Shouldn't champions with dashes/blinks have less movement speed than those without?

Diostukos·2/7/2015, 9:48:00 PM·93 votes·6,927 views

We have champions like that have no gapclosers and are very squishy, while having the lowest tier of base movement speed (325).

Then there are champions like who have multiple ways to close gaps on others. You could argue that once their abilities are on cooldown they're left vulnerable right? Well has 350 base movement speed compared to 325, so even if he somehow didn't get to you with two dashes, he'll still be able to outrun you.

109 Comments

ValyrianBlade2/7/2015, 10:05:44 PM56 votes

I think it depends on each case. A champion whose identity is mobility should have high ms and dashes. A champion whose weakness is lack of mobility should have low ms and no dashes.

I think some cases are ridiculous though. Hecarim is supposed to be incredibly mobile without dashes so one would Logically think he'd have the highest base ms in the game and yet he's 345, close but not there. Zed has so many other identities I think 350ms is overkill and he should have 340 or something.

Also in general melee champions have higher base ms than ranged champions. Which makes sense gameplay wise I guess, but Logically a lithe Archer or mage should be able to outrun a heavily armoured soldier or a bulky minotaur...

qetzel2/7/2015, 10:32:05 PM27 votes

Well, for the low movement speed examples you have given, Ashe has a permanent slow. If she also had a high move speed, she would be awful to deal with. Zyra has a fairly long range and amazing disengage. I think the idea behind her low movement speed is to reward her enemy if they can get past her spells. Sona has a fairly unhealthy play pattern in lane - high movement speed would exacerbate this. She also does have a powerful speed boost. Kog'maw has arguably the highest late game damage in the game along with a very high range. If he had any more safety he would be far too strong.

For the high movement speed champions... I am in two minds about them. Yes, they have two gapclosers, so on one hand it seems unfair. On the other hand, a small amount of movement speed is more useful in dodging and rotating than in chasing (particularly with the prevalence of flash). If you are so out of position that this movement makes a big difference to your escape after they have used their gaplosers, you probably deserve to die. Overall, given that Zed and Lee Sin are all about making plays across the map, they really need the movement speed.

In answer to the poll, no. There is a lot more to consider when deciding movement speed than just the mobility in a champion's kit.

Stephenizgod2/8/2015, 7:06:33 AM18 votes

Movespeed should be based on a number of things.

Ranged or Melee - Melee's should have faster Movement Speed since Ranged already has the advantage of, well, being ranged...
Overall Mobility Potential - Someone like Lee Sin who has high Mobility should have less Movement Speed then someone like Mordekaiser who has no Mobility.
Amount and Type of CC - Someone like Ashe with a Permaslow AA, Wide Cone Slow, and a Mass Stun shouldn't have a lot of Movement Speed, someone like Darius who only has his short range pull should have a higher base Movement Speed.
Tankiness and Damage - Tanks should be big lumbering balls of resistances walking into a fight and laying down some tanks-version-of-whoopass, Assassins should be quick and agile going in and out of fights.

Thats my opinion on Movement Speed.

Kitten of Evil2/7/2015, 10:05:41 PM14 votes

The reason most of the mobile champions have higher MS is because they're melee. It would be hard to get in range to basic-attack and kiting would be a severe problem. Plus, most immobile champions fall in a few categories: ADC, support, or mage. Bruisers, junglers, tanks, and melee ADCs have higher MS usually.

Of course, this isn't taking into account gap-closers, but even those are only up once every several seconds.

Malix Farwin2/8/2015, 1:46:25 AM11 votes

Lee sin is Riot's love child, cant bring him into any balance argument without throwing the rules of balance out the window.

OyddAWqJ5r2/8/2015, 6:19:06 AM8 votes

No, that'd be balanced. We don't like balance. We like LCSBIGPLAYS LeeSin Zed

Meep Man2/8/2015, 6:46:50 AM5 votes

In my opinion, this is how movement speed should be organized:

Melee + No Mobility: Highest Base Movement Speed Melee + Minor Mobility: High Base Movement Speed Ranged + No Mobility: Above Average Base Movement Speed Melee + Mobility: Average Base Movement Speed Ranged + Minor Mobility: Average Base Movement Speed Melee + Super Mobility: Below Average Base Movement Speed Ranged + Mobility: Below Average Base Movement Speed Ranged + Super Mobility: Low Base Movement Speed

Melee and Ranged champions would be treated as if they were ranged plus 5 more base movement speed.

DEmperor952/8/2015, 5:59:58 AM4 votes

Currently, the main determinant of base movement speed is range, and it also serves as a lever for weakness on some champions. However, I agree that some base movement speeds should be retuned to account for the massive amount of mobility most champions possess in today's state of the game.

Llanite2/8/2015, 12:10:30 AM3 votes

Biologically if you're good at dashing/jumping, your legs have strong muscles which should let you run faster too.

The Soulforged2/8/2015, 2:40:16 AM2 votes

It should also be determined by range, but have those melees that have 10 dashes be spared of a buff to speed.

Orangesilk2/8/2015, 2:28:20 AM2 votes

Usually they like to have "Movement speed groups" and decide what group does each champion belong in. ADC's, along with most mages whose weakness is supposed to be their lack of mobility belong on the lowest speed tier, because they sorta have to get murdered by getting jumped on. With the highest tier being for champions who either desperately need that movement speed to be viable like Chogath Nasus Olaf or who are supposed to be threatening BECAUSE of their huge mobility like MasterYi LeeSin Khazix

Matezoide2/8/2015, 7:39:32 AM2 votes

But how is Lee Sin supposed to do his BigPlayz? What if he misses Q and doesnt have a Trinket?!

Zodd the Immorta2/8/2015, 1:25:24 PM2 votes

I think champions with dashes shouldn't be allowed to use flash. (refering to champions like ezreal, and not champions like ahri who's dash is in her ult, or jax whose dash requires a target)

Irelia Bot2/8/2015, 5:22:26 PM2 votes

Well first off the 4 champs you picked for low movement speed have a reason for having such low base speed.

Kog is still one of the hardest hiting damage carries in the game.

Sona has heals, damage, team movement speed, increased damage, and other stuff making her one of the more well rounded suppots in the game overall.

Zyra if she had mobility would likely have to lose a fair ammount of her damage to justify that buff.

Ashe while not a super star of the #LCSBIGPLAYS these days was at one point basically considered super OP because of her slows. She is kinda a victim of her own success in that without her and nunu in the game the mobility creep would have not happened in the way it did.

As for lee sin and Zed no one is really defending them currently but in the case you gave of lee chasing down kog you disregard the slow kog has in his kit as well as that champions should have inherent weaknesses. Kog if he has high mobility would be well over the top with his current damage.

Leafie2/8/2015, 5:34:25 AM2 votes

That makes too much sense. Sorry, Riot's balance team can't allow that.

IlyaK19862/9/2015, 5:10:47 AM2 votes

What is this nonsense? Melee champions with high base MS + mobility have that because THEY'RE MELEE. And, surprise surprise, an assassin's NATURAL TARGET is a squishball, slow, immobile ADC.

Melee with high mobility = okay. It's an ADC with high mobility that's not okay.