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Do I Just not Understand Support, or What?

DoYouEvenPurr·6/28/2015, 6:57:56 PM·3 votes·985 views

TL;DR at the bottom

So, I play a lot of Morgana/Sona support. I love playing Jinx, but support is usually what we need, so I fill for it. But perhaps I misunderstood what support is. I played Jinx for the first time in a while since I've been filling support so much. I got this Diamond Thresh. I looked up his lolNexus, his KDA and wins/losses ratio was pretty good. In game, his warding was ok, his hooks were pretty good, and his positioning was great. But he didn't back off from kills at all. Even if I was right next to him, he'd go for the kill. The first two times that it would have been an easy kill for me and he took it, I didn't say anything except gj. At that point he was 3/0 and I was 2/0. Then, he left. Just left without a single word and took off for an extended stay in mid. My lane got pushed and when I asked where was my support, he's all like, "Doing work on the other side of the map. Got a problem with that?" Ok. It was just a question dude, wtf was with that response. Still, I kept my mouth shut and just kept trying to keep bot turret from dying. Well, of course, they finally kill it and only then does Thresh come back. I'm still not saying anything about him just leaving me like that when we push them back and kill their sup. We're right under their turret, their adc running away with 1 bar of health and I ult her dead on. Thresh flashes in and takes the kill after I've ulted. WTF. So, I call him on it. I ask him why he keeps taking kills from me as a support. He says sh--stuff about how he worked his way up to diamond as a sup/adc main and why am I complaining, he's doing all the work. I'm like, dude, you're 5/0/6 and I'm 2/0/3. You had almost 20 cs 15 minutes into the game (more than I have late-game when I sup, usually), and you keep leaving me. You're not Bard. I can't pull them in myself, and I can't 2v1 when you keep taking my kills. If I'm underfed, I can't do anything late game because I won't have the items. Well, not only does Thresh start quite maturely (sarcasm) calling me a whiny baby, 2 of the other ppl on our teams are all like, stfu, it's only a game, it's not even ranked, and just be grateful he's helping you at all, you wouldn't have any kills if he wasn't there. Yes, I wouldn't have kills if my support wasn't helping. More likely, I'd be dead a few times over, trying to 2v1 early game. And yes, it's just a game and just a normal (excuse me for taking normals seriously since I don't play ranked). But that's not the point. That is the support's JOB. I mean, if jungle were to go around taking cs from lanes, not taking jungle camps and not ganking, he wouldn't be doing his JOB and people would have a fit. But a support that is warding and helping lanes, but keeps wandering and ksing? Apparently, that isn't a problem. Subsequently to say, as soon as it came time for team fights, I had nothing. I barely had an IE, much less a Static Shiv or a Last Whisper. So, I couldn't do the damage an ADC needs to do during team fights and we were crushed. At the end of the game, I left lobby without a word because I just wanted to start cursing at all of them. A minute later, a pop up appears on my LoL with a warning about my "behavior". Seriously. So, if someone tells you that the way you're playing isn't going to help your team win, they're verbally abusing you, harassing you, and/or have a negative attitude? It's annoying shit like this that takes the enjoyment out of league. This is a team game, yet players only care about their own KDA and troll if it isn't a ranked (confirmed by every ranked player I've asked, so about 20ish players and heck, even ranked has way too many trolls as well). So, is my idea of support wrong or something? Is support not supposed to ward, peel, and help feed the adc, taking kills only when the adc can't get them?

TL;DR Sup Thresh kept clearly ksing me (I was Jinx) and leaving lane for mid. Didn't say anything about it until the 3rd time this happened when I ULTED for the kill right next to him and he flashed in to take it instead. I called him on it. Lots of badgering and stfu's and such by my teammates ensued, we lost, I was reported for negative attitude. Was I wrong to think that support's JOB is to ward, peel, and help feed the adc, taking kills only when the adc can't get them so they have damage for team fights later in the game?

23 Comments

IcyPepper6/28/2015, 7:05:43 PM4 votes

Eh... I mean, at least assists give gold. Your job is to farm up, your playstyle shouldn't be heavily kill reliant as the adc. Does that justify him taking kills? Not a whole lot, he should only take kills when he's sure you can't, or in the heat of the moment. Not purposely.

Then, he left. Just left without a single word and took off for an extended stay in mid. My lane got pushed and when I asked where was my support, he's all like, "Doing work on the other side of the map. Got a problem with that?"

I do want to mention something, though. His response was quite rude, but he does have a point. He's not your support, he's the team's support. Supports roam, they can't always stay with you. You got to be able to hold a lane on your own for a few minutes. Doesn't justify his... well he seemed like an ass all game anyway, but point being supports roam and belong to the team not the adc. Not sure if you knew that, but I thought I could put it in more polite terms than that Thresh did.

Vicvictorw6/28/2015, 7:32:41 PM4 votes

KSing isn't a thing. As an ADC, your income is mainly going to come from your CS, and the team as a whole can only benefit from the support getting kills.

I like it when my support gets kills. They get gold for their build, and I can farm freely if the enemy is dead.

Nicorus 6/28/2015, 8:12:02 PM2 votes

I main Bard support, now the issue with support champs in this meta is what is their role mid to late game? utility is great, the slows and the movement buffs help out a lot however if you're always chasing down a tank then this puts you into a situation where you can get ambushed since you're broadcasting what you're doing to everyone. Most supports role is to be the engage in a team fight I believe. specifically thresh, blitz, bard, leona, braum, and taric. this requires to be successful to be rather tanky. you can build a lot of utility with defensive items, and use those items in unique ways to benefit your team. these items cost money, but I believe a tanky utility support late game requires a few kills early game so that mid game you have enough health to be relevant in team fights. A supports main function early game however I believe is to be in bot lane attempting to disrupt the enemy adc from acquiring cs. But its all about team work, and if someone is being rude then it kinda kills it for everyone.

Abyssphere6/28/2015, 7:46:04 PM2 votes

I'm sorry you had a bad experience and I do think you're in the right.

Supporting isn't just for the ADC's benefit, no, but it is possible to progress too soon from being your ADC's support to being your team's support and you do need to make sure you're on the same page with your ADC here. Particularly if the enemy support is still with their ADC it's often not appropriate to leave - ADCs are not competent in 1v2 scenarios, at best they just try to farm from afar and not die. There's also nobody on the team more important to have doing well, so a support should never actively suppress the gold income of their ADC (by putting them in a 1v2 situation which forces CS loss and removes all potential of getting kills) even if it's helping another champion, like their mid laner.

I play support more than anything and I really don't enjoy the ADC role but a core skill of being a support is knowing when the appropriate time to roam is. If your ADC will be massively handicapped by you not being present... that's the single worst time you can leave lane. People have this misconception that supports are just a luxury for ADCs and they should be grateful for any help they get but while you absolutely should be grateful for your support, it's not like we support out of the kindness of our hearts. We support ADCs not because ADC players are bad and need someone to hold their hand, but because ADCs are a weak early class that has a TREMENDOUS pay off in the late game should you get them ahead. Throwing them to the wolves because "nobody else gets a support" shows a lack of understanding about why ADCs get supports in the first place.

Also final point: KSing is silly. I feel like that guy didn't actually feel like supporting in that game and just wanted a nice score for himself. Securing kills is fine but if there's no doubt at all that your ADC will get the kill there's just no reason to. Thresh doesn't need gold to function, Jinx does.

khorney6/28/2015, 7:00:15 PM1 votes

Maybe they couldn't be helped. I mean if I play zil or vel supp if I get it great . so your compl about that I had a naut supp like 2 games ago and I was adc and he refused to ward at all and I couldn't push for lack of vision

EvilRabbitt6/28/2015, 10:25:57 PM1 votes

And this is why some people should never support. A support is defined by having kit that still pulls it's weight without any items. Thresh did not need kills, what he did was improper, and the report method is a joke. Unless you cursed or trolled, which I assume you did not, then you are the victim in the verbal exchange. Last bit, if he was truly diamond then he would know his damage, your damage, have full awareness of everything in lane, and understand the unspoken law between supports and adc. Sounds like he only knew his damage. My assumption? He got carried pretty hard. Sorry if my post was rude, but this is one of the reasons I vacated bot lane. It's like being in a prison down there. Wish you better luck, friend.

Dreadlocks6/28/2015, 7:02:00 PM1 votes

Another thread where the OP guy knows he is right and just wants to feel good about getting his ass chewed out in his last game.. EVERYONE KNOWS the ADC is suppose to get fed and the support is the guy who sets it up. (or helps) unless the kill is unreachable or their is a chance the enemy could live, then its safe for the support to take it.

Sightless666/28/2015, 8:29:21 PM1 votes

But he didn't back off from kills at all. Even if I was right next to him, he'd go for the kill.

This is perfectly fine. The risk of losing a kill, no matter how small that risk is, is much, much worse than the cost of him getting a kill. The team is still getting the same amount of gold if he picks up the kill instead of you, and it's not like he can't make use of gold just by virtue of being a support. He still uses that gold just fine. An earlier sightstone/mobi boots never hurt the team. It might technically be a bit better if the ADC gets the kills, but in practice the risk of missing a kill just outweighs that so much that it is rarely worth bothering with, no matter how guaranteed the kill seems. I always favor ensuring the enemy dies, so long as I don't burn any unnecessary resources to make sure they die.

Then, he left. Just left without a single word and took off for an extended stay in mid. My lane got pushed and when I asked where was my support, he's all like, "Doing work on the other side of the map. Got a problem with that?"

While that was unnecessarily hostile of him, it is kind of something he should be doing in some situations. Roaming can be very, very valuable for supports. If you can put pressure on mid, you can possibly set up kills for the midlaner, open up opportunities for dragon or the mid turret, possibly give them openings to roam, etc. That said, roaming from a support is pretty dependent on being able to make opportunities without costing your ADC much in farm. If you were getting zoned because he was gone for an extended period, it may not have been the best time for it. Depends on what he got in return. Still though, assuming he was doing it well, supporting the team and roaming can make for very, very strong plays.

Nameless Voice6/28/2015, 10:06:41 PM1 votes

I've had enemies get away far too often while playing support when I could have killed them but tried to give the kill to someone else.

No. Never again. If I'm fighting as support, I am aiming to kill the enemy unless it's absolutely 100%-guaranteed that the ADC will get it. Not if it's only 90% certain, but 100%.

As the support, you are giving up (nearly) all CS to your ADC to help them get their items faster. The ADC's main source of income is the gold from minion kills. If the enemy laner is dead, your ADC gets free farm to earn more money and XP, which is far more important than the 150g they lose from getting an assist instead of a kill.

ADC getting the kill is ideal. Anyone else getting it is still good and a plus for the team. A fed support is slightly less useful than a fed ADC, but they still benefit from the gold and can use it to the benefit of their team (either with earlier support items, more AP for heals/shields/poke, or more tankiness to help them survive to initiate or peel.)