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Idea to fix balance forever. @Riot

pripustas·8/20/2015, 6:39:29 PM·3 votes·1,818 views

Yep, I have an idea that will balance champions the way Riot wants it. I will give you an example: Let's say people start building Twisted Fate ADC, and it's beyond broken, because of the low cd stun is. So you don't know what to do, maybe nerf his AD ratios, or something. What you should be doing instead, is making his yellow card stun time Scale with AP Boom. Problem solved. AP TF is the same as he always was. AD TF is nerfed to not be able to abuse that stun. (that was a hypothetical scenario) Yep, what you should be doing, is scaling debuff duration/power on the things you want that champion to build. No more full tank Ekko, full tank Fizz, etc, etc. For those of you who will 100% think "well that would be Riot forcing a build" yes, and no. Yes: you would be forced to build for the purpose that champion was built for. Meaning full tank Ekko is not viable, because you cannot use his utility without building the way he was supposed to be built. I mean you want to play a tank? Play Maokai, not Ekko. No: you can still choose what items in that category you want.

You can do this to almost any skill.

EDIT: Including this here, so everyone can see it.

HOW. How can't you understand? It's so obvious I didn't even mention it. There shouldn't be one mark, like reach 500ap get stun. No, ofc not. Why would you think that? There should be quite a few marks. Maybe even 20. Like 0.1sec for 0ap, 0.2sec for 5ap, making it something like 40-60ap for 1second. And that's just a raw estimation.

20 Comments

Lil Soybean8/20/2015, 8:18:00 PM2 votes

That takes away from reliability and base power. You gave a perfect example yourself - TF would have a way, way weaker stun early, where his stun's strength is his defining value. Even if you 'compensated' these changes by making them scale to higher numbers later-game, you would just be opening an entire new can of balance issues. (What stun duration does 800 AP Twisted Fate get? How do you balance that versus his current level one stun?) And you also force tons of these champions into being weaker early, hyper-scalers, even when it doesn't match that identity at all.

So, again, Twisted Fate's strength lies in his early stuns and playmaking potential as well as map pressure. Suddenly his playmaking and map pressure are pathetic because you made his base stun weak without the early AP...but he's compensated by having a broken stun way way way later in the game, if he can get there? Which will, by the way, be much harder due to his heavily nerfed early stun?

And then what about champions who go support as well? I don't like Morgana bindings, but it's pretty signature to her. How can you make her bind duration way weaker early game, where it's arguably most important, as well as make it only scale with AP, when supports rarely have the gold income to stack much AP? And then you're also punishing her for building things like sightstone and utility items (Mikael's Crucible, Nomad's Medallion, etc.) because then she'd have to have a much weaker bind duration for no reason.

Furthermore, you end up with midlane morgana/late-game morgana rooting people for...what? 5-6 seconds? That would just feel ridiculous, and wouldn't feel 'balanced'.

Your idea just breaks the power curves of many champions, then makes them broken mid-late game.

Also, Riot doesn't necessarily want to stop off-meta builds from being played. The problem is when those off-meta builds conflict with good design or cause unhealthy gameplay. I.E. Tank Ekko took him from a squishy champ that weaved in-and-out and struck strategically, and timed things correctly, to a champion who just casually dove into all of the enemies and spammed everything in melee range. It's not that it was necessarily 'broken', but it did break his proper playstyle, in favor of a dull, less-strategic playstyle. Hence the changes.

LilxPaprika8/20/2015, 7:18:53 PM1 votes

they've been doing a lot of this more or less of late. like ekko changes where base dmg/shield is soso and scale a lot more with ap. etc but didn't think about duration of stuns etc thats interesting too. problem with that is early game stun would suck. so mostly can be applied to thing that progressively get longer with more levels.

LilxPaprika8/20/2015, 8:08:41 PM1 votes

ya thats interesting could work. such that its still okay early game but not later. i like this overall but this sort of stuff is usually more for odd cases. not the norm. I wouldn't want this to become the norm. mostly for abusive cases etc. i'm also not that big a fan of shoe horning builds or tying champions to same item sets. breaking the meta while maybe not optimal if its still anything but bad its okay with me in fact i enjoy qwerky builds that work.

like elise can be played tankyish or mage. karma as support or mage... i wouldn't want either or. etc preference is nice.

or full ap amumu, zac, lol even shyvana was kind of dope. so long as they aren't broken and they can get by with it so be it.

this comes in handy when a champion that is really not being played remotely close to their classifications.

in fact i'd be down if they released a dynamic champion that could be built in two directions tank or squish. and apply some of your mechanism to their kits to determine which way they are going and adjust how the spell works based on their build. but can still dabble in borrow from either worlds if they so desired.

example fiora has 100% ap w. Imagine if the old fiora could of spellvamped on her old ult. she could of gone with like gunblade. XIn zhao with ap heal. or same goes for pantheon his w and ult. i built gunblade on him and it really wasn't bad. http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1857694921/38492205 spell vamp off deathmark can be really strong the old gankplank could be played with lichbane (though was for troll) old yi could successfully if not way too successfully be played as ap way back.

SouL1ess8/20/2015, 8:39:49 PM1 votes

Except you nerf AP TF anyways, because one of the most significant aspects of TF is gank presence, and the gold card being a single target 2 second stun CC is average out of all CC.

Nerfing the base while giving it an AP ratio will not only nerf AP TF's early gank presence, the very thing he should excel at, but also make late game AP TF overbearing with even higher duration of CC.

It doesn't nerf only one build path of the champion. The change nerfs both AP and AD TF, because one cannot obtain a significant amount of AP early game to offset the nerf to the base duration.

And if you make it so that even 500 AP cannot surpass the previous 2 second stun duration, so that AP TF doesn't have an end game with 2.5-3 second stuns, what's the point of the AP ratio? It's just an overall net nerf that is harsher than it needs to be.