Low Health Tanks?

MoistPinkSock·Oct 26, 2015·2 votes·1,925 views

Usually when I play tanks, stacking health is a given. However, I've gotten bored of it lately. Are there any champs who are good tanks with low health and high resistances besides Poppy?

26 Comments

OnimarusOct 26, 20152 votes

yes they're called bruisers

Lord DusteonOct 26, 20152 votes

Short answer, no.

Long answer. Tanking generally works by the tank surviving long enough to get in the middle of the enemy team and disrupt them while forcing important cooldowns/spells on them instead of a better target. Generally tanks have low damage and high utility along with poor scalings, so going tanky is a given. However, resistances by themself are basically useless. For basics, every 100 resistances = 1 more entire health bar that enemies of that damage must go through. So at 1000 health, gaining 100 armor gives you an effective 2000 health against physical damage. Now, this is semi static: every 100 armor provides 100% more effective health, so 200 armor = 3000 effective health, 300 armor = 4000 effective health and so on. Then look at this: at 1000 health and 100 armor gaining 1000 health gives you 2000 total health and 4000 effective health against physical damage. That means 1000 health is providing 1000 extra effective health compared to 100 armor. As your armor goes up, the amount of health needed before getting more armor provides the most defence also goes up. At 1000 health, 500 armor getting 100 more armor gives 1000 effective health, but getting 1000 more health gives you 5000 effective health. And so on.

So without health the resistances are rather weak and meaningless, especially since any form of penetration or reduction will remove all forms of tankiness.

MoistPinkSockOct 26, 20152 votes

I know how armor and resistances work, that's not what I'm worried about. Some champs, like Poppy, are good at being tanks without having a lot of health. I was hoping the forums could help me think of some others.

Lord DusteonOct 26, 20155 votes

{quoted}

I know how armor and resistances work, that's not what I'm worried about. Some champs, like Poppy, are good at being tanks without having a lot of health. I was hoping the forums could help me think of some others.

Poppy isn't tanky however, and she isn't a tank (currently. The rework will likely change this). Poppy is an assassin, that due to having an utterly broken "I'm immune to 4 people entirely" mechanic can't be stopped. Even with her passive she's not particularly tanky as she has no resistances or health backing it up (so while that 1000 damage crit is being weakened to 500 that 500 damage is still a huge chunk of her health). There is zero champions that I can think of that are tanky without health, as having health + resistances is the only way to really be tanky in League.

MoistPinkSockOct 26, 20151 votes

That ult can make her very good at acting as a tank for peeling though. I think Trynd and Olaf could be good, since they don't need to be full health anyway. Also, Yorick would probably do well in a build based around resistances, since his e heals and most items which have resistances are pretty great on Yorick.

Sire HippingtonOct 27, 20152 votes

while she isn't a tank and won't work as one right now, she has about the highest base tankiness in the game between her passive, the highest basearmor in the game and 30 armor from her W

Sire HippingtonOct 27, 20151 votes

Champs with strong shields or selfheal usually can work without alot helath. Though most champs that offer big shields or heals have %hp scaleings or defense-steroids that make health a good stat on them...

Gallio has a great selfheal and scales off mr, but he also got a massive armor/mr buff which make health incredible powerfull(though not neccesary) for effective hp. Nauti, Scarner and Sion have good base helath and a huge shield, so they can get really tanky from only resitances+cdr, though once again, they also have %hp scaleings on their shields, so their tankiness scales really well with hp aswell...

If you want a bruiser built, it can often work with resits > health on such champs, but if your aim is to get as tanky as possible, you can't avoid building atleast 4k health.

DaenOct 26, 20152 votes

Other than Poppy they don't really exist, unfortunately. I agree with you, I think it could be cool to be able to have a character that's super tanky without also stacking tons of health, but it doesn't really work with how the game is designed. As Lord Dusteon mentioned, things like penetration and the way resistances are capped make low health tanking pretty much an impossibility unless it's built into the champion's kit (Poppy).

Sona PingOct 26, 20151 votes

Poppy doesn't even work that way; She just has abilities which facilitate her building defensive items. Same as Garen, same as every other "tanky" champ.

DaenOct 26, 20151 votes

Poppy's passive basically rewards her for having a lower health pool. Any damage greater than 10% of her current health is reduced by 50%, which means that the lower her overall health the more often that passive will proc. Her ultimate also completely negates damage from all targets other than her target, which means that sustained damage or extreme 5-man burst is no longer a concern.

Sona PingOct 26, 20151 votes

"Poppy's passive basically rewards her for having a lower health pool. " But you see Poppy's Passive works off of "10% of her _current _ health". Current health is the emphasized term here, because because it being percentage based and working of what her health currently is.... that means that if she builds health, after she takes some damage, her passive will proc just as often as if she didn't, however, she additionally gains the ability to tank more on top of that until she gets to said comparable health point.

RavenhaleOct 26, 20152 votes

There are champions that work well at low health like Poppy such as Tryndamere and Aatrox. You can make them pesky by giving them things like Rageblade, Maw and GA to frustrate your opponent.

Mecha MaIphiteOct 26, 20152 votes

Poppy is a fighter, really. Her passive just helps her survive.

A relatively low HP tank would be Malphite. I've mained him for a while, and most games I don't even break 4k hp. You can have 3kish and do fine, because of how well you scale with armour. Your passive is also effectively 10% bonus health.

MoistPinkSockOct 26, 20151 votes

Maybe with Zhonyas and Wits End

venomous frostOct 26, 20152 votes

mordekaiser/ ap xin zhao

azrolatorOct 26, 20152 votes

I have done a tank Yi in ARAM. But that was only because the enemy usually doesn't check to see what way yi is building hehehe. They just expect for him to jump in with q and then they focus him dead. The short nature of that mode let me get away with it for most of the match. But normally, if you stand there and do no damage and no cc, they don't really have any reason to target you so you aren't even going to soak damage or make them use cc on you.

AyRe CoNteMpTOct 26, 20151 votes

a tank needs to have abilities which mitigate damage either by absorbing it or by denying it. just soaking damage is not tanking. tanking means you are wasting your enemies time for your team. if all time you can waste is the time it takes them to 100-0 you, its not tanking even if you have alot of health and resistances. if they have to actually invest time into movement and cooldowns to damage you, THAT is tanking.

MoistPinkSockOct 26, 20151 votes

I mean specifically champs who might only have 1100 or 1200 health, but who could have over 100 of each resistance; maybe more. Master Yi with 10% life steal and 3% spellvamp in runes, masteries and a Dorans Blade sounds viable, and especially with Seraphs Embrace and Nashor's Tooth for a w buff.

Sona PingOct 26, 20151 votes

Short answer: No, because defense doesn't work that way.

I'm not trying to rain on parades. However:

{quoted}

Master Yi with 10% life steal and 3% spellvamp in runes, masteries and a Dorans Blade sounds viable, and especially with Seraphs Embrace and Nashor's Tooth for a w buff.

Sorry, but it isn't.

MoistPinkSockOct 26, 20151 votes

It isn't meta, but it can work. All of that spellvamp and lifesteal will provide lots of sustain, and Nashors Tooth would provide ap for the w and 20%cdr for. Another decent example could be Olaf, I suppose.

Sona PingOct 26, 20151 votes

It's not a question of "meta" or not, it's that you are assuming it will work out a certain way that you have imagined and him having a set of items as a given when nothing is a given in the game. "All of that spellvamp and lifesteal will provide lots of sustain," How? he get's lot of sustain from all that damage you won't be doing because you are building him as a tank.

There's no reason for this build or "low health" tanks. Sorry, the game doesn't work that way.

MoistPinkSockOct 26, 20151 votes

I'm not asking if it will work, I'm asking which champs to play like this.

BiBoX2Oct 26, 20151 votes

Volibear
Swain
Garen (new)
Rammus

SSJTribeOct 27, 20151 votes

There was a build for Amumu that I was kind of working on awhile back. Basically a resistance stacking drain tank where you build item 3001 item 3152 item 3065 and then some other tank items. Your W heals for a pretty large amount in team fights and such. It's pretty fun.

ErockandrollOct 27, 20151 votes

It's very difficult to have an actual tank, who doesn't have high HP. Cause HP scales so well with your other defenses.

But for a few Bruiser Oriented champions. Higher defenses in exchange for HP, typically benefit a little more from sustain. Such as from Life Steal. Nasus would probably be a prime example as he has built in LS in his passive, which (I believe) also works with his empowerd Q.