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The Current State of ADC's within the meta

Spinning Axes·4/21/2018, 2:08:21 AM·6 votes·2,059 views

Currently a diamond 5 (ish) level ADC main, and whenever I lurk these boards I see a lot of people complaining about the state of the game in regards to ADC's.

My question to all of you: Where would you like to see ADC's place in the meta? A lot of the complaints that I see is that ADC's do too much damage, and they have too much influence on the game. You can look at almost any game with a ranged dps class, they will be the damage dealers and without them, you're going to have a bad time.

Let's take a look at what the current ADC meta is, but first...

To blame ADC's and to call all ADC players crybabies when our role gets nerfed isn't really going to fix the issue. Before we can move forward to begin fixing the issue of ADC's, we have to first agree on a couple of things:

  1. It's an ADC's job to deal damage. They build almost only damage, they should have the opportunity to outdamage most champions in the game. Example: A Vayne who built Infinity Edge, Statikk, Rapid Firecannon, Last Whisper, and attack speed boots should have the opportunity to be able to shred through most anyone they attack. On that same token, if they get pulled in by a Darius, they're going to need both summoners to survive, and sometimes that won't even be enough. A "glass cannon" class, designed to pop whoever they attack, but pop themselves if they're caught.

  2. Assuming we can agree on #1, then it would make sense that ADC's are designed to be a late game class, generally speaking. I believe this is already the case with most ADC's, as most ADC champions can't hold their own in a 1v1 except other ADC's early on in the game. Hell, even half of the support lineup can 1v1 ADC's all the way up to like 4 items. (looking at you, Brand.) Compared to most other classes, ADC's are simply not as valuable in the early-mid game, of course, depending on which champions are being referenced. A Draven will have more impact than, say, a Ryze 10 minutes in, but generally speaking, this is the case for most ADC's.

  3. Assuming that we can agree that ADC's are, in general, weak early and strong late, then there can be justification for the current "bot lane fiesta" meta. If having a bot lane ahead will lead to a likely win if you make it late into the game, it would make sense that bot lane would be a juicy target for people to teleport to and gank.

Now, if we can all agree on these things as truths with the way the game currently stands, then we're on our way to finding a way to balance the game. ADC's are designed to be the late game class, and as such, they have less power in the early game, and more agency as the game goes on. That's how it is currently.

Knowing this, where would you like to see ADC's be? Their identity as a class as a whole is designed to be the hard hitting glass cannon. They're designed to be protected. They're designed to be killing you. That's their job, and I find that it can be very easy to pin the frustration on a class that objectively steamrolls over other classes at certain points in the game.

Remember, though - there are points in the game that ADC's are weaker than other classes, too. They might be safer due to their range, but even a Draven won't outperform a Jayce 15 minutes into a game. A Twitch won't be able to put a team on his back at 15 minutes quite like a well-fed Olaf. A Jhin won't be able to get that game winning pick 30 minutes into the game, like your Camille would. An Ezreal won't be able to outpoke the enemy team 20 minutes into the game, like your Xerath or Vel'Koz might.

So where is the issue? I agree with these boards on a couple things - ADC's are strong. They are objectively the strongest class 40 minutes+. They have been viable for almost as long as the game's existence. Why is that an issue?

I get that it can be frustrating - believe me. I, too, feel annoyed getting 4-shot by Jhin 30 minutes into the game when I decide to play Taliyah. I, too, get frustrated when playing something like Sejuani and I can't even touch the Ezreal.

But where would you rather see ADC's? Would you rather just delete the role entirely, and have the game be the ultimate slap fest, with mages being the new go-to end-all-be-all late game class? However you might look at it, there is going to definitively be one "strongest" late game class. If you want to nerf ADC's into oblivion, then the next big thing will become the reason you'll feel like LoL is dying.

Where is the issue? What would you rather see happen? How would you rather see League of Legends be played?

I, for one, as biased as I may be, appreciate the current way the game is balanced. Yes, there are definitely things that are out of line and need to be nerfed, buffed, or changed. But in the grand scheme of things, I think it's entirely healthy to have a class be defined by their late game strength. ADC's aren't the strongest class in the game at all stages of the game. That's what makes them balanced, and I'm perfectly comfortable posting this with the opinion that the ADC issue is blown way out of proportion. If you want to see change with the current way League of Legends as a whole is played, then voice it.

Saying "ADC is busted" won't fix any issues. Pinpoint the reason why you feel as though things need to change, because the way I see it, there is viable reason to pick and play every single class in League of Legends. To me, that's approaching a solid balance state. Perhaps I'm deluded in the fact that I play ADC, but I'd like to think that this game is quite balanced as it is.

So tell me: Where is the issue? How is League of Legends supposed to be played?

3 Comments

thefourtysn4/21/2018, 2:13:42 AM3 votes

Most people that complain are low elo xd, no worries bud, and gj

k wìx4/21/2018, 2:27:58 AM3 votes

Yo! high platinum support main here, so take it with a grain of salt, but some general thoughts about where I personally want to see ADCs go: (oh, and just a quick bit: I dont think a massive overhaul or a gutting of the class is required, I think small changes are better.)

1.) First and foremost, I disagree with your sentiment that there can only be one 'end-all be all best of the best endgame class'. There are many games, mobas even, that do a fine job of keeping all players output relatively balanced come late game, from mages to tanks to marksman style champions. The idea that the ADC needs to also be a 'hypercarry' to be viable is hogwash. Fundamentally, I'd like to see 1 of 2 things happen to the ADC 'class' as a whole:

2.) The first option that I'd like to see (and for the record, I favor this path) is a general increase in the time it takes for hypercarries to get to that state. Preserve them as late game power houses, but make the path to get there either harder to achieve, or take a bit longer. Getting nitty gritty, I'd like to see this achieved with more expensive items, and starter items that sacrifice damage output or power for farming potential. (essentially, think reverse support, like the ADC has access to buying items that augment gold gain even farther, so they can buy those really expensive items.)

Riot keeps trying to balance items between juggernauts, assassins, and adcs... If you inflate the costs of marskmen items, and give ADCs the tools to get there, then you kinda solve that problem to some extent.

3.) The second option that I'd like to see revolves around scaling some of that damage output down come late game. There are literally hundreds of ways to accomplish this. Rework of critical strike. potentially armor changes. Lifesteal changes. Going toe-to-toe with a well played, fully built marksman is absolute suicide and in many cases, it really shouldn't be.

Teridax684/21/2018, 11:53:01 AM1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spinning Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iyj7dce6,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-04-21T02:08:21.817+0000)

  1. It's an ADC's job to deal damage.

Sure, but the same can be said of mages, assassins, and fighters, yet marksmen often deal a multiple of any individual member of these classes. It may be the marksman's job to deal damage, but it's not their job to singlehandedly deal the majority of their whole team's damage, as is currently often the case.

[{quoted}](name=Spinning Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iyj7dce6,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-04-21T02:08:21.817+0000)

  1. Assuming we can agree on #1, then it would make sense that ADC's are designed to be a late game class, generally speaking.

This argument doesn't really follow from #1, particularly since it begs the question as to why late-game champions in other damage classes aren't on the same power level. If the argument is that marksmen as an entire class should be late-game, then that also raises the issue of marksmen currently spiking far too hard and far too early with only a handful of items. Infinity Edge + Statikk Shiv is still enough for many marksmen to start entering late-game mode and outdamage most other champions, and I don't think we should be defining late game at two or three items.

[{quoted}](name=Spinning Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iyj7dce6,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-04-21T02:08:21.817+0000)

  1. Assuming that we can agree that ADC's are, in general, weak early and strong late, then there can be justification for the current "bot lane fiesta" meta. If having a bot lane ahead will lead to a likely win if you make it late into the game, it would make sense that bot lane would be a juicy target for people to teleport to and gank.

I actually agree with this. If marksmen are to be the default carry class in the game, and so in every match, to the point where they become the only thing that matters as the game progresses, then they absolutely deserve to be hard-focused all the time. One follows from the other. This is why I personally don't like the idea of a default carry class, and why I'd rather allow more champions to be able to carry, all while allowing marksmen to themselves have a more diverse spread of power curves, with some being late-game carries, some being early game lane bullies, others peaking mid, etc. Effectively, the current ADC-centric meta hurts marksmen as well, which is why it would be to your own benefit if you relinquished even just a tiny fraction of the spotlight.

[{quoted}](name=Spinning Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iyj7dce6,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-04-21T02:08:21.817+0000)

Knowing this, where would you like to see ADC's be? Their identity as a class as a whole is designed to be the hard hitting glass cannon. They're designed to be protected. They're designed to be killing you. That's their job, and I find that it can be very easy to pin the frustration on a class that objectively steamrolls over other classes at certain points in the game.

I personally think marksmen as a whole should be a class focused on ranged DPS, and sometimes CC or utility. Beyond that, there's tons of room for exploration and deviation. This definition, however, does not imply a default carry curve, and I don't think automatically scaling into a late-game monster is really essential to the identity of marksmen, particularly since many have kits that are clearly better-suited for the early or mid game.

[{quoted}](name=Spinning Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iyj7dce6,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-04-21T02:08:21.817+0000)

Remember, though - there are points in the game that ADC's are weaker than other classes, too. They might be safer due to their range, but even a Draven won't outperform a Jayce 15 minutes into a game. A Twitch won't be able to put a team on his back at 15 minutes quite like a well-fed Olaf. A Jhin won't be able to get that game winning pick 30 minutes into the game, like your Camille would. An Ezreal won't be able to outpoke the enemy team 20 minutes into the game, like your Xerath or Vel'Koz might.

This has become less true in recent seasons, as it has taken increasingly less time and fewer items for ADCs to reach that level. This is also a recurring issue brought up on the Boards, which even Rioters have confirmed, so while marksmen are still weak for some period of time, that time period isn't really as significant as it used to be, nor does it really justify the monstrous amount of power they end up having anymore.

[{quoted}](name=Spinning Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iyj7dce6,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-04-21T02:08:21.817+0000)

So where is the issue? I agree with these boards on a couple things - ADC's are strong. They are objectively the strongest class 40 minutes+. They have been viable for almost as long as the game's existence. Why is that an issue?

It's an issue when it warps the game so hard that the entirety of League's meta remains stagnant for years, and the design of entire classes has been drastically affected, all because of one class that has been consistently so strong that they are mandatory to both teams. Look at any other MOBA, and you'll see a much more diverse environment where carries can do a much greater variety of things, don't force the rest of the character roster to revolve around them, and generally feel much fairer and more interactive in how they scale. In some, you don't even really need a carry at all, as there are proper tradeoffs for including one. This is what League could be, yet as long as marksmen define the entire game, as they have since its release, we'll never achieve that.

[{quoted}](name=Spinning Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iyj7dce6,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-04-21T02:08:21.817+0000)

But where would you rather see ADC's?

I personally think marksmen should be able to go into every position, and we already see a few go top, mid and jungle. I just don't think marksmen should be in literally every match on both teams, and this is the general complaint regarding ADC presence. Players who complain about ADCs generally don't want to delete the class, so much as make them non-mandatory, and this is a distinction you and a few other players haven't really been making.

[{quoted}](name=Spinning Axes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iyj7dce6,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-04-21T02:08:21.817+0000)

Would you rather just delete the role entirely, and have the game be the ultimate slap fest

If the game turns from MOBA Call of Duty to "the ultimate slap fest" the moment there is a match without an ADC, then there is something very, very wrong with the way both League and marksmen are balanced. The fact that you yourself implicitly admitted that marksmen are singlehandedly responsible for accelerating the pace of combat, more so than even burst classes, is telling.