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Why does Lissandra have 325 base movement speed?

Talentedco·4/4/2018, 8:19:19 AM·41 votes·3,890 views

I don't care about her mediocre damage, low tankyness or mana cost. What pisses me off most about her is her movement speed when her E is on 24 second cooldown and she's supposed to be a kite mage that dives into fights. Yet master yi, lee sin and pantheon are sitting at 345. Lmao,

....maybe I do care about her 85 mana per Q cost.

Many people point out it's due to her utility so let's compare here to a similar mage (from a 2014 post in old forums):

Karma is a medium ranged mage that has a low cooldown Q that she can use to keep enemies away from her constantly, a tether and a movement speed boosting shield.

She can also burst enemies harder with Mantra Q or choose to heal herself back up for a decent amount or choose to give a whole team a shield.

Lissandra is a short ranged mage who has longer cooldowns overall, except her Q (which in sense is a weaker version of Karma's Q.) She has to put herself in danger to do most of her damage, and her damage in generally not that strong in the first place.

Granted she may provide a lot of utility but she is so squishy and short ranged it's hard for her to actually stay alive to provide it.

Karma also has a movement speed shield that is up more often yet she has better base MS as well.

Karma can use her shield at least twice before Lissandra can cast her claw again.

Obviously, they're different champions, but I feel like it seems a bit unfair, Karma has so many tools to keep people away, while being bulkier than a short ranged mage who tries to provide cc but has trouble doing it because they (referring to Liss here.) are so squishy.

I also hear Riot is looking for new passive ideas. Why not buff her base stats, keep the same passive with it's late game CD (9 seconds) and solidify her identity as a diver control mage with some number changes, her kit doesn't need a rework. I also read a passive suggestion that gives her damage reduction for each champ CCed. That'll make hextech glp core on her!

If Riot wants to keep her as a kiting mage, why not keep her current passive but whatever ability she uses with it is enhanced in an interesting way? (More Q range for that proc, true ice stun on W that's uneffected by tenacity, faster moving E and double healing from ult.)

Just my thoughts and suggestions on a champ I love.

83 Comments

Cynikul4/4/2018, 9:13:20 AM29 votes

Your comparison to Karmas shield is awful. They're two completely different tools and utilities. One is essentially a blink , which she has the OPTION of taking too, while one shields and increases speed- where whatever direction you're going - youre going. Also if youre disabled you cannot move, lissandra has such a long cast that she can take it at the end of a disable usually.

That being said, I do agree her MS needs increased. IDK if you noticed this, but mages always have lower speeds than melee champions or auto attack reliant champions.

InTheory4/4/2018, 8:28:22 AM15 votes

It's due to her constant slows, roots and stuns - even her E that has no CC on it grants her mobility instead. Lissandra needs to have a low Movement Speed for opponents to actually engage and stick on her.

Regaly4/4/2018, 3:46:39 PM7 votes

No, they should not give her more damage (maybe just a little). I main Lissandra and her greatest weakness is burst - which should be. She can do a lot of damage to team in about a second. All of her abilities are AOE. The thing she needs is suvivability to make her effective. The heal on her ult was a good implement but i feel like she needs to have some form of damage reduction or maybe even a small shield. The only way Lissandra is effective right now is because of her team. If a team is shit and don't follow, Lissandra will fall flat. So to better mold her into a team fighting monster she needs to be,they need to give hermore suvivability.

Sukishoo4/4/2018, 3:14:36 PM6 votes

and she's supposed to be a kite mage that dives into fights

According to Riot https://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/gameplay/taking-another-look-subclasses She's a Burst Mage.... doesn't do much burst if you ask me lel.

Anu3isII4/4/2018, 3:07:10 PM4 votes

Karma's only hard CC is a conditional 1 target root. Lissandra has both an AoE root and a point-and-click immediate stun. That is a huge difference in terms of utility.

Anyway, you compare apples and oranges from my point of view. Lissandra is a very aggressive pick for hard engage comps, while Karma is a passive/aggressive pick, that prefers to poke and protect allies. Their roles and kits are very different.

LOSINGISMYPRIDE4/4/2018, 9:34:05 PM4 votes

because she has cold feet . https://i.imgur.com/BbgL7x3.gifhttps://i.imgur.com/BbgL7x3.gif

xPhantomDancerX4/4/2018, 8:35:08 AM4 votes

Because she's cold.

BobaFlautist4/4/2018, 3:05:46 PM3 votes

Because Lissandra has a 1.5s slow on a 6-3s cooldown.

As a general rule, "You aren't allowed to interact with this champion" is something riot tries to avoid.

Revive Aatrox4/5/2018, 3:03:11 AM3 votes

Veigar and Zoe are kite mages ( and burst ) way more effective then Liss is. So annoying. they got like 340 mvm speed... WTF RITO. I do feel you Original poster, Lissandra is slow as F*** and its annoying to slow some one with Q and still not be able to kite them.

NomNomFatCat4/5/2018, 11:12:03 AM2 votes

Honestly i don't know much about balancing. However Lee, Yi and Panth are all meele so i'd say it's fair to give them a slight edge in base movement. Lissandra has a lot of CC option, she can even dash over walls freely which is very powerfull imo. On top of that, movement runes and items are plentifull right now. I can see Lissandra with a Ludens and / or that faster movement speed rune (no idea what's it called but i have it on all mages).

And î oop4/4/2018, 3:13:50 PM2 votes

agree and yes i would add some buffs to her passive like that. some matchups are so hard since enemies can simply stay away from minions so you cant q then and then its just waiting game till level 6 when you can try to e,w,r,q but in many cases that damage is not enough ( amusing since she is burst mage and cant burst a target with all 4 spells ). I hope that riot would keep her burst mage and shift her away from the tanky battle mage since to me it fits her character and lore more

C9 Squeeky 4/4/2018, 4:26:37 PM2 votes

Her E is her only mobility, deals the most damage and has the highest cost. I think they should shift the dmg from E to her Q.

Malicious Metal4/4/2018, 4:44:55 PM2 votes

Why does Mordekaiser have 325 MS then? Huh?

HUH?!

Iręlía4/4/2018, 4:49:10 PM2 votes

She should do more damage to rooted enemys, have higher base movement, nerf damage on E and reset her E on kills or takedowns. Kills and take downs lower the cd of her ult.

AmazoX4/4/2018, 2:53:36 PM2 votes

No Melee character would ever be able to lane against Lissandra if she had high Base MS

Catastrop4/4/2018, 5:39:40 PM1 votes

MS is the last thing that's an issue with Liss.

TheHappyReaperz4/4/2018, 7:28:18 PM1 votes

I would argue that it's Lissandra's Q that keeps her at such low MS. I don't know if it is the reason she has low base MS, but it does allow her, when she has the mana, to pretty much perma-slow someone.