Camille Ultimate is poor gameplay design.

Karn Bishop·11/22/2016, 3:19:12 AM·9 votes·4,902 views

Camille's R Hextech Ultimatum is just terrible design as it stops everything from escaping it including unstoppable ultimates such as Vi R Malphite R and heck even Olaf R whose whole ability is designed to prevent being stopped by ANYTHING, yet now this ability exists which will allow her to completely nullify unstoppables.

Now you might be asking whats the problem with that? the problem with it is that this ability inherently removes important core aspects of certain champions kits and more importantly most of these champions power curves are weakened or punished in some regard to have the right to use an unstoppable ability! yet now there exists a champion that disregards this completely ruining their power curves.

So does that mean i think her ability should be as worthless as jarvans ult? of course not! however high cost abilities or skills that specifically say that they cannot be interfered with should BREAK this ultimate when used such as Vi ulting a mage or carry to escape as a reward for using her skill in the right moment as a show of skill, or a malphite burning ultimate to escape or engage.

In short champions with unstoppables should be rewarded for the proper use of such an ability and a champion like Camille should be punished for wasting her ultimate on someone with such an ability but rewarded for timing it right or using it right after a malphite or vi ult, i mean think about it her ability pushes everyone besides the target away so what could have been a great engage for malphite or vi turns into a 1v 5 suicide due to smart gameplay around established mechanics without ignoring other champions powerful skills just because it is inconvenient for riot to code it.

TL;DR: Unstoppables should break Camille ultimate binding effects thus rewarding the wise use of an unstoppable, or Camille holds her R until after unstoppable is used pushing away all enemies to quickly burst down the now alone unstoppable user dooming them to a quick demise, skill rewarding on BOTH sides instead of one sided favoritism towards Camille.

49 Comments

LadyRenly11/22/2016, 3:32:03 AM4 votes

camilles ult doesnt stop unstoppable ults, they are free to ult anywhere inside her ult

Astôlfo11/22/2016, 3:21:13 AM4 votes

No.

Don't use those abilities in the first place then. Or use it on her and just kill her? Or get your damn team to just follow you into the cage and kill/harrass her?

Sightless6611/22/2016, 3:40:45 AM3 votes

it stops everything from escaping it including unstoppable ultimates

Are you certain? I'm pretty sure that's not how it works. If I understand it correctly, you can use Vi ult, Malph ult, or whatever else to escape the ability perfectly fine. You just get pulled back afterwards.

That would make total sense. You're only unstoppable for the duration of the ability, not following it. The only thing unstoppable was ever meant for was making sure you can't get CC'd out of the ability, not for breaking static effects.

The Deckowner11/22/2016, 3:33:52 AM3 votes

XinZhao I cry when someone got a better version of my ult.

Communist Toast11/22/2016, 3:21:01 AM2 votes

I think it's great, finally something that Can't be stopped.

ValyrianBlade11/22/2016, 3:38:14 AM2 votes

It only sucks when it's your champion, huh?

Jinx's ult was supposed to hit an AOE - if you aim it right it doesn't matter if another champion is there, you'll get the kill. Unless that champion is Yasuo and he just has to throw up windwall.

Loads of champions have dashes that were a balanced part of their kit. Many had real counterplay where you could land a displacement mid-dash and it would interrupt their dash. Even without that, they were balanced around the dashes. Some even have it as their ultimate ability. Poppy doesn't care though.

And now suddenly something breaks what Olaf/Vi/Malphite are supposed to do. How is it any different? BTW, Jarvan's ult already stopped Olaf, so it's not like it's a big change for him.

Honestly, if Camille ults any of those targets, she's really wasting her ult. The ONLY time I can see any of those being viable ultimates is if Vi or Olaf is going to murder your carry and she traps them when they otherwise could not be stopped. If she's actually ulting them to try to get a 1v1 or something they'll just turn and kill her (well, Malphite might just take 2% damage and deal 50%).

A FLUFFY BUNNY 112/21/2016, 4:35:33 AM1 votes

Tahn Kench can W an ulted player and walk out her ult.with them in his mouth

Marshbouy11/22/2016, 3:22:59 AM1 votes

JarvanIV ?

COBRA C0MM4NDER11/22/2016, 3:57:22 AM1 votes

if that ult works like veigar's trap...i cleanse out of that garbage and move on.

The Sword Saint11/22/2016, 3:27:14 PM1 votes

It's good that it stop's 'unstoppable movements'. Without something to keep such abilities in check they cannot be allowed to be too strong since they are too reliable. The ability for the enemy team to potentially counterpick your initiation spell allows for such champions to be tuned higher than otherwise.

Seemingly contradictory rules for abilties is nothing new, just look at any TCG like Magic. Text written on a specific card overrides the core rules, and text on one card that contradicts another card also commonly nullifies the first card based on the wording. Normally a card could be killed according to the rules, but you might have a card with the ability 'cannot be killed by reducing hp below 1' and a second card 'kills any card whose hp drops below 1'. The second card would definitely destroy the first if it had less than 1 hp.

Same case here. 'movement cannot be stopped' is countered by 'cannot be passed by any means, including movement that could not normally be stopped'.

DeathBurst11/22/2016, 4:06:01 PM1 votes

The thing to consider is that only the targeted person is affected. If Camille is ulting a Malphite to the point where he'd want to use his ult defensively to escape her, something has gone horribly bad already. If she spends her ult on a not-priority target, it's good.

I can understand your complaints on general principles, but I am not convinced that it will change a lot of things in practice. Wait and see.

Best Ekko NA11/23/2016, 10:35:25 PM1 votes

{quoted}

Congratulations, you can list off potential strengths in an extreme and slanted way. Congratulations, it also means nothing.

She's really strong on the PBE but not because of her ultimate. Also it's not extreme in the slightest, her W has both sustain & percent health damage which are both highly useful against tanks (but not necessarily all juggernauts). Tanks are high health low damage targets who chip away at other champions health slowly however can take / absorb a lot of damage. These are the type of champions that Camille definitely fights the best. Currently she's a bit too strong at killing everything in general due her skills not quite being balanced just right, but I really doubt they're gonna leave her like she is. Riot already said yesterday that they're removing the true damage crit from her Q (which was stupid op).

In terms of this Thread however, her ult literally is not that powerful. If she ults you when you are ahead, you just turn and kill her. If she ults in a team fight and gets focused, she dies instantly and can't even take out the target she was aiming for. Camille lacks burst, she's a sustained damage champion. Her ultimate is similar to Xin / Jarvan IV but it's definitely not stronger or even close to as effective as either of those two champions. I've played the champion quite a few times now so I know from experience.

Stratigee12/19/2016, 1:39:57 AM1 votes

this is the same as saying that banshees veil shouldnt exist because it stops champs like veigar from 1 shotting, which is their primary purpose. Camille's ult isnt game breaking, its just something to play around. the same way a normally mobile champ has to play around Vi's ult or a champ with hard cc has to play around malph's ult.

Requiemsfire11/22/2016, 3:23:28 AM1 votes

If it can kill Vayne I'm happy.