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Support role is broken.

TheDangerousTaco·6/3/2019, 5:08:13 PM·2 votes·2,079 views

Disclaimer, I am not a support main. Please be advised that I have only a 20% clue on what I'm talking about here

So recently I made a post about why I think zyra's problem in midlane is https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/zM1VeIWz-zyras-midlane-problem and upon reading some of the comments, I made a realization. that support . . . is kinda dumb. Think about it

Lately I've been seeing a lot of lux supports , but I have long since believed that lux was a excellent support cause she has a shield and can build while peeling for her teammates. But what does lux build support? . . like what?? SHE doesn't even go support items.

Lately there has even been a shift on what counts as a "support" Like, I remember the days I used to play veigar in bronze elo, just to troll, and was happy when I won games. Now legitly in plat + you see **literally ** veigar support mains. FIDDLE sticks can even go support without being questioned?

And lets not even forget that SKT brought MF support to counter zyra's plants.

Like, legit, please tell me. What is even the purpose of playing these champions , when a mage can still win the game, or even do your job better?

Outside of LCS, I feel like there is no room for non tank supports in this meta/ game anymore. unless you play or a hardcore tank. A mage is arguable a better "support" than actual support.

I started to think that it was the mages who suck in midlane, that's why they went bot. But now I'm starting to realize, that support lane sucks, and anything can go there, long as you can kill people.

13 Comments

The thigh guy6/3/2019, 6:53:14 PM2 votes

You spelled second mid wrong.

Hotarµ6/3/2019, 5:35:29 PM1 votes

Lately I've been seeing a lot of lux supports , but I have long since believed that lux was a excellent support cause she has a shield and can build while peeling for her teammates. But what does lux build support? like what?? SHE doesn't even go support items.

Lux can perform insanely well with full AP. In fact, her burst is so high that you could lump her together with Zyra, Brand, and Xerath's damage outputs.

Like, legit, please tell me. What is even the purpose of playing these champions , , , when a mage can still win the game, or even do your job better?

Well for starters:

Sona in particular is one of the highest winrate support champions in the game at the moment. From Bronze to Platinum+ she goes from 51% to as high as 55%. Janna has a very respectable winrate as well, going from 53.70% to 52.65% (scaling downwards from Bronze-Platinum.)

Soraka isn't as strong as the others, but she's still got a 51% winrate across all ELOs. Obligatory mention of Nami as well, who's also one of the strongest supports at the moment and stays at a 53% winrate across all ELOs.

Xerath sits at a 53%, Brand at a 51%, Zyra at a 52%, Veigar at a 48%. Zed and Anivia have a 51% in mid because they don't have enough recorded results in support.

~~TL;DR: The conventional support champions (Soraka, Janna, Sona, etc.) perform just as good as or better than the non-conventional ones (Brand, Xerath, Zyra, etc.) ~~

Side note: Yes, damage supports can be very strong when played in the right way, but conventional supports like Sona still bring a bunch to the table. Damage supports can't heal or shield their ADCs, they lack reliable hard CC most of the time, and they're very squishy meaning they're susceptible to focusing or ganks. To add a personal note, when I play Pyke and people start focusing my ADC, there's almost nothing I can do if we aren't all-inning them.

Damage supports do have weaknesses.

Outside of LCS, I feel like there is no room for non tank supports in this meta/ game anymore. unless you play or a hardcore tank. A mage is arguable a better "support" than actual support.

The champions you listed are pretty common and strong tank supports. Thresh is also great (as always) along with Taric (51% WR.) Arguably the only bad tank supports at the moment are Alistar, Tahm Kench, and Galio. That's not even that bad, there are almost 6-7 viable tank supports.

Hotarµ6/3/2019, 5:57:18 PM1 votes

I acknowledge that traditional supports bring a lot more to the table than just damage dealers. But what I want to emphasize is that from a solo que perspective, unless you or the enemy has some bomb ass synergy / teamwork, damage dealer supports, can perform just as well.

To me, I find this a problem. Not because sona isn't a great pick for her shields / ult, or cause soraka can't heal a team by herself, or cause lulu cant hard cuck a zed and carry a game from behind. But mainly because it feels like support is falling into the lines of toplane. Where the balance isn't solely based on counters or whats good for a team comp. But mainly who can bully the other into submission harder, to snowball.

That's not an issue with the support role, that's just an issue with how people choose to play the game. Picking Brand isn't an instant win, but he's going to be stronger in lower ELOs compared to high, just like how Sona is the inverse of that. There are tiers for each level of play, that's true in all games.

But in a solo que environment, where teamwork isn't as guarantee, would you not ration that those supports are falling by the wayside far too often?

No, because there's no evidence to support that claim.

The difference between Brand and Janna support at the lowest level of play is infinitesimal, being only a few percent at most and it's in Janna's favor.

A mage can go mid and support. But a support can only go mid. So if take that logic into account, me personally. I would rationalize that practicing mages is a better use of my time and experience, since they can dual role better.

If you think that's the best course of action then you're free to do so. If you pick up Brand you can now efficiently play him in both mid/support, however you will start to get outclassed the higher up you go. That's because the support role has niche needs and only a few champions can satisfy them (which is why Sona/Janna/Soraka are consistently strong picks.)

Woodakoodashooda6/3/2019, 5:13:09 PM1 votes

Supports average less than 10k gold per match win or lose. If they spend most of it on big ticket items then all they'll have is maybe 3 complete items and non-upgraded boots. It's not a gold efficient build for supports.

Oleandervine6/3/2019, 7:30:10 PM1 votes

Your argument is jaded and not at all factoring in specific strengths and weaknesses.

Let's start with Lux. She IS a good support pick because of her shield and her slow and her snare. However, why on earth would you want to limit her by building Ardent Censer on her? Lux's strength as a support IS NOT her shielding alone, mainly because of how temperamental her shield can be in some scenarios, and how it's awful in a pinch unless her ally is point blank and not moving. None of the pure support utility items are optimal on her, and if you build them on her, you're basically building her as a poor man's Lulu or Nami. You need to build to cater to her strengths, which is why you want to build pure AP items on her. Poke is one of her major strengths, which is why it's far, far better to run pure AP items on her instead of pure utility items. Don't make the common mistake of assuming that Supports must buy utility support items. That is false. Other supports like Karma, Zyra, Morgana, and Sona are testaments to how false this is.

As for what can qualify as a support - so what? Lots of things qualify as top laners. It's diverse. You have ranged units like Teemo, Jayce, Quinn, and even Vayne, then you have tanks like Nautilus, Tahm Kench, Sion, Shen, and Maokai. Then there's bruisers like Darius, Yorick, and Nasus, as well as divers like Camille, Fiora, and Jax. So why on earth is it wrong that Support be diverse, when other roles like Top lane can span almost the entire spectrum of champions?

As for why you'd play someone like Sona, Soraka, or Janna - you'd play them because of the utility they bring to the team. A lot of mages have some utility, but there are severe limits to it, and the majority of the time their utility is limited to CC. CC won't save your allies when shit hits the fan. Sona's healing plus her speed boost will. Janna's ultimate plus her shield will. Soraka's full team heal combined with her silence field will. There are plenty of reasons to take enchanter mages or traditional supports over poke mage supports, so don't blanketly assume that poke mages are by default superior.

Auki6/3/2019, 10:27:08 PM1 votes

It's not so much an issue with the support role being broken, it's more because mages in general are too strong with their build. There is no real reason to pick tank supports anymore since all of them besides naut has been directly nerfed and had their core item gutted over and over again. Riot doesn't care about mage supports since they aren't picked in pro play so until they are the support rushing item 1026 and item 3020 will continue to 1 shot the adc and snowball games

Dorans Pants6/3/2019, 6:38:04 PM1 votes

If traditional supports are not significantly more powerful than other picks there is no incentive for the vast majority of players to use them. The downside of having no carry potential on your own is just too big for the slight potential statistical advantage.

heal supports rely on competent teammates
tank supports have terrible laning phases unless they can cheese early
dmg-dealer are the only ones who can control the lane early and have a win condition late game

so it´s no surprise that everyone switches to dmg carries as soon as they are remotely viable there. Not to mention that getting kills and dealing dmg is seen as the most prestigious thing in the game next to mobility, which is something all traditional supports suck at.