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I need a reason to keep Frost Queen's Claim late game, let alone build it in the first place.

John Berserk·8/9/2015, 4:24:32 PM·38 votes·3,225 views

Because right now, as a support (specifically Nami) main, when I build Spellthief's Edge, I hardly ever build it into Frostfang, let alone to Frost Queen's Claim. There's just no reason to, unless I'm at full build otherwise and need an extra 10% CDR. I only use Spellthief's for the bit of gold it gives me from harassing (which I do a lot of as Nami), and only go into Frostfang when I feel like harassing for slightly more gold.

item 3401 gives 500 HP, 100% base HP regen, and 10% CDR, plus the active shield on it, making it a solid tanky support item to build early and take into the late game. item 3069 gives 100% base mana regen, 100% base HP regen, 10% CDR, 20 MS, and an active that gives your entire team what's essentially a Sivir ult. item 3092 gives 50% base mana regen, 50 AP, 10% CDR, and an active that, while not useless, is not enough to equal out the item with the power and stats of FotM and ToA.

What I suggest:

  • More AP on FQC, because 50 doesn't feel nearly as impactful as 500 HP from FotM or the 100% hp and mana regen and 20 MS on ToA.
  • More gold generated from the Tribute passive on FQC. Right now it only gives 10 gold, making it virtually no better than Frostfang in regards to its gold generation.
  • Maybe increase the radius of the Arctic Embrace active.
  • Have Tribute passive restore some mana and/or health upon proccing it, restoring more upon upgrading the items.

32 Comments

Aeolian Melodies8/9/2015, 4:30:11 PM14 votes

FQC actually IS better than Frostfang as the gold procs don't get disabled if you kill a creep - which means you can always spend the charges even if you're a mage support like Zyra or Karma and you got some CS pushing a wave with your team.

The active is good imo. Maybe make it available more often (Talisman has such a short CD and is easier to use), perhaps the reverse of Twin Shadow - if it hits champions, the CD is reduced (perhaps ranging from whatever to whatever depending on how many champions you hit?).

I do agree that the full item should provide more AP - for an item that is meant to be for mage supports and utility supports who choose to make use of their utility scalings, 50 really isn't that much. If necessary, axe the CDR (which is SUPER easy to get on support builds anyway) and toss a blasting wand in the recipe or something.

High58/9/2015, 7:55:22 PM2 votes

I don't like coin, but I get it's very specific niche. It provides no stats and the active for mid game can be found elsewhere. It's a very passive item that may ... work on a poke/jana team fight combo?

Spellthief gives a moderate amount of gold if you use it to poke (nami, morg, lulu, etc). Face is ok on sups that benefit from the extra health (Ali, Naut, etc). For 2200g, thief's a very decent item for a more active sup.

It's personal choice. I like thief and knocking because it doesn't fit your style is very silly, especially when you play a champ that it fits very well like Nami.

Auryiel8/9/2015, 11:47:11 PM1 votes

A bit more AP and reducing the CD on the active should do the trick.

Maybe something like you can use it twice in a prolonged fight.

only zhule8/10/2015, 1:42:40 AM1 votes

my issue with that whole line of items is that it just doesn't feel like you get your moneys worth on the upgrades. Like i drop 500 gold (a fair amount in the early game when i'm already trying to get sightstone and tier 2 boots), and i get +5 AP, + 25% mana regen, and tribute doubles. It's this last part that i think is the issue. We can all agree 500 gold for 5 AP and 25% mana regen is a horrible deal.... Gold value wise i'd say it's maybe worth 200-225 gold, so that means the you need to make up 275-300 gold in the bonus from tribute. This will take you about 10 mins assuming you use all the charges as they come up/ don't ever have 3 charges built up. So more realistically it's probably 13-15 mins of hitting the passive to make up for the gold spent. That's a LONG time to have to wait for an item to pay for itself.

Nekusen8/10/2015, 2:18:07 AM1 votes

  • Reduce Mana Regen

  • Add more AP

  • Add more gold

  • Change active to: Unique – Mirror Portal: Teleports to target allied champion (4000 range) , 90 seconds cooldown.

chipndip18/10/2015, 3:14:54 AM1 votes

FQC is entirely worthless atm. I'd rather sit on the base item and get my cdr from other items that are worth it.

Maybe if it had 100% mana regen instead of 50%? Then I wouldn't be so tempted to just build an Athene's...

Actin8/10/2015, 3:19:19 AM1 votes

FQC should build out of a needlessly large rod.

That solves the problem with it being slot inefficient

Mids still wouldn't buy it because of how long it takes to get it.

Jungle Lux God8/10/2015, 3:19:57 AM1 votes

Well right now there's another good reason not to build Frost Queen's Claim. What reason? It's disabled.

Joking aside, it probably could use some buffs.

Something interesting might be to buff its AP up to the benchmarks left by the AP itemization update, where every core AP item had either 80 or 100 AP. A Frost Queen's Claim with 80 AP would give AP supports the core AP item needed to scale into the mid-game to utilize either your champion's damage (for mage supports) or utility (for utility supports that want to tap into their AP scalings), but at the same time this might cause some of the other lanes to abuse this due to its lower cost compared to other core items.

Then again Twin Shadows doesn't see much play despite being an AP item with solid stats and a gold cost lower than most of the other AP items, so I wouldn't be too sure.

Valhala Warior318/10/2015, 9:19:46 AM1 votes

gg

TheRainInSpain8/10/2015, 5:32:15 PM1 votes

FQC felt really underwhelming. Granted FOTM also felt fairly underwhelming as the game went on (the utility from TOA is always useful), the FQC felt a lot more underwhelming than FOTM. By the time I upgraded my FF to FQC, the damage became negligible I'm still tied to waiting for FQC stacks. An extra 15 damage on spells and AA's when my own AA's are like 80 damage apiece (anyone who build AD have at least 180 damage on their AA's, with at least 250 + crits for assassins and marksmen). The AP value is okay, but as soon as I can pay for it, I'd drop FQC for Athene's or Morello or if I felt like my mana was okay, a big ticket AP item. And yes, even big ticket AP items on Soraka.

Late game I never have a FQC even if I started with the original Blue item. It gets replaced by either a bulk item like Randuin's, or a dedicated AP item or a mixed AP/ManaRegen item. Because, by that time, all those items either keep me alive longer (so allies can engage and mop up a fight), or do more damage (so I can swing a fight or grab a kill).

I thought the point of these items (and likewise with jungle items) is that you keep them all game long instead of selling them for something that is literally outclassing it in all regards. Too many time I've come across a Mage Support or a Support Mage that started with Spellthief's, ends up building FQC, but at the post game lobby, the person sold it for a Luden's, Hourglass, or Rabadon.

Durzaka8/9/2015, 6:23:20 PM1 votes

FQC pays for the extra gold gen it has by having a slightly weaker end game build.

Whereas Talisman has the worst gold gen, but has a great end game active for the team.