Suggestions for Yasuo Changes

TheUnrepentant·3/15/2019, 8:09:27 PM·12 votes·9,126 views

Tl;dr a discussion of possible Yasuo changes.

Yasuo has been super frustrating to deal with for as long as I've played League. Most people would say since his release. This thread is devoted to ideas that could help with that without actually dumpstering him.

First thought: make windwall move. Make it move away from Yasuo at a decent clip such that it is no longer a static wall that requires little thought to use and denies agency to his enemies, but instead the Yasuo player has to think about when and how to use it. It would mean that walking through the windwall suddenly becomes a more viable counter play option. As a downside if you want to kite Yasuo a moving windwall helps him (so I would actually suggest it move faster rather than slower to shorten the window of frustration).

Second thought: make windwall able to be cancelled by an enemy champion moving through the model. This would open up counter play to windwall in a different way and again require the Yasuo to think about when and where he uses it. It would be harder for squishier champions to play against (but no harder than it is currently), but easier for tanks (and thus make team fighting healthier). Dashing through it to deactivate it (blinking/flashing wouldn't count), would be a meaningful choice.

Third thought: make windwall able to be deactivated by the impact of a certain number of abilities or autos. Much like a Yorick prison or sort of like a Braum shield. This would again reduce the team fighting impact of windwall but still make windwall hard to deal with in laning phase or smaller skirmishes. The downside for mages becomes fairly obvious.

Fourth thought: give Yasuo mana. Keep the cost of his q and e low as they're supposed to be spammed anyway (and he'd hardly be there first champion with mana that wants to spam). But put a high mana cost on his w. This would result in more meaningful choices about when to use it. And since the mana regen nerfs he'd have to slow down his spam somewhat. He could build towards Muramana but that would mean actually delaying his power spike which would be healthier. This probably results in builds I've not thought about, but I still think it's an interesting direction and he has more meaningful build choices to make. If it was desired to keep Yasuo from building mana items or it was thought that mana restricted him too much then energy could be tried (personally I'd like to see all champions have some sort of a resource to manage but I digress).

Fifth thought: take away Yasuo's doubled crit chance. I understand Riot may want to keep this as it is almost a unique thing (Tyrndamere comes close to the same thing) but it would force more meaningful choices of build if he didn't cap crit after two items. This would again force him to buy crit if he wants crit and keep him from stacking items like Sterak's Gage, Guardian Angel, and Frozen Mallet without having to sacrifice crit items or life steal.

I think all of these have potential and would like to hear other people's thoughts on these or other possible changes. My personal choice would be both 4 and 2.

Please keep discussion limited to changes as I don't think Rito would consider deleting the champion. Please keep this respectful and maybe if the stars line up it'll get seen by someone before it is dismissed.

Adding poll on options.

21 Comments

doodlebob6663/16/2019, 12:43:19 AM5 votes

all these are massive nerfs and would mean that yasuo would need large buffs since he isnt even doing that well rn, removing the double crit would probably be the worst change since that would mean that, after he is buffed back into viability he would build like a bruiser after the changes, and tank yasuo is far more unhealthy than his current iteration

Karunamon3/16/2019, 7:39:24 AM4 votes

Suggestions for Yasuo Changes

..will be ignored, as is tradition.

And in this case, shat on by moderators.

Motoriffic3/16/2019, 3:10:15 AM4 votes

Here's my 2 cents.... throw him in the bin next to that microsoft office paper clip helper dude

ModWulf Helhammer3/15/2019, 10:22:10 PM4 votes

Literally none of these are good ideas.

Disulfiram3/16/2019, 7:56:12 AM3 votes

Imho 4 and 5 are not good ideas because they would change the fundamentals of how Yasuo is played or built...

Also, imho Windwall is the principal reason why he's so hated, and is thus what should be changed.

I mean: Lucian has incredible mobility for dodging spells, even better than Yasuo's, but he's not nearly as hated as Yasuo is. There's also plenty of champions who can output even more damage than Yasuo with few items, and they too are not nearly as hated as he is. And there are even manaless hypermobile hyperdamaging champions named Riven who, while having quite the hatedom, are still not nearly as hated as he is.

This leaves Windwall as the only possible explanation and most suited target for a rework.

Some time ago I posted a different idea: what if his W was his Tornado instead?

The increased reliability of his tornado (no need to "charge" it + doesn't expire = less feast or famine + can actually farm from range) would be a straight up buff, and if it isn't enough to compensate for the loss of Windwall, then he can be buffed further: for example with a simple numbers buff, or even something a bit crazy like making his Tornado cancel projectiles (would keep the reactionary safety that his Windwall provides at the moment without zoning half of the enemy team out of the teamfight).

ThreshHub3/15/2019, 9:50:05 PM3 votes

I suggested a change for his wall in a recent post of mine. Basically the wall is smaller and instantly disappears when it reaches it's max distance but to compensate the cooldown is lower and it can block towershots.

PokladnicaZla3/16/2019, 10:01:28 AM2 votes

Make Windwall start in front of him,not behind him and cut his duration by 50% at all ranks. It's too strong of a teamfight tool. At max rank it lasts 4 seconds,while defending a whole team from skillshots.

Bârd3/16/2019, 5:35:00 AM2 votes
  1. That'd be pretty great. Would force Yasuo to think when he plays around his windwall, while simultaneously opening up some potential plays, since he can now play around his Windwall on the move.
  2. This does nothing for the ranged champions who already struggle against it, while making his bruiser matchups (which are already bad) even worse. It also makes the spell absolutely useless in teamfights.
  3. This opens up far too many hard counters.
  4. This would just feel terrible.
  5. Do you want Bruiser Yasuo? Because that's how you get Bruiser Yasuo.

So you have one good idea and four terrible ones.

Hemulen Magi3/16/2019, 5:34:45 PM2 votes

I voted for: A different suggestion But I upvoted the thread because I think it's a good thing that you're trying to brainstorm ideas. I don't like the idea of removing Yasuo's double crit, because that would probably just homogenize his build with other skirmishers.

I think tweaking the windwall could be a good plan, but I think it probably just needs a short cast time (0.2 seconds) before it begins blocking projectiles, or it could appear farther away from him when it is cast. I don't really like seeing unique utility on champions weakened, because I've seen that usually results in more brute strength added back to a champion as compensation in the future.

I'd say totally remove the armor pen from his ultimate and see where that leaves him for now.

His Q could also be reclassified as an 'Energized Attack' or given a new interaction to open up item 3095 in his itemization. Seems like that item fits him thematically, and if he wants to slow enemies, he should pick item 3095 instead of item 3022.

I think Yasuo should also have his base AD significantly nerfed and item 3022 should grant %base AD like item 3053. That might be able to push those out of Yasuo's build. That would make item 3022 firmly a juggernaut and heavy diver item, not a slayer item.

If the base AD nerfs are significant, then he might need actually need compensation, so maybe he could have his ultimate changed to loosen its requirements. He could have access to use a weaker version of his ultimate with a shorter cast range without the enemy being knocked up, and still require a knockup for his 'enhanced' (aka current) ultimate.

ORB1TS3/16/2019, 5:40:44 PM2 votes

As a Yasuo and Zed main I think everything here is fine except getting rid of his double crit chance and giving him mana. Giving him mana with spamable ability's would feel clunky and he already has a reduction on crit dmg he does so taking his double crit chance away would just gut him. Instead I suggest nerfing his armor pin on his ult.

BlackEyesBlue3/16/2019, 6:41:39 PM2 votes

Now that there are MULTIPLE champions with more then two bars?

Just give Yasuo mana! There now he's completely fixed and gets punished for over spamming in lane like everyone else!

SeaWeaboo3/17/2019, 6:55:31 AM1 votes

I like your suggestions but this is an ability that outright counters everything except someone dashing through it or something along those lines. I would much rather see this ability removed from Yasuo. I think that Wind Wall would be better received if it was on some support champ but I don't really think an ability that eats 99% of everything in the game is really healthy. If it were to stay as is, I like option 2 but I think more brainstorming would be needed to make this ability actually fit in the game properly.

Snoar3/16/2019, 9:27:15 PM1 votes

In my Opinion, Yasuo does not need any changes in his current state, other than having his windwall stay a static length, rather than getting bigger the more you level it up. I have almost 200k points on yasuo, (yes i know, i know, Im an evil person) and I believe he is more of a problem in low-elo rather than in High-elo. Yasuo's ban rate is 8% higher in Low-elo. I do not think he should get any changes, but rather people should try to learn how to face him better. Yasuo has many counters, and its not an unwinnable game if the enemy chooses yasuo. I think he is in a balanced spot.

NY643/16/2019, 1:34:03 AM1 votes

I’m not 100% on board with the mana change. What would his starting mana, mana per level, mana regen, and mana regen per level be? I know that’s a hard question to answer but what would be a general answer for a champion like Yasuo?

Monlyth3/16/2019, 10:09:31 PM1 votes

I have a different suggestion: Remove the armor penetration on his ult. Make it so that building armor counters him. This reduces Yasuo's snowballing potential and makes tanks/bruisers a more reliable counter to him.

JnFnRu3/16/2019, 10:36:35 PM1 votes

I say make his Wind Wall disappear after 1 hit so the Yas player has to think carefully which ability to use it on.

I also do believe Morganas Shield should only disable 1 cc ability while we are at it and then continue to give a magic resist shield.