Jungle is by far the worst it has ever been

pwc2016·12/10/2019, 5:11:34 AM·45 votes·14,687 views

Who thought this was even a good idea?

Let's think about it:

You have a role that is designed to not be in a lane. Instead it is designed to get lanes ahead. Ok, that's fine. Create 2 v 1's or 3 v 2's in order to get lanes ahead, rather than just have the game be a display of laning prowess. But this is really, really bad. Like, the idea's fine, but the way it works is not, especially with exp nerfs.

The problem with this role is that, right now especially, there is no way to do anything on your own as a jungler. Tell me, other than camps or dragon/herald, what can you do solo? You are entirely reliant on your laners in order to do anything. This is even worse this season, as, think about this scenario:

You're a jungler. You've hit level 4, and by that time, enemy mid or top is probably 6. Well, you're gonna have a big problem here. Because even if you 2 v 1, there's a pretty good chance they will just focus you and turn the 2 v 1 into a 1 for 1 kill trade.

I know lots of people say that "but jungle is the best role to climb with, you have the most control".

Why doesn't jungle have control over the map? Well, for example, setting up a good gank often requires good gank setup. That often requires laners to understand wave management, how to positon well, when to fight, etc. But low elo-that's not happening. Most of the time, your lanes in low elo will just mindlessly push. Always. Both laners are eternally pushing. Guess what happens if lanes are always pushing? Tower dives. But guess what? It's low elo, so the chances of a good tower dive are pretty low. Sure, maybe you get the kill, but it'll still probably be a 1 for 1. Prio also plays a part in map control, but again, that doesn't work when lanes are too dumb to recognize what to do. I mean, in my Kindred game, mid had prio and should have responded to me fighting Amumu, as we could have easily won. Did she? No. Because jungle is ultimately entirely reliant on laners. Is a lane feeding? You can't gank that lane, espeically now that jungle has less exp, a lot of champions dont' have too hard a time 1 v 2ing from ahead. That's out of your control, you can't gank that lane. Did you make a play that's theoretically good (i.e. vertical jungling when you have prio in mid or the nearest lane)? Well, it might end up costing you because you depend on your laners to do anything. I know a lot of people will say "but smurfs climb out of low elo all the time playing jungle, it's obviously good at carrying". No, it's not. A player in bronze should have bronze level skills, unlike a smurf in bronze who might have Diamond level skills. Of course the diamond player will climb. But that doesn't mean a bronze player will, because a bronze is matched with players of equal skill. Not only this, but you could say that for literally any role-Bang went to NA and climbed out of Iron (even he lost some games in Iron though). Smurfs will climb no matter the role. Comparing a smurf to a regular player isn't really a valid way to say a role is strong or weak on its own.

I just think jungle is WAY too dependent on laners. Lane feeding? Can't gank. Have prio and make a play? Risk dying if your laners are bad. You can't solo kill anybody, or do anything on your own.

78 Comments

Baelim12/10/2019, 5:18:11 AM14 votes

Unfortunately on these boards you are preaching to the wrong choir. The xp changes hit hard. But the post you made, or the reply I'm writing do not matter to the now "rito make many games, care not for fanbase that made we". They only balance for their precious esports.

RhastaFhasta12/10/2019, 5:51:22 AM9 votes

Yeah riot don't care anymore since they got bought out by china money

Wolfeur12/10/2019, 10:56:10 AM6 votes

Someone wasn't jungling prior to season 5, it seems

NumberOneBaller12/10/2019, 10:18:07 AM6 votes

Rito is a garbage company where devs don't play their own game. It will die soon to due to malpractice and so will their awful Esport scene.

Slitorous12/10/2019, 10:04:56 PM4 votes

All we need to do is NERF SOLO LANES and the game will be balanced again

Yenn12/10/2019, 6:36:52 AM4 votes

The dragon change also gutted the viability of any jungle who can't safely kill dragon early, further restricting the jungle roster.

WoonStruck12/10/2019, 6:07:16 AM4 votes

The ONLY thing wrong with jungle right now is Dragon souls and Elder dragon.

Both add nothing to the game and only create frustrating experiences that basically force you to lose, even in close games.

Baron is supposed to be a game-ending buff. Dragon Souls and Elder Dragon are just powercreep to the max.

Outside of that, solo lane exp needs to be nerfed.


Oh, and dragon HP being way too low now. They need to increase its damage and health. Maybe resists too. It should take a team effort. At least 3 people to take it down in a reasonable amount of time.

Skia Asteri12/10/2019, 3:32:48 PM3 votes

Hi, you must be new. Pre-season 5 jungle was worse than this. The majority of players (or so it seemed based on the number of complaints on the boards) could not even solo their camps, much less do anything else without help. Though that had more to do with players being use to the season 4 jungle where camps did no damage and had no hp than the actual difficulty.

IVSakenz12/10/2019, 4:17:17 PM3 votes

I agree, the low elo's are pretty horrible when it comes to any kind of back-up for a jungler..

I am amazed if i can even get a leash, let alone a ward or some help if opfor invades..

It seems the laners expect you to win their lane for them.. Or even worse, try to blame the jungler for getting ganked.. when they are pushing to tower at level 3 or 4 and the opposing team has a shaco jungle...

of course you are going to get ganked if you push too early!!!

Atlas92312/10/2019, 8:32:08 PM3 votes

I agree with literally everything you said as I have also been running into a problem with jungle. Anyone that plays the game a lot realizes that junglers are extremely underleveled throughout laning phase which makes you basically a free kill if the enemy mid and or top laner decides to invade on you. Other lanes in your game that are losing make your job twice as hard due to how underleveled you are even in your own jungle which has led to me getting ran up on any competent laner with a lead. In its current state jungle can no longer compete with laners who have even a slight lead whereas previously invading a jungler required teamwork and competency. I think riot was trying to encourage junglers to focus more on lanes and objectives given the pre-season changes but they definitely missed the mark and ended up crippling the role as a whole.

Ikeinator12/10/2019, 6:32:53 AM3 votes

Yeah the new dragon system is horrible. if you can't take and contest dragons its almost a guaranteed game over because the dragon soul buffs are so strong.

Hi im 1212/10/2019, 8:53:25 AM3 votes

Tell me, other than camps or dragon/herald, what can you do solo? You are entirely reliant on your laners in order to do anything. This is even worse this season, as, think about this scenario:

just play ww kha or lee 4head

You've hit level 4, and by that time, enemy mid or top is probably 6.

go on proguides and watch a pathing guide or something

setting up a good gank often requires good gank setup

uhhhh not in low elo

your lanes in low elo will just mindlessly push

this is good for you, learning to set up counter ganks and dives will put you in dia easily.

A player in bronze should have bronze level skills, unlike a smurf in bronze who might have Diamond level skills.

yes, and that bronze player should stay bronze not climb

RebeccaUCuber12/10/2019, 1:07:14 PM3 votes

I really like your points. And guess what? Being autofilled jungle is so common now because you have 0 agency in contesting objectives! The objectives you should manage freely since you're the freaking jung!!! If u can sneaky take a drake or an herald it means: -Elo is low so objectices aren't permawarded. -You MUST have a jungler with enough sustain and clear. Maybe not Herald, but if you cant solo drake at lv 4 usually your champ is not good. Why on earth anyone would play this role? Like i said in another post, if u cant get fed in early by setting a tent in a (bot) lane, you end up being a weird second support with a spell to secure jungle Drakes and Baron.

That's it.

LordGeovanni12/10/2019, 6:22:05 PM2 votes

junglers and the community at large are stupid. most problems with this game are riot makes adcs and mages (burst and dps characters basiclly) too strong. Ardent censer meta thats adcs being busted and supports giving little buffs that effected everyone else little but adcs a ton. Jungle spam ganking bot i just want to farm adcs are broken got to try to get my adc ahead so we have a chance to win (when its not adc its the mid mage / assassin) you literally call attention to yourself by being so fucking strong then cry when everything is happening in your lane that you cant just leisurely farm to your IE Zeal powerspike Omg i die in CC tanks are so op Maybe the problem isnt the 1.5 second (which both mages and adcs have and contribute to) cc lessended by tenacity but rather that the adc/ mage is bursting you in 1.5 seconds through your defenses.