FIZZ NEEDS A NERF!!!!!

RUNIC AllFATHER·12/31/2014, 2:05:12 AM·8 votes·1,567 views

personally i have been playing since later season 2 and i have still never won a lane against a fizz! he needs to be nerfed to make more mid laners actually be able to do something against him... i will list my points down below.

  1. his E: it's range is too long for what it can be and the idea that he is untargatable (or invulnerable i don't really know) is outrageous, stuns have no effect even if they were casted and the animation was happening before he casts, roots do nothing, snares notta, only burning affects that have happened before he casts... for example: TF's yellow card if TF cast his yellow card and the animation is happening... the card clearly traveling to hit him, fizz casts his E.... yellow card does nothing, not damage, no stun after the ability ended.... just nothing as well as leaving tf vulnerable to be all in'd easily with no struggle. i believe this is a bad example considering TF may be weak against fizz in general but still were talking about fizz' abilities

how this would be inproved is maybe instead of giving him untargatable status give him damage reduction and tanacity, possibly the ability for stuns to take affect after the ability is done

  1. his ult has a insanly large hitbox on his ult and in late game has a decesiveling low cooldown and makes champion picking far easier than an average assassin and makes it much harder for the enemy team to make decent plays.

either nerf his cooldown, the ap ratio, or the hitbox size maybe two outta the three

  1. he has no real weak point in the game... he remains consistant in early, mid and late game exceptions being level one and two... his base damage and ap ratios make him pretty strong as well as scaling. his passive and his E make it hard for other champions deal damage to him.

and his mana isn't too big of an issue considering he can one combo people relatively easy, and items countering mana issues are very relavant especially early game. ex:item 3100

12 Comments

brad12/31/2014, 2:05:41 AM6 votes

has no weak point?

plz get good

TheSeltzerBaron12/31/2014, 2:19:08 AM4 votes

My issue with fizz is that he is completely untargetable when he jumps up on his stupid stick. Why? He's just in the air, it's not like he disappeared from the planet. It's basically a short invuln like Tryn's ult. IMO no champ should have a period of invulnerability like that.

kcStranger12/31/2014, 2:54:23 AM2 votes

As a Fizz player and someone who's thought a lot about this, I feel that although Fizz is one of the stronger champions in the game, he is not overpowered. At the highest levels of the game, he is merely good, not dominant. However, I think that there are several factors that make Fizz much stronger at lower levels than he is at the highest levels, all of which boil down to the fact that playing against Fizz is in general more strategically demanding than playing as Fizz. A quick rundown of a few of Fizz's strengths and weaknesses are in order. First, the strengths:

  1. Strong all-in potential after level 3 (when he has all his abilities) and especially after 6 (when he gets his ult).
  2. E dodges/negates a huge variety of impactful abilities.
  3. Strong early power spikes with Sheen/Lich Bane.
  4. Two forms of engage/disengage make frequent trading possible (E and Q).
  5. Passive mitigates auto-attack harass.
  6. Tends to snowball if he picks up early kills.

And the weaknesses:

  1. Melee, so is vulnerable to ranged harass. This leads to very weak laning pre-level 3, and still somewhat weak pre-6, since his burst isn't yet high enough to force the opponent to back off completely.
  2. Abilities have fairly high mana costs and long cooldowns as compared to most champs. This means that he can't afford to spam his abilities in lane if he's not getting damage onto his opponent, and that he has windows of vulnerability after using his abilities (especially the E). In teamfights, this can make him a bit of a one-hit wonder (giant burst, but then tends to either retreat or just get in some incidental damage before dying; this means he can be low-impact if he can't insta-gib a carry).

I won't attempt to address teamfighting against Fizz, but a few words about laning are in order (since this is where the snowball begins). I'll use the Syndra vs. Fizz matchup as an example. As Syndra, you need to harass Fizz heavily pre-6 (even more so pre-3) using your auto-attack and Q (Dark Sphere). This ability is a great tool for harassing Fizz because its low cost/cooldown means you can spam it, and Fizz simply can't troll-pole away from every one. To line up the Q, it is important to pay attention to the health of your minions and predict where Fizz will move in order to last-hit. In this way, you can build up a large CS lead or force Fizz out of lane early. In particular, it is important not to burn your other abilities until Fizz burns his E, as these abilities are much more impactful and costly , and Fizz is likely to win a trade if he dodges one. Meanwhile, as Fizz, you're looking to dodge Syndra's abilities if possible and either just survive early laning with roughly equal CS, or burst Syndra if you can dodge a more impactful ability with your E, or if she doesn't respect your burst and gets too low.

At the highest levels, Syndra vs. Fizz is generally regarded as a skill matchup, if a somewhat volatile one. At lower levels, however, I think Fizz holds the edge because the things the matchup demands of Syndra (paying attention to her own minions' health, predicting enemy movements, keeping track of opponent's cooldowns) are more advanced than what it demands of Fizz (CSing his own minions and looking for opportunities to dodge abilities or get aggressive). Also, I think players at lower levels tend to underestimate Fizz's burst or play too aggressively/impatiently.

Probably the best thing you can do to help you play better against Fizz is to play a few games as Fizz. If your opponents are good enough, you should eventually see how constricting his mana costs/cooldowns can be, and how much you can get harassed at low levels. (If you want to feel it right away, grab a friend and try to lane as Fizz against Akali. It hurts.)

All that being said...I might not mind it if they nerfed Fizz's Passive (Nimble Fighter) by making it not reduce damage from auto-attacks. Fizz's weakness to early ranged harass is a key weakness, and it might be ok if they widened the window to harass Fizz. Also, I don't understand how being nimble makes you take less damage when you've already been smacked in the face.

Lîquefìer12/31/2014, 2:19:02 AM2 votes

fizz is one of those champs that generally gets picked early in draft when he's not banned. He's easy to counter, and if you happen to pick before him just don't feed him and keep track of when he roams. He can be one of those champions (like renekton) that you know you're going to lose lane but u can just not feed him and catch back up midgame.

I don't see a way to nerf him w/o making him irrelevant. Sorry.

CritterZoid1/1/2015, 4:53:17 AM1 votes

Actually you are wrong about stuns not working on his E. I should know I stunned him right as he was using his E. When the animation ended he was still stunned. There is a .5 to 1 second window to actually stun him. It's a small window yes, but it is possible to stun Fizz when he E's. The one problem I have with his E (that I hate utterly) is the fact he can dodge turret shots.

Snarflaz1/6/2015, 1:49:05 AM1 votes

As a mage, you can just poke him with your ability that uses the least amount of mana and then when he E's drop a stun on where he is gonna land, and he will be stunned, then just Do as much damage at that time.

xcailbar4/26/2015, 2:05:57 PM1 votes

Fizz needs to get fed early He's a Risk-Reward kind of champ that needs a strong early game If you can bait his e (with like a skillshot or DoT ir AoE or something) then apply hard CC so that he is down and his mobility is reduced. If you have minions or other allies make sure that his q is down as well. That way, you can do all our dmg and then back out. Hes also melee, so if you have some form of ranged harass, and play well, you should be able to get him low enough to all in and kill him Also, deny farm and roam. Fizz is strong early, so if you deny his early game farm, Fizz becomes weaker.

I personal don't think fizz needs that much nerf, because I have had my share of playing against fizz, and have won quite a few times, had a draw in the lane few times, and lost only a few. Incase you are wondering; Champs I've played mid:Ahri Fiddlesticks Mordekaiser Nocturne Velkoz Xerath Heimerdinger