to counter pick and maybe pick a laner that's harder to gank such as zed? So before you post about nuking a champion or retunes can you consider a way to stop him... mobility and being able to escape a gank... besides, most lee sins arent very good mechanically.

APrinnyDoodJan 20, 20157 votes

Well, the problem is that the jungler can pick Lee Sin and give up almost nothing even if I pick someone who is very hard to gank, but if I ever dare to pick something that isn't great against Lee Sin, he'll fucking destroy me. He completely removes a large number of laning options, but there is nothing I can pick that similarly threatens him. He's the best ganker while also being the best generalist. He gives up almost nothing for his strengths. That's the problem. He does too much. He has very minimal weaknesses. He needs nerfs, and a nerf to his movement speed would be fitting because there is no reason why one of the most mobile champions in the game also needs to have one of the highest movement speeds in the game. Lower it, and you'd open up a greater window to punish him when he failed a gank, you'd give people more reaction time when he ganked, you'd nerf his insane chasing, etc. It's a great option.

FantasySniperJan 21, 20152 votes

He was always optimal for the jungle.

straight4freeJan 22, 20152 votes

"Isn't it your job to always be afraid of Lee Sin and never play anything that Lee Sin can kill?"

Yeah, sorry.

Gut him.

The Bard DogJan 21, 20152 votes

i'm all for nerfing lee sin, but this is just absolutely terrible. this would gut him and put him at urgot tier. his jungle clear? now trash. his ganks? trashier. his ultility in a fight? trash.

BorblandJan 21, 20152 votes

Yes, this changes are great, i just can't imagine why they haven't implant that yet. The ult changes just makes Lee Sin alot more intresting, it's like playing Bowling.

LeeSin : Strike ! New highscore !

BlackRavenJan 21, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Yes, this changes are great, i just can't imagine why they haven't implant that yet. The ult changes just makes Lee Sin alot more intresting, it's like playing Bowling.

: Strike ! New highscore !

kk i got some changes for orianna.

how about, her q takes 5 seconds longer to reach the destination, but does 10 more damage her w takes 20 seconds to give the movement speed buff, then it would give a bonus 5 second ms boost her e shields after 10 seconds, but then shields for 20 extra damage her ulti takes a minute to wind up, then does 10 extra damage her passive takes 2 seconds longer with the aa, then does 5 more damage

as an ori fan "i believe these changes will make ori more interesting". "its like playing the waiting game!!!!! xdd AYYY LMAO"

NielarkenJan 22, 20152 votes

By your name I can tell your a lee sin main anyways, no that wouldnt be the same because Orianna relies on her ball to cast all of her spells where as lee does not rely on energy for all of his spells now if your saying your ok with lee only being able to cast any of his skills on a target he hit with sound wave then ok lets change orianna too.

BlackRavenJan 22, 20151 votes

{quoted}

By your name I can tell your a lee sin main anyways, no that wouldnt be the same because Orianna relies on her ball to cast all of her spells where as lee does not rely on energy for all of his spells now if your saying your ok with lee only being able to cast any of his skills on a target he hit with sound wave then ok lets change orianna too.

wow how smart are you? also lee relies on his shit landing, he doesnt miss q then just appear behind you. ori can sit in the back and gets free harass off. her ulti requires no brain cells to execute as you ball ur tank and wait to mash r. ori is one of the best mid laners as lee is one of the best junglers. if lee is getting nerfs, then ori is getting nerfs.

NielarkenJan 22, 20153 votes

"he doesnt miss q then just appear behind you." your right because its not like he can jump to war... oh wait. "ulti requires no brain cells to execute" so your telling me that you walking up to anyone with leejust smash R with a targeted skill takes brain cells? but a skill shot that relys on the placement of your other skill shot doesn't?

AFK PushJan 21, 20152 votes

I hate lee sin too, but wouldn't this nerf make him unplayable? Sure the ratios are the same but from 200 to 50, 600 to 200, etc. I feel like even his early game would be crap. I understand nerfing late game, but he is supposed to be an early game champ.

VovixJan 22, 20152 votes

Really? When these planned changes were revealed, everyone complained. Now we're complaining about those changes NOT being implemented?