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@Riot - Riot VS Karma

Winterkill·7/30/2019, 6:44:10 PM·28 votes·9,810 views

VGU 6 Years Ago

  • Removed fans.
  • Removed Mantra Q Healing
  • Removed Mantra W Ally Tether
  • Removed dress
  • Removed Mantra charge system
  • RicklessAbandon removes Shield Bomb shortly after VGU
  • Rushed and lazy visual update
  • New and old splasharts never matched in game models
  • Art assets like taunts, jokes and champion interactions are non-existent and very lazily done
  • Lack of running animation as well as a shield casting animation, despite the VERY minimal effort that was put towards her current running animation.

Current Karma

  • Back and fourth nerfs and buffs.
  • Multiple Developers talking about how Karma needs a lot of work.
  • Constantly being a problem from a pro level to the basic player.
  • Karma's entire kit exists on item actives, through-out champion kits and is very bland.
  • Ivern gets shield bomb.
  • Pantheon gets Karma's entire Mantra system, with the idea of empowered abilities.
  • Everyone does her job better and the new champions/VGU champions do her job better.

I don't want to hear left win Riot Game supporters who say:

  • Karma is great and fine the way she is.
  • Karma is a unique champion that offers something fun to the game.
  • She was the first VGU and Riot was still learning.
  • Her identity is a generalist champion.

A champion, like Karma, who has absolutely nothing unique to her anymore is not a great and fine champion. Every champion and item active that copies her abilities, does her job better. Completely stripping everything from one champion and putting it on a new champion or VGU one, is complete blaspheme to me. Why does no one think this is unfair? They have legitimately removed everything from this champion for half-arsed completed content that was lazily done or already exists in the game. I really don't understand why Riot Game Developers refuse to do nothing but back and fourth buffs that don't fix the problems they created.

Pantheon LEGIT has Karma's entire Mantra system. He casts an ability or basic attacks to cast and empowered version of his basic ability. ISN'T THAT WHAT KARMA DOES!? SHE CASTS ABILITIES AND AUTO ATTACKS TO LESSEN THE TIME ON MANTRA TO CAST A EMPOWERED VERSION OF A BASIC ABILITY. Are we all really going to sit here and say that Karma is a unique, fully conceptualized, and fun champion to play?

Riot, you really hate Karma and the Karma mains.

EDIT:

Pantheon Passive - Mortal Will After five basic attacks or ability casts, Pantheon’s next basic ability (Q, W, or E) is empowered.

Karma R - Mantra Karma empowers her next basic ability within 8 seconds for an additional effect.

Do I even half the spell this out for you? At least Pantheon's empowered abilities don't exist on item actives

29 Comments

Hammermancer7/30/2019, 6:50:02 PM15 votes

Tbh if they just made her autos throw fans everyone would be happy

Also make her stop running like she pooped her pants plz

PzyXo7/31/2019, 12:23:01 AM9 votes

Riot Game supporters

Riot's premium suckers*

Regina George7/30/2019, 11:59:30 PM7 votes

I will never forget how dirty Riot did Karma.

Pika Fox7/30/2019, 6:47:16 PM7 votes

Old karma was garbage. New karma is better, but they needed to just change her kit more than they did. Her kit always had identity issues.

Yes, karma needs work. No, that doesnt mean old karma was better.

No, pantheon is nothing like old or new karma. Nothing on his kit is similar. Its closer to renekton than karma.

IxtaliKing7/31/2019, 1:21:00 AM4 votes

I really wish Riot would just bring back shield bomb. Instead of giving us nerfs on top of nerfs to RE. All these nerfs do is prove RE never should've changed to bonus shielding to begin with.

Karma was a lot healthier back when she actually had to think about when and where she placed her RE. She wouldn't have needed her passive to be jacked up to 4 seconds to be useful in team fights - just wise decision making.

An ally-tether would also be good for bringing Karma back to a space where she focuses more on dealing damage and buffing allies, as opposed to controlling enemies with CC. In an ideal world Karma would go back to her roots and lose some CC; particularly the RW bonus root, and the recent Q slow buffs. Her kit doesn't need more than a 1.5s root. I think that would make her less obnoxious for top lane, and more attractive as mid and support picks.

The annoying thing about Karma's current state is that I'm pretty sure if her 5.10 mini-rework had taken place in season 7, she almost certainly would've been considered a failure and reverted by now.

ƒrostγ7/30/2019, 11:08:56 PM3 votes

Honestly at this point only a full VGU could make her justice.

Mama Yuumi7/31/2019, 4:11:05 AM3 votes

Just give us a full revert as a separate champ, that's not toooo much to ask right? I really do miss old Karma though, rest in peace clotheslining enemies :(

GigglesO7/31/2019, 5:17:34 PM2 votes

Riot has been making alot of mistakes homogenizing champions and damage.

Garen is adopted7/31/2019, 12:34:47 PM2 votes

Karma is cancer as she is lol, if anything she needs some nerfs.

Crispy0Snake7/31/2019, 2:07:14 AM1 votes

I love Karma as a move speed buff champ, you go Ardent Athene's Shurelya's, it's fun

Her RQ "aftershock" aoe should deal 0 damage to minions

Her Q should mark a target so that she can W them (can't just E W "hey my junger's here and you're dead XD")

Her R should empower itself into an actual ultimate ability, I was thinking she could press R on an ally and get to use their ult, as well as her 3 empowered basic abilities (must have an ally in range to ult)

Put old Celerity on her E, ally gets a little dmg (with a cap) based on MS

Just some ideas c:

Winterkill7/31/2019, 2:52:22 AM1 votes

Like old Karma, her Mantra offered more alternative uses than just a upgrading version of a basic ability. Mantra Q healed, Mantra W had an ally mechanic, and Mantra E had a damage side to it. Mantra was also on a charge system which allowed her to combo into other Mantra. Karma actually had a passive as well (broken one that needed a change but not a useless one like she has now).

This my friends is what we call SKILL EXPRESSION. Karma has almost zero skill expression on Mantra that are tied to one specific use and are more useful than others.

Darkstar Annie7/31/2019, 3:25:34 AM1 votes

I miss when her shield looked like a fancy giant glass bowl spinning around people. I also recall it doing some heavy damage upon cast to nearby champs. Those were great times.

Larriet7/31/2019, 1:27:44 AM1 votes

Art assets like taunts, jokes and champion interactions are non-existent and very lazily done

This isn't fair; she's completely up to par for champions released at that time. Maybe complain about Nami's lack of interactions while you're at it?

Razelth7/31/2019, 4:21:36 AM1 votes

Renekton autoattacks and uses abilities to achieve the condition of having an empowered ability. He is literally Karma jesus christ. I didn't know I was playing karma, I can't play him anymore.

Arakadia7/31/2019, 8:47:43 AM1 votes

What are left win Riot supporters?

I agree with your post but listing all the things they removed from a VGU is dumb unless like her fans they were core in theme.

SirTauntsALot7/31/2019, 10:01:25 AM1 votes

{quoted}

VGU 6 Years Ago

  • Removed fans.
  • Removed Mantra Q Healing
  • Removed Mantra W Ally Tether
  • Removed dress
  • Removed Mantra charge system
  • RicklessAbandon removes Shield Bomb shortly after VGU
  • Rushed and lazy visual update
  • New and old splasharts never matched in game models
  • Art assets like taunts, jokes and champion interactions are non-existent and very lazily done
  • Lack of running animation as well as a shield casting animation, despite the VERY minimal effort that was put towards her current running animation.

Current Karma

  • Back and fourth nerfs and buffs.
  • Multiple Developers talking about how Karma needs a lot of work.
  • Constantly being a problem from a pro level to the basic player.
  • Karma's entire kit exists on item actives, through-out champion kits and is very bland.
  • Ivern gets shield bomb.
  • Pantheon gets Karma's entire Mantra system, with the idea of empowered abilities.
  • Everyone does her job better and the new champions/VGU champions do her job better.

I don't want to hear left win Riot Game supporters who say:

  • Karma is great and fine the way she is.
  • Karma is a unique champion that offers something fun to the game.
  • She was the first VGU and Riot was still learning.
  • Her identity is a generalist champion.

A champion, like Karma, who has absolutely nothing unique to her anymore is not a great and fine champion. Every champion and item active that copies her abilities, does her job better. Completely stripping everything from one champion and putting it on a new champion or VGU one, is complete blaspheme to me. Why does no one think this is unfair? They have legitimately removed everything from this champion for half-arsed completed content that was lazily done or already exists in the game. I really don't understand why Riot Game Developers refuse to do nothing but back and fourth buffs that don't fix the problems they created.

Pantheon LEGIT has Karma's entire Mantra system. He casts an ability or basic attacks to cast and empowered version of his basic ability. ISN'T THAT WHAT KARMA DOES!? SHE CASTS ABILITIES AND AUTO ATTACKS TO LESSEN THE TIME ON MANTRA TO CAST A EMPOWERED VERSION OF A BASIC ABILITY. Are we all really going to sit here and say that Karma is a unique, fully conceptualized, and fun champion to play?

Riot, you really hate Karma and the Karma mains.

EDIT:

Pantheon Passive - Mortal Will After five basic attacks or ability casts, Pantheon’s next basic ability (Q, W, or E) is empowered.

Karma R - Mantra Karma empowers her next basic ability within 8 seconds for an additional effect.

Do I even half the spell this out for you? At least Pantheon's empowered abilities don't exist on item actives

Use to be a Karma main. The old karma may have not be the best but she was at least unique. Unfortunately this is not new. Karma is another one of those champions that rito has abandoned such as Udyr Shen Shaco Skarner DrMundo

I dare even say that Ryze's latest "Rework" got the Karma treatment. Making him very very unfun.

Rıots Bad Client7/31/2019, 12:37:29 AM1 votes

Here is my shitty Karma Rework.

Passive: Same. While IN her Totem Location, Her passive applies to all her abilities.

Q: Same(but lower damage)

W: Reworked Karma links to a unit. (Pretty much the same)

Enemy: Karma will reflect XX% of the damage she takes to the champion she links to. Ally: Karma Will Heal The amount her allies deal.

Effect: Threshold of X amount for both of damage dealt. IF it passes the threshold. Ally: Will heal for % of what healed Karma Enemy: Will Root for 1.5 seconds.

Enhanced: Enemy: Threshold is ignored, Damage reflect is also Damage Reduction. to 20% Roots for 2.00 Ally: Both allies are granted bonus movement speed.

E: Remove moment speed. Shield lasts 3 seconds, after the shield expires she will grant the shielded ally X% movement speed based on the remaining HP of the shield

R: Karma drops a Totem that enhances all her abilities and has a life span of 20 seconds, casting an ability will lower the life span by 8 seconds. (Karma can tether the totem. ) Auto attacks will lower the Cool Down of R. Totems can die like wards.

jocomotion7/31/2019, 5:16:46 PM1 votes

Looking at both kits, I still can’t say new karma is worse than the old one.

But my god does she need a rework still.

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/R4ulUz7p-another-karma-rework-concept

Summoner SpeII7/31/2019, 1:36:32 AM1 votes

i want karma nerfs, i literally see complete autofill monkeys play karma top with klepto and get free wins because their team is better and how broken the pick is, if you find a way to buff karma without impacting klepto top karma i would have no problem with karma buffs