Really feels like jungle diversity is worst than ever...

The framework has been laid to increase diversity, but the new jungle is just a lot more punishing, so fewer champions can jungle effectively as it stands now. A few more patches should see some changes to finally deliver on the diversity that S5 was hoping for.

well yeah, apparently "everybody being a viable jungler" in season 4 was a "bad thing" and "limiting diversity" in s5 was "intentional"

Well, it's not worse than ever, but it is pretty poor.

The framework in the new jungle is quite good, and it has the potential to be the most diverse jungle ever, but so far they haven't managed to make strategic diversity a reality or come up with a good balance on jungler sustain.

Jungle diversity straight up sucks this season, only junglers with sustain or good camp clear are allowed to thrive I.E while tank junglers such as barely survive their first two camps and is depleted of half their mana. What also makes makes it worse is that they give jungle monsters more health and give them less money so you spend more time in the jungle trying to make half of what your support makes, seriously the support makes more money than the jungler which is just sad. Jungle is also more punishing to the point where if any lane falls behind or loses tower you can expect your jungle to get raided and warded by the enemy jungler. The would just live in your jungle and never leave.

If you haven;t tried this yet, I suggest you try it now. Before you take red buff, always smite and take the krugs. Before you take blue buff, always take and smite the gromp. If you start one of these two camps, you still get to level 2 and they make clearing camps a lot easier

Riot is trying to push tanks in jungle, but top lane is their lane. However, top lane is becoming an island for mage who can't go mid anymore for the reasons we know.

Problem in champion diversity is right there in the name: "champion"

Too many champions function too similarly to allow for any real diversity to occur. Any changes to general rules (unless the rule is specific like "only play a champion x times in y matches"), will only shift which champions are optimal for the job at hand because the champions themselves to function uniquely enough.

Kits are made with roles in mind. We don't get a whole lot of "how does this person fit" anymore. As long as they are approached that way they will all play within the same mental design box and thus a limited number will be viable.

To put it another way: real diversity should mean the jungle strategy should not be used every match. Champion pool should be rich enough to function without needing a jungler but a jungler still working if the comp is right.

In summation: forcing diversity into the jungle is no different than forcing diversity into any other lane ... aka nearly impossible. Force diversity OF roles instead.

the problem is that the only champion that riot are willing to leave in god tier is lee sin. everything else that ever becomes good gets nerfed to the ground.

I feel like if spirit stone came back in some form or fashion it would be better. Mana is so brutal in the new jungle, even with blue.

true. My favorite jungler Nautilus was never that good but definitely playable but now he is so useless unless it gets to late game its sad

So i used to have a lot of fun jungling with Rammus, so i tried it again today.

Holy crap it was boring. Its not just with him either. Jungle is awful to play now.

Just attempted to play Kha for the first time in a long time because I got stuck with jungler.....never again.

Every time riot says they want to increase diversity at x role, the opposite happens.

thats because it is. Most junglers that were bad before are only worse now.

Yea those camps hurt.

I always thought beginning of season 3 jungle was in a good spot.

I think it's due to bruisers being pushed out of top lane, Riot wants them to feel viable and played and not nerf all the mages going top lane since they nerfed all the bruisers top lane. Seriously watch any lcs or ranked stream where Lissandra or Rumble is always top lane and always wins against Irelia or Gnar. I feel like the game has gotten all screwed up cause of Zed and Yasuo and other Ad casters.

It also sucks that you make crap for gold if you try to farm, forcing you to gank. Yay for gank-or-die junglers again, amirite?

I have been doing better with tanky jungles this preseason, but I must admit bruisers like j4 and Lee still seem to be on top...

the lvling in the jungle sucks so hard now. idk if you have noticed but it was designed to keep you behind laners unless you tax really hard now

is really good in the new jungle. Start gromp with W and a good leash. Then take Q, E, then I like to max W. You clear:

1. Gromp (smite)
2. Blue (heal pot)
3. Wolves
4. Red (smite)
5. Chickens
6. Krugs

You don't even need 2nd pot unless you go in for a gank or something.

If you want stronger early ganks, max E first because of increased slow and damage. If you want more team fight cc, max Q first for reduced cooldown. I like the crazy sustain and jungle clear of maxing W first.

For runes, I take movement quints, AD marks, armor seals, 3 scaling cdr glyphs, and 6 scaling mr glyphs. Masteries I take 21/9/0 for ad damage with cdr and bonus life w/jungle tank helpers.

It still only heightened inefficient gankers weaknesses. The Chilling Smite nerf only makes it worse. If you can't gank, you won't be viable. Remember to everyone saying X champ can clear or X champ has sustain, you're competing with the enemy jungler for map dominance. If they pick a Rek'Sai or Lee Sin and you don't, you are automatically at a disadvantage. So focus on faster clear, Lee ganked ur bot lane while u were farming. You try to gank, but it takes the second try to land it instead of the first. Rek gets ahead of you in gold. It's always something. Volibear is my best jungler atm and half the games I play I only spend maybe 20% of the game in the jungle? Maybe less. I gank all the time and get fed off assists. I only farm if there're no openings. Diana is great once she hits lv.6, but then I have to wait for lv.6 which is problematic against the Reks and Lees and X champs that gank earlier. Because the XP and gold gain suck in the jungle now with longer spawn timers, you can't keep up by farming. It's more interesting, sure, but it's incredibly prohibitive and did the exact opposite of what was intended.