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AP item from Quicksilver Sash

Amish Jew··3 votes·1,839 views

I know this has been mentioned before, but I'd like to see QSS build into something other than a flat AD item. QSS is a good item on almost any carry, AP or AD, and it would be nice to be able to build it on someone like Fiddlesticks and be able to complete a final item. The skepticisms I've seen before are that AP champions already have Zhonya's, but the two items are entirely different. Being able to remove hard CC can be crucial against certain teams. Zhonya's simply can't do that for you. Let me know what you think!

15 Comments

Siachi2 votes

Well I remember seeing someone, just today, post a thread basically saying "If a QSS AP item ever came out, Malzahar would be rendered immediately useless." Not sure if that's the same guy, but probably for a similar reasoning.

Toby Flenderson1 votes

Thats actually a great point

Marthian1 votes

And Warwick. Yes it would render them "useless" but considering their ults have no counterplay outside of QSS... (delays build/damage) Their ults need reworked and given counterplay (Malzahar uninterrupted gets a free kill, and Warwick is impossible to escape if you have no wall jumping abilities.)

xDingwithsalad1 votes

i let you know what i thought. no.

Amish Jew1 votes

Would you mind explaining why you feel that way? I'm looking for feedback :)

xDingwithsalad1 votes

AP already has access to quite a few, very strong items that AD does not. I don't think there should be an "equal" item for AP, since AD don't really have access to healing debuffs like Morello's or anything like Zhonyas. Let it be seperate.

Toto Masako1 votes

AP already has access to quite a few, very strong items that AD does not. I don't think there should be an "equal" item for AP, since AD don't really have access to healing debuffs like Morello's or anything like Zhonyas. Let it be seperate.

Okay, if we go that route then tell me why in competitive play people go for QSS instead of those that you mention? Would be for a reason.

xDingwithsalad1 votes

Because QSS is a good item? lol i'm not sure how that counters any point of mine.

ZombeezyJeezy1 votes

Sure.

7ha7guy7771 votes

wouldn't this make galio stronger since qss is a mr item?

JustMyBassCannon1 votes

It has been mentioned before.

Do you know what else has been mentioned? The idea of an AD Zhonya's Hourglass.

Interestingly enough, Balance does not mean mirrored items.

There isn't an AD Rod of Ages. There isn't an AP Atma's. There isn't an AD Rabadon's. There isn't an AP Infinity Edge. There isn't an AD WotA. There isn't an AP Zeke's Herald.

Espy Psyche1 votes

The reason there is no need for an AD Zhonya's is because AD is used for consistent damage, not burst damage.

Yes, I'm aware some AD champions can burst, but most AD champions pump out consistent damage. It doesn't matter whether it's a marksman or a melee carry or a bruiser, they still do consistent damage over burst. Because of this, a Zhonya active is not as useful on AD champions as it is on AP champions, and for the few AD champions that would want a Zhonya active, it's extremely overpowered to the point that they would be banned every match.

Talon, Zed, and Kha'zix come to mind immediately as the champions that would abuse an AD Zhonya. It's only these three champions, because they're the only AD champions that favor burst over consistent damage. Once given one, they would be unstoppable. The only reason they don't use the current AP Zhonya just for the active is because they benefit more from Bloodthirster and Black Cleaver. They would buy it every game and make the must ban every game list. Riot would start nerfing them, but they would remain overpowered until they were gutted and made unplayable.

However, an AP Mercurial Scimitar wouldn't do this. It would definitely make Akali and Fizz stronger, because they could clear a CC and keep going. Katarina would be mostly unaffected because her ult would still be interrupted when it landed. However, already-appropriate nerfs to Akali and Fizz would bring them back in line after the item's introduction. They would need harder nerfs than without it, but they could be nerfed without being made unplayable because of the item's existence.

And FYI, many of those items do have "mirrors" in a way.

Rabadon's Deathcap and Infinity Edge are mirrors of each other. Both items provide multiplicative bonuses to their respective high-damage champions.

WotA used to have an AD mirror. It was called Stark's Fervor. It was removed because it was useless and never used, and reworked into the current Zeke's Herald.

An AP Atma's I oppose, because Singed is a thing. Also Ryze is a thing. I think an AD RoA could be acceptable though.

JustMyBassCannon2 votes

The reason there is no need for an AD Zhonya's is because AD is used for consistent damage, not burst damage.

[snippet about who would use AD Zhonya's]

You...do know you're talking to a person who has spent a lot of time micro-analyzing this game, right? An analogue would be explaining long multiplication to a college student.

And FYI, many of those items do have "mirrors" in a way.

No, they do not. They have items with similar goals, but they do not mirror each other.

A mirror would be Last Whisper/Void Staff or Archangel's Staff/Manamune.

Rabadon's Deathcap and Infinity Edge are mirrors of each other. Both items provide multiplicative bonuses to their respective high-damage champions.

No, they are not mirrors. They are mechanically and functionally different. They are based on the same job, a multiplicative increase in damage output, but they do it in mechanically different ways that mean different things for different champions.

If there were an AD Deathcap, then champions like Riven and Zed would get more effect from it than Infinity Edge. If there were an AP Edge, it would benefit multi-hit spells and rapid spell combos like Ryze and Vel'koz (not saying Vel can't use Deathcap, but if his multi-tap spells could crit...)

WotA used to have an AD mirror. It was called Stark's Fervor. It was removed because it was useless and never used, and reworked into the current Zeke's Herald.

The current WotA--AP, CDR and Spell Vamp--does not have a mirror. It has similar corollaries, such as Essence Reaver, but they have different purposes and are built for different reasons.

The old WotA and the old Stark's Fervor both had one mirrored similarity: 20% of their respective sustain type. While WotA granted 30 AP and 20% SV to allies, Starks gave +20% AS and +20% LS to allies. WotA had no other effects than the base 50 AP and the aura; Stark's had a base +20% AS and 20 ArPen.

They were closer to mirrors for sure, but the differences made them useful in different contexts on different types of teams.

An AP Atma's I oppose, because Singed is a thing. Also Ryze is a thing. I think an AD RoA could be acceptable though.

Does no one remember Vladimir? The living AP Atma's that Riot really should rework at some point?

In any case, an AD RoA would be weird to balance. Most AD champions don't want sustain that only happens while they're leveling in the laning phase, but if it was strong enough, bruisers would probably have a 100% pick rate.

WorsePlayerUSA1 votes

Being able to remove hard CC at all is crucial in any fight. Doesn't mean we give it to everyone. Most AD champs only build QSS against very specific champions or comps that have extremely long CC.

IwfiKe3qjM1 votes

the AP item from Quicksilver Sash huh...???

just rework Abyssal Scepter already... change the recipe to Blasting Wand + Quicksilver Sash... (because in S5 I think Neagtron Cloak will be removed...)

and add Active Quicksilver to it...

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