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Jungler's Influence on Top Lane

Warlord Dienekes·2/21/2018, 11:10:58 PM·14 votes·1,286 views

So, no bones about it. I hate the current relationship between Jungle and Top. Whether I'm winning or losing seems, to me, to be decided far more by how often I either get ganked or have my ally gank than anything I'm actually doing.

Now that doesn't necessarily mean it's true. For example, I am not a particularly skilled player, and perhaps there is more I can be doing to avoid the deaths caused by getting ganked. To me, it seems to be roughly 50% of the time I can avoid death from a gank if I play it right. Perhaps if I was better I could get that number down to the 30s. But for reference I don't know how often do top ganks end in deaths in high ranks.

That's the purpose of the thread, mostly. Is there any metric that I can use to see just how much influence the Jungler has on Top? I know that will be pretty hard, since Top winning or losing lane doesn't mean victory or defeat for the entire game. But I was curious to see if there was something that can be pointed to, to show just how much influence jungler has on Top even being fun.

And, what do people think about the influence of junglers? I know years back people were saying Top is too much of an island. Something I vehemently disagreed with back then. Now that the island is pretty much gone, what to players think. Do they like it, or do they not? Are you better at coordinating with their jungler to really make those ganks work for you? Or are they the overburdening annoyance that they are for me?

14 Comments

Ralik0982/22/2018, 3:53:49 PM3 votes

Junglers decide top lane more often than top laners do.

Verxint2/22/2018, 12:08:16 PM3 votes

I still do not for the life of me understand why junglers can get level 3 and gank top lane while the laners are still level 2.

Yenn2/22/2018, 8:43:33 AM2 votes

Top is still an island, unless you've lost the lane so badly that you can be dived at zero risk after dragon.

I have 64% win rate on Udyr over ~95 games, and I haven't had a single successful gank on top that couldn't have been stopped if the enemy player was just better. You literally have to be pushed in without wards, which is stupid, because you're going to be ganked at roughly the same time in every single game.

After that small window at level 3-4, I have to go secure dragon and won't be able to come top again unless I know the enemy team can't take it while I'm there. Usually the lane is already over by the time I can go top side again.

Ixoziel2/21/2018, 11:24:07 PM2 votes

I mean, yeah. At higher elos it will then become about which midlaner roams and helps you more. Thing is, it's a team game and the jungler is typically the one responsible for ganking lanes, especially early. Whether he chooses to gank your lane or not and what the enemy jungler decides to do will determine how your lane goes.

Mid is the exact same way unless both champs pick safe farming champions in which case both junglers just ignore it entirely. Bot is a bit different because there are two people in the lane and 3v2 is more feasible than 1v2 (although still very difficult / nearly impossible unless huge screwups are made).

GULAG 4 U2/22/2018, 9:09:36 PM1 votes

hahAA, every top game I played last week i got camped : (

Shablagoo2/22/2018, 10:42:40 PM1 votes

Jungle does this with every lane it isnt just top, stop acting like top is the only place where this happens.

jadelink2/22/2018, 7:34:30 AM1 votes

The same usually applies to all lanes. A lane that gets regular visits from a competent jungler usually wins. Bot gets a little more agency in its ability to ward out its zone better, but it's also the recipient of way more 4-5 man crash dives in lane phase. Bot laners dont like this, but it isn't going to cease until ADC scaling stops being the default win condition for mid-lategame.

As for surviving them, most current meta junglers aren't particularly great gankers, especially early. The udyr/skarner/shyvanas have no wall leap, or gap close, they just run fast at you. Top laners are particularly at risk at the lvl 3 jungler window, then the jg has double buffs and a lvl up on them. It's only common sense to have your ward out a little pre 3 mins, and not make any aggressive plays from 3 mins till the next jungler sighting. (unless you know they started top).

If a Jungler wants to camp me hard in top, I'm not that unhappy, I ward up and play paranoid, but still lose lane, I just hope bot wins due the jg being top all the time. Then I get to watch my victorious lane opponent be ritually sacrificed to my ADC, provided I play tight and hang on to tower long enough.

Sun Wu Ryuumoku2/22/2018, 3:37:43 PM1 votes

Most of time, when i die to a gank its my fault. Mainly when its the FAMOUS gank lv2. and i didn't ward. As toplaner u should develop your sens and know when you'll be ganked, and see when top behavior change.

But yeah u depend more or less from jungler... mainly for vision ( im a player who buy many vision controle, but still depend on the vision provided buy sup/jng)

Hügö2/22/2018, 5:11:04 PM1 votes

The power of a jungler comes from the stupidty of the laners. Laner pushes to hard without knowing where the jungler is? The laner is stupid and the jungler gets more of a threat for him. He pushes and knows where the jungler is? The junglers becomes less of a threat to him.