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Does Sejuani feel really weak to anyone else?

Tamashii Kitsune·1/14/2016, 2:55:16 PM·30 votes·4,978 views

I completely love the concept of ! Who wouldn't love a booty kickin' chick riding a giant boar that rains freezy doom upon the enemy team?! Well Poro in my case, lol. But my lord does she feel sooo weak in both the jungle and in lane. I understand trying to balance out everyone, but the current meta of items kinda leaves Sejuani out in the cold. (couldn't skip that pun.) I was struggling pretty hard just trying to clear the jungle camps, and even ganking feels like a bit of a chore. At best i felt like a glorified support going off meta to jungle. I stacked hp gear for the W boost, but by the time it gets substantial, it's canceled out by the fact everyone else is buffed up too. If you try building towards buffing the damage of you Q/E/R you hemorrhage damage into your W. It's kind of like holding a double edge blade. No matter which way you try, you're gonna get cut. Is there something i'm missing, or is she rather underpowered atm? Or can someone steer me to a good guide?

52 Comments

Deus Imperator1/14/2016, 3:10:16 PM12 votes

she IS weak, the reasoning i keep hearing is that sejuani was godly with cinderhulk, so they nerfed sejuani, then they nerfed cinderhulk, but forgot to redo sejuani nerfs

so now she is a bad tank, a bad damage dealer and a bad duelist, shame because i really enjoy using her and i got her poro rider skin

sejuani rework or buffs when rito?

Jhaerik1/14/2016, 2:57:54 PM7 votes

Try building her AP Heavy. Faster clears in which you take less damage, better ganks.

First clear is a pain in the ass... after that you're golden.

Mcprowlington1/14/2016, 3:16:57 PM4 votes

Been maining her jungle for a while, she isn't great but she's not under powered, either. http://champion.gg/champion/Sejuani/Jungle try the mastery/rune builds here. the 6/6/18 build makes your early jungle clearing a lot easier. You can get away with going refillable pot but if you want a safer clear you should never have any problems starting 3 health pots. Deadmans plate helps a lot with her feeling "slow", giving her both the small damage buff and movement speed buff, it should probably be the 2nd or 3rd thing you build, right after you finish cinderhulk/start your boots.

While clearing remember to use Q to interrupt enemy attack animations towards the end as well as using W to cancel your recovering auto animations. Some pretty basic fundamental stuff, but because you aren't 30 yet, you might not know.

Other basic things that might help with clearing the jungle:

Smite gromp, it gives a dps buff that scales with health, was nerfed a while back but it's still worth on tanks.

Last hit redbuff with smite to get health back.

Smite golems earlier, not later.

XIII Vanitas1/14/2016, 4:01:01 PM4 votes

She's not meta because of her early game: her first clear is a bit weak and she's subject to invades, while being unable to gank consistently before level 6.

The Deckowner1/14/2016, 3:51:18 PM3 votes

sejuani's w was very good at clearing jg, rito's nerf at s5 hurted her clear alot. sejuani provides a lot of utility for the team but she doesnt seem to be as tanky as most other tank/juggernuts. she's like amumu except it's harder for her to use her cc.

Hoodwink1/14/2016, 6:07:27 PM2 votes

Riot actually said that they sometimes want to keep some champions underpowered for a while after they have a particularly strong patch and they're actually aware that Sejuani is pretty weak at the moment.

They've said that they intend to leave her there for a while longer.

I know a Rioter said this, just a bit too lazy to find the source.

In my opinion, I think Sejuani is actually still pretty cool. I mean the ultimate is a great engage, and having a charge is good for ganks. Although she might not be doing too much damage anymore, I think she fits into a support-jungler kind of class that she shares with champions like Gragas, Amumu and Malphite, etc.

masc dom top1/14/2016, 3:46:02 PM2 votes

item 1413 item 3151 item 3143 item 3020 item 3001 item 3110 have fun dealing true damage (to everyone with less than 50 MR)

HEAljvLykd1/14/2016, 3:58:52 PM2 votes

She was incredibly strong and got nerfed.

Shrek Luigi1/14/2016, 4:00:28 PM2 votes

Sejuiani had been hit with multiple nerfs over the course of the past year, both directly and indirectly. She's nowhere near as good as she used to be, but she can still jungle marginally well. Amumu and Nautilus are pretty much superior in every facet.

What upsets a lot of Sej players the most is that she used to be able to lane. It was very fun to fly around like a bat shoving creeps and jumping around, but she can't win trades against most toplaners anymore :/

I imagine Sej is one of the prime candidates for a buff, so it's worth playing her anyways and holding out for when she get that needed boost if you really do enjoy her. I certainly do.

GundayMonday1/14/2016, 4:36:14 PM2 votes

They nerfed her a little too hard when cinderhulk was broken, then nerfed cinderhulk, then nerfed a lot of her core items with the defensive item update. You have to play insanely well to win with her now, no room for errors.

BUT you can do some really cool things with her if you know what you're doing. https://youtu.be/Edxyc5V8hd4?list=PLrunrUlBGmpwYR24cL6fyVW-61NrMCAPW

Let me know if you want any tips. I have ~5k games on her, and have experimented with a bunch of different builds during the preseason.

Auroramancer1/14/2016, 5:28:38 PM2 votes

I agree that she feels weak, but before Riot makes any balance changes to her, I'd rather see them tackle her usability to start with. Here's where I feel she is clunky and could receive usability changes:

Her autos are slow and easily canceled by targets walking (not dashing or blinking) away from her.
Her auto attack frame (especially with W) is too long.
In my opinion, and without hard numbers to back this up, her attack range beyond her hitbox (and thus, beyond her unit collision frame) is horrendously low, making her suffer from creep block about as much as Rumble does.
Her Q charge hitbox does not seem to be the same as her unit collision frame, so Q casts that seem to hit the intended target don't reach the target.
The cast time on her E is long and can cancel her W attack animation too easily.
Her ultimate does not have an indicator for the projectile's thickness, which plays a big role in whether you hit a target with a max range ulti and get the stun, or you don't quite reach the target at max range and the ulti explodes only for the slow.

As far as balance changes go, after her usability has been fixed, what I would buff on her is:

Rank 1-2 spell base damages, without touching her ratios.
Create two radii on her ultimate for when it reaches max range without hitting a target. A small radius for stun (much smaller than the radius for when the missile hits a target before reaching max range), and the regular radius for the slow.

After these changes, have her new state evaluated. Overall, I think these are the necessary changes to bring her back into a place of being satisfying (and less frustrating) to use and keeping her competitive.

DingleNutsMcGee1/14/2016, 9:18:41 PM2 votes

Sejuani has been pretty bad since they nerfed her W's % dmg down to a maximum of 6% instead of the 12% it originally had. They removed half of the dmg in her kit lol

Pawagaiza1/15/2016, 2:32:43 AM2 votes

Try building her AP ;)

Xenomancers1/15/2016, 2:42:01 PM2 votes

Sej is absolute crap right now. Clearing is not her problem though - she can clear like a boss with the cinder build up item. The problem I have with her is that she isn't tough even when built full tanky and her damage and CC is actually pretty pathetic except for her ult CC which is great. Some things that I think could help her are a better passive and increased range on her auto attacks and possibly a speed boost - she just feels so dang slow. playing +5 or + 10 MS. Shes riding a freaking boar - should be fast.

OxBaker1/14/2016, 4:34:28 PM1 votes

I'd be tempted to buy the new skin that's coming out but not with Sej in her current state. I'd never end up using it.

Jasiwel1/14/2016, 6:08:54 PM1 votes

The main thing I've noticed playing against her is that, even when our team is behind, she just blows up trying to tank in teamfights. Compared to someone like Amumu or even Rammus, Sejuani dies about as fast as Rek'Sai...but with no sustain,and slower clear times. The fact of the matter is that she's not an optimal pick right now if winning is your goal.

That said, to make her work you need to rush Liandry's after Cinderhulk and try your best to itemize with both defense and damage in mind. Every ability she has deals damage, applies a soft CC if not a hard CC, and she can hard engage from range with her R. As long as you can go into a fight with an advantage then you'll be fine. I've noticed Sejuani being annihilated when she can't be ahead of her opponent, which is why this meta is not too great for her in her current state.

Singing Lark1/14/2016, 8:18:57 PM1 votes

As someone who played almost exclusively Sej when I have to jungle, I can say that Sej is just fine right now. Maybe a little on the side of underpowered, but not in any way "really weak".

I don't know how you've been clearing, but after her first clear, I almost never even need to pop a potion clearing jungle camps again. Usually, I'd go bot-side camp, whichever buff is down there. Use scuttle to regen after taking your first buff. Clear raptors/wolves. Get other buff. Depending on how low you are, you can possibly take one more camp. Sej definitely can get invaded, so best if you ask your toplaner to ward your buff at 1:30.

I think Sej's primary job is a massive CC monster, similar to the likes of Nautilus. Your job is to look for a good 3-5 man ult, chain it with your Q knock up after the stun and then slow then with your E. The only time Sej will really ever deal damage is early game. I'll be honest. I have tried, but I hardly ever gank pre-6. If you're looking for ganks, it's better to take blue smite, but I've taken a preference of tracker's knife for more ward coverage, either in my own jungle or in the enemy jungle.

The problem with Sej is that she doesn't deal damage (I don't know if she used to, but in her current state, she just doesn't), and you just have to accept that if you play Sej, you need to rely on your team being at least competent enough to follow up on your engages. I often find that I will end a game with least damage dealt. Sej does, however, work beautifully in wombo-combo team comps.

If you really want some cheese, you could try AP Sej.

I would say the biggest reason why she could feel weak right now is because the current meta favors snowballing in lane and winning from there rather than hard engage teamfighting. That being said, Sej offers a lot of utility which still makes her a very valuable pick.

Bodkins Odds1/14/2016, 8:29:51 PM1 votes

She's actually still pretty strong, the problem is that it's a bit of a fast meta and her first clear is trash. Like, if you're new to her you can get executed by red level trash. If the meta gets slower or they buff her first clear then you'll see her some more.

Unless you're planning on doing a full AP build (which works better in lane than in the jungle) then the only AP item you need is Liandry's. After that you should be building health, resists, and cdr. If you can fit a Rylai's in then that can help too, but it's a little risky if you don't know what your doing. Abyssal can also be nice.

In any case, as far as damage goes, magic pen > health > CDR > AP. Maximizing your W & E damage is better than maxing Q damage, but since they moved her percent health damage to her W, her Q is more for the gapclose and knockup than its damage anyway.

King Odin1/14/2016, 8:49:05 PM1 votes

http://grabilla.com/0610e-e4620512-9305-4e21-b2fb-ccd0a3f718a4.png So my take on Sejuani is that she's still strong but her early games entirely rely on your runes http://grabilla.com/0610e-8f8748eb-b73a-4d64-9fb6-e3844ca4d074.png

She can clear her first 3 camps with item 2031 item 1039 and still have ample health to gank. Her damage really scales exponentially off her health so she actually doesn't need any kind of AP runes and I usually always take item 3151 because it synergizes really well with her.

But definitely this rune page is the key to overcoming her early game weakness to a great degree.

I'm currently an Amumu main and I only play Seju cause she's similar in kit but I definitely overall prefer Amumus play style.

www GOHAM org1/15/2016, 5:35:24 PM1 votes

Random thought here that sounds silly but I think makes a lot of sense for her kit. lemme know how smart or stupid I am...

What if when Sejuani activates her flail W for the second cast to make her start spinning that thing in the air... Well what if during that time she went INVISIBLE to champions that are more than 2 teemo lengths away from her!!!! oh fuck yea

She makes an ice storm that is so thick that visibility of sejuani is not possible unless you are close enough to her. I live in the northern US and trust me in an ice storm you can't see things unless you are right up close and personal to them.

So she essentially needs a reverse graves smokescreen that follows her character. Causes enemies outside the "nearsight" radius to be unable to see her while spinning her flail. This will give here a different aspect of tanky'ness.

What you guys think?

I WILL TROLL YOU1/14/2016, 9:51:44 PM1 votes

She is very late game oriented. Late game she can deal a ton of damage while CCing multiple players and being one of the toughest tanks around. If you can get past the horrible slow start then she is worth playing.

CerealBoxOfDoom6/2/2016, 1:21:51 AM1 votes

I have had no problems clearing

If she feels like a glorified support then try playing like she is one, unless youre suggeesting support is useless.... but tat would make you racist :P

Sinlaire1/15/2016, 3:27:07 AM1 votes

Sejuani wins the same way Amumu wins. being a CC and ult spam bot.

She's not even as tanky as amumu generally but because she has her Q knock up, E slow, and team murder ball ult she just kinda throws out her kit and waits for her team to win.

I used to play a lot of sejuani before her double nerfs from cinderhulk era. but now all you do is line up kills for your team and hope they can scrape together a win much more so than feeling like you're being a contributor. essentially her game play flow sheet goes like this.

"Did you land your ult on two or more meaningful targets/first priority target during team fight" "yes? you did all you could do. congrats." "No. git gud scrub and land the next one."

that's about it. her ult is practically little more than a blitz crank q in that all of her effectiveness has now been stashed into one skill that alone makes her win rate tolerable in Riots eyes. otherwise she's now sadly pretty much worthless.

HoboMcJoe1/15/2016, 5:25:07 AM1 votes

Just my opinion, people exaggerate how bad she is. She may not be a power meta pick anymore but her ult is still a gamechanger that few other abilities match.

runandscream1/14/2016, 5:00:40 PM1 votes

I don't know. I still really enjoy Sejuani. I don't have any issues clearing or ganking. The bad ganks I've done were mostly my fault (q too early, or my laner is oom) and sometimes because my laner didn't go in when I engaged.

I have still been super tank (even a couple of no death games) and also just been blown up too. I also played a game against a full AP Sejuani. She blew up all my squishies with her ult then died to full tank me. It was crazy.

Stardew Valley1/14/2016, 5:17:53 PM1 votes

I recently went Sej top against a Shen and I actually killed him a few times. He won a lot of trades but only by a little and I still won the lane/game. I remember maxing W and built mainly tank and I think a item 3027 towards the end. But anyways I think Sej does MODERATE amount of damage. I mean she has so much cc and I think if she dealt extra damage, she could reach the point that people can start building and using her like an AP burst champ. I've actually seen her burst but only if people lucked out on risking full AP (what more if she did more damage right?) Honestly I would prefer keeping her this way than have her buffed and then nerfed into something less than she already was. For jungle, my brother made a mastery page with some Attack speed in it. I think you should try that if you havent yet.

alfavhunter6/2/2016, 1:25:35 AM1 votes

Only buff she needs is a little more to her dps for jungle clears with her dos aoe

ZeeWolfZ1/14/2016, 5:37:11 PM1 votes

I've mained Sejuani since Season 3 until season 5 Tank Meta. Finally, they saw Sej's potential and nerfed her into the ground. Her clear is slower than ever, her Ultimate is near pathetic and too short (comparing to the likes like Amumu), and overall is not as good as other Junglers out there. I doubt she'll get any love anytime soon, it's all about keeping Zed, Yasuo, Riven, and Lee sin viable in every season, the rest, don't matter. Would I pick her in Ranked? No, I rather take Naut/Amumu jungle, better ganks and just better right.