Out of 46 midlaners, the top 17 in win rates are all considered not viable in LCS.

ApplyForAGrant·2/27/2015, 10:10:52 PM·67 votes·12,483 views

http://champion.gg/statistics/#?sortBy=general.winPercent&order=descend&roleSort=Middle

This is based on Plat and Diamond solo que games.

Yes, win rate can be skewed by popularity and difficulty, but most of the Top 17 either have decent solo que pick rate (Katarina, Annie) or are fairly difficult (Anivia, Vel'koz, Karthus).

Maybe it's time we stop copying what's played in the LCS.

P.S. This chart shows midlane win rate ONLY, so e.g. Annie and Morg support games are not counted. Also, the chart is based on 5.3 data, but I don't see how Kassadin and Veigar becoming shit-tier is going to change my point.

54 Comments

Kingsgrave2/27/2015, 10:46:26 PM35 votes

LCS and Solo Queue are becoming two drastically different games. Wouldn't be surprised if this continues.

Wheatloaf2/27/2015, 11:57:55 PM25 votes

Vel'Koz is love, Vel'Koz is life.

mjack332/28/2015, 9:20:45 AM6 votes

Things in Solo Queue that don't exist in the LCS:

  • The "I got it first" mentality you develop in kindergarten in EVERY queue that doesn't involve draft, followed by the "I don't care I'm taking that lane anyways" in 1 in 8 solo queues.

  • Too many people don't ward. Like...... that's just it. Between the "it's the support's job" mentality that was idiotic back even WHEN it was kind of the supports job (but no, it never was a one man job; that's idiotic in itself), and the fact that people don't even bother to upgrade their trinket WHEN THEY HAVE FULL BUILD AND 1000's OF GOLD....... yeah. Warding is nonexistent at lower elos. Like, people don't even use the free trinket they pick up for some reason past laning phase.

  • People duo top. And then you get the whiny top who can't play their champ well enough to defend against that, so either we lose top lane or the jungler can't jungle and is down a summoner spell and good-ish item slot.

  • People can't jungle. You ever lose because you had a duo top? If the opposing top is competent, that happens.

  • People who can't play mid, adc, or support. I know it's fun to play adc vlad, but it's not a good idea.

  • Trolling.

  • People being abusive to their teammates in chat to the point of ruining team performance.

  • AFKing

  • People who start games when they know they have to leave in 10 minutes.

  • People playing champs they aren't good with.

  • People playing champs they don't main.

  • People playing champs that are considered "not a safe pick".

  • People are stupidly aggressive to the point of giving the lane away by dying too much.

  • People are not aggressive enough and completely miss opportunities (sometimes leaving a teammate that should have lived to die).

  • People who don't even know the meaning of the word "teamwork".

  • People who don't pay attention to the minimap.

  • People who think it's a good idea for 2 or 3 people to go invade level 1 and do this EVERY GAME.

  • People who take things that aren't FLASH.

  • People without min-maxed rune pages and masteries.

  • Bad team comps.

  • "Troll picks". Basically anything like adc Vladimir (freaking 3 times this happened to me today).

  • People who steal cs from champs that NEED it, like the adc or top-lane Nasus.

  • People who push lanes that then go FUBAR because that was Nasus's or Veigar's lane and now they can't farm.

  • People who steal first camp from jungler.

  • People who don't know what items are optimal on their champ.

  • People who build the same 6 item full build every single game.

  • People who take stupid items, like Trinity Force on an Ashe.

  • Intentionally feeding / assisting of enemy team.

  • People who are never present in team fights.

  • Queue Dodging.

  • Game modes that are not draft based and/or that exist on other maps than Summoner's Rift.

  • People who take baron and/or dragon without accounting for the enemy team and then give away 3 kills + objective.

  • People who steal camps from their jungler.

  • People who obviously can't counterjungle but keep trying anyways.

  • People who roam too much, causing their lane to suffer.

  • People who back too much, casuing their lane to suffer.

  • another 23 things that get cut off by the char limit

Kapparoth2/27/2015, 10:24:34 PM5 votes

I'm sure due to the fairly strong recent buffs, that not only will Diana see a lot more play in higher Leagues, I wouldn't be surprised if she seems some spotlight in the LCS as opposed to her current nonexistent play in the LCS.

Yandere Carry2/27/2015, 11:59:23 PM2 votes

"morg and annie support games are not counted" says who

SleepyLionCub2/27/2015, 10:47:58 PM2 votes

Actually, with this tibbers buff i can see annie going to the lcs soon. It raised her skillcap somewhat and made her have even more potential.

COWmanLord2/28/2015, 8:20:36 AM2 votes

I guess the main reasoning is that LCS players only pick from the very top champions, and only the ones that work with their teams strategies. For example lookout at moakai. In Solo que he isn't the best option top just because he has low carry potential as a pretty much full tank. However if you watch TSM Dyrus picks him all the time in LCS games. On a 5 man team communication is a lot better and there is much more group oriented strategy involved.

SlackerboyTC2/28/2015, 6:26:10 PM1 votes

This just goes to show you don't center a game around competitive play.

manbearswine2/28/2015, 6:43:23 PM1 votes

You forget that by this logic ashe(as far as solo q goes) is stronger than graves.

Are you sure that you want to stick with this approach?

SEKAI2/28/2015, 7:29:22 PM1 votes

Win rate by itself doesn't really mean anything in yolo queue since there is pick and ban rate skewing, and ofc, your own teammates. Same thing applies to enemy team, it's 10 separate entities per match.

Then in pro scene, there are only 2.

So things work differently.

SociopathFriend2/28/2015, 8:48:36 PM1 votes

Is it bad that my 2 favorite mid champs are in the top 4 of that list?

Don't let Riot know Malz is good, I've been playing him for years and he's largely under-appreciated untill he murders the enemy.

mjack332/28/2015, 11:27:36 PM1 votes

This is a new post entirely because I wanted to make a very different point.

{quoted}

Are these bad things? Because I always play solo Q on new champs i've bought. See, way I see it, if I've played Yasuo mid for like 50 games, and I understand how mid lane works, I can learn another champ there easily. Like, say for instance, Ahri.

Unless it's Leblanc. She's stupid.

Not everything in the list is supposed to be a bad thing, although this would most certainly be frowned upon in ranked.

The idea of my post (and I was not joking about how many things got cutoff and I had to edit.....) is that the LCS is an environment where everyone takes very safe picks, everyone knows their champs EXTREMELY well, everyone works together as a team, and it's generally the highest level of play. Even then, win rates are not necessarily a good indicator, even in LCS, due to the statistical effects of ban rates (i.e. sometimes if a heavily banned champ is not banned, there are specific reasons for that that decrease the statistical value of that event).

Throw in a crap ton of other things that almost certainly DONT happen in the LCS, and the already sketchy importance of win rates goes out the window. In the specifically quoted two examples, the more popular a champ is, the more likely it is that someone who can't play them will try to pick them and do well anyways. LeeSin and Zed are good examples of this. Those people are going to have a MUCH different win rate than someone who is REALLY GOOD at the champ at their same elo. But those people are still included in the overall win rates, since it's a pain to put in things like "win rate for people who have played at least 20 games with the champ recently", even before we get to all the really negative shit people do in ranked that just makes you lose.

Effectively, the statistics of this are too prone to error to be worth proving arguments, and this becomes more of an issue the more problematic a champion is. It's also affected by ranks too...

Let's just look at the most popular and least popular champs. For all ranks, in ranked solo queue, the most popular champs are: Graves, Jinx, Thresh, Leona, Morgana, Lee Sin, Blitzcrank, Vi, Caitlyn, and Annie. For master and challenger, this changes to Graves, Thresh, Janna, Lee Sin, Ahri, Morgana, Vi, Jarvan IV, Leblanc, and Lissandra. Half of those changed.....

For win rates at all ranks, the highest are Heimerdinger, Sion, Sejuani, Blitzcrank, Katarina, Vi, Malzahar, Fiddlesticks, Jinx, and Annie. But only 4 of those are over 20% popularity... that's a big difference. So if you wanted a popular champion with a high win rate across all ranks, you might want to pick Blitzcrank, Vi, Jinx, or Annie.

Let's move to master + challenger again. Highest win rates in ranked are Karthus, Miss Fortune, Tryndamere, Shen, Warwick, Aatrox, Elise, Kog'maw, Kayle, and Nunu. Tryndamere is the only one there that breaks 3% popularity. None of them are popular whatsoever, and the list is blatantly different from who is popular by.. a lot.

All of this is just me trying to show that statistics here are pointless after a "well that's interesting" when it comes to trying to prove something. Win rate really isn't that good of an indicator. At all levels, there is only a tiny level of overlap between popularity (and how hated someone is), and their win rates, and at the highest levels these two things are drastically different This is why win rates vs balance isn't very useful in very general terms, especially when the op is quoting older statistics. He is also including the "bad" people at Diamond.

WolfChases2/28/2015, 11:51:36 PM1 votes

LCS is not even close to SoloQ, that's basicly a different game and I am pissed because riot is buffing/nerfing according to champ win rate in LCS.

For example SoloQ Elise and Le Blanc were not OP but nah, Riot literally DELETED Elise from this game and removed LB's Silence (No i have NEVER played LB). SoloQ Zed is not even close to OP, atleast not for me because I can easily lane against him, I know that I can play Lissandra mid, I know that I can play Viktor or Swain mid against Zed and I don't care if Swain mid isn't viable in LCS which is making Zed so strong for them....I know that I can play Swain mid and annihilate Zed any time, I know that I can play Riven mid and make Zed useless but that's SoloQ. To bad Riot is going to nerf all those strong LCS champions leaving them DELETED and close to non viable in SoloQ.

Wardism3/1/2015, 1:52:04 AM1 votes

you have to take into account popularity as well as win rate.

HandheldBrandon2/28/2015, 12:48:59 PM1 votes

You also failed to mention their pick rate.

Most of which are under 2 percent. Champions who get picked little but do well will always have an inflated win rate.

In that list Katarina are the only exceptions and Annie very regularly sees pro play.

CoolKnightST2/28/2015, 1:06:40 PM1 votes

Notice that most of them are also played in different roles:

Heimerdinger : Top > Mid > Support Annie : Support > Mid > Top Velkoz : Support > Mid Malzahar : Top > Mid Katarina : Mid > Top > (Support) Kennen : Top > Mid > Adc etc...

Champion Skin2/28/2015, 2:25:06 PM1 votes

Well.... champions with a low pick % and high win rate... might only be picked by people who are very good at the champion and or only in situations which these champions excel

Oh... poor Veigar, Kassadin and Azir.. and it looks like Akali and Ryze aren't very good mid lane either...

Jeddy0172/28/2015, 3:01:53 PM1 votes

Who cares what's viable in the LCS?I can play whatever champs I want in whatever ideal roles I want.Hey,I said IDEAL as in roles that they can perform well on. I don't determine what I play by what people who I don't know play.

AFK Push2/28/2015, 3:23:20 PM1 votes

What is even worse is that only 10 support picks have over 50% win rate, and what is even scarier is the pick rate of certain champions such as Blitzcrank and Janna which are over 20%. We need much more diversity for support champs, but I think we need a support item overhaul for anything like that to happen.

Father Cthulhu2/28/2015, 5:06:26 PM1 votes

Kat, Talon, Morg, Anivia, and Ahri are ALL considered viable. They've all been played in LCS this year.