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Balancing Around Pro Play Sucks For Us

xAcidik·2/7/2019, 1:58:01 PM·86 votes·19,575 views

It does. Balancing EXCLUSIVELY around pro play is a horrible design. I understand that certain champions are just too strong in pro play, but how does that justify making the champion unplayable in solo queue? WE are the consumers, WE keep this game running. If WE weren't interested in this game, fucking pro play wouldn't save it. Balancing for pro play is important, but not EXCLUSIVELY, which is Riot's habit.

Akali, Azir, Ryze, Shen. These are all rather popular champions that can no longer feasibly exist in solo queue. Meanwhile, in solo queue, since it isn't a problem in pro play, we have Spear of Shojin Jax and Fiora, completely outdated champions like Pantheon and Shaco... I mean cmon. I agree that you shouldn't balance for low ELO, but at least balance for solo queue.

Find a different solution for pro play. I don't care what it is. Straight out ban champions in pro play, for all I care. It DOESN'T EVEN BEGIN TO IMPACT THE BAST MAJORITY OF PLAYERS.

123 Comments

Saezio2/7/2019, 2:30:48 PM29 votes

If only riot were not such stubborn ostriches and decided to finally ban a couple champions for pro per patch. We could achieve peace.

For example, If riot just kept the 5 most problematic for pro play champs banned per patch and swapped one every patch, would people not watch because "This is not the same as I play" ?

like for starters, keep Ryze Azir Sejuani Kalista TahmKench locked for pro-play and balance them around soloqueue. Then on the next patch, decide one of these, and replace it with the most successful pro pick in the previous patch and enable the champ that was locked previously. If the champ is still problematic after another patch, bench them again and enable another, balancing them in the meantime.

The number 5 is indicative, it could be 10 but I think that would be excessive considering there are another 6 bans before 1st pick.

So the bottom line for this to work, is to keep the benched ones rotating to make sure they are not NEVER seen in pro. It would also add some flavour to pro, since people can be like "Remember in 9.8 when they enabled azir in Pro? Well that was a fiesta." Finally, I believe this would make balancing the top of the top S tier champs more easily since they will not have to worry about stuff affecting pro + they would be addressed one at a time.

Terrible Jayce2/7/2019, 3:37:20 PM14 votes

It's because if something is OP in low elo it's just because you're playing bad, you can play better and not have that problem. When something is OP in pro, it's actually OP and needs to be toned down.

Tesladin2/7/2019, 2:37:14 PM9 votes

Well balancing around pro play is true balance

Bitfrosty2/7/2019, 2:09:38 PM8 votes

They nerfed Aatrox because of pro league I'm pretty sure. Low pick and ban rate and medium win rate.

Requiemsfire2/7/2019, 2:31:19 PM7 votes

It's honestly atrocious that champions ever get put into a state where they aren't just weak but actually unplayable.

Nevrankroaton2/8/2019, 6:16:47 AM5 votes

Unpopular take but considering pro play is the best gameplay in the game, if a champion strength or playstyle is so strong/so impactful they have to nerf it again and again, the champion is the problem and not pro play. It mean that at the best level, at the REAL one, the one where you play in team and understand the game, this champion wrap things around him.

In fighting games, you don't cry because the best players in the world show how strong a top tiers/god tiers character is. You know that it mean this character is too strong and you take the nerf (ofc it cry there too) because your aim is to be able to play the game/character to its best potential.

It is the same here. I get what you guys mean but the same way low elo stomper need to be balanced, I want high elo/pro play top pick to be balanced too.

Bitfrosty2/7/2019, 2:09:32 PM4 votes

They nerfed Aatrox because of pro league I'm pretty sure. Low pick and ban rate and medium win rate.

BigFBear2/7/2019, 2:49:28 PM4 votes

Because it's better when a champ is unplayable in a specific Elo than a champ is hardcore op in a specific Elo.

Also: Ofc you balance a game around pro play! This is so obvious I don't even know where to start. If you start playing a game normally your goal is to get better. But why should you if the game gets worse and more unbalanced the better you get and the higher you climb?? It's YOU who have to learn and improve to get better at the game, not the game that has to adapt to your skill.

Imagine they would adapt the rules of CHESS to the skill of beginners: "Uhhhh the Knight is so complicated! I don't understand it. I can't play with him. He is so weak on my skill level. Can't you just make him like the Queen??"

[zombie-brand-facepalm]

GorillazNtheMyst2/7/2019, 5:40:39 PM4 votes

It's always sucked but it's what they've always done. There are really only two things that would get Riot to reevaluate their balancing philosophy (which, to begin with, is pretty fcked, let's be real): either the pro league viewership or the main bulk of the player place need to evaporate and diminish. Unless Riot gets hit in the purse, they won't change anything. If modern video gaming has taught us anything, it's that these companies really only listen to money. They don't care if the playerbase is miserable, hates many aspects of their game, or if their staff is generally incompetent. As long as they can get sponsors like State Farm to funnel money into their BS they're going to keep making BS.

TheSingularity2/7/2019, 7:58:07 PM2 votes

Akali wasd nerfed for casual play. As her ban rate was through the roof so at the very least you can pick her now

KVbqbFsC8e2/8/2019, 6:20:57 AM2 votes

Akali is a very poor example. People have been complaining about her for months.

Gabresol2/8/2019, 2:00:10 PM2 votes

Balancing the game around soloQ is like balancing football (soccer) around being played by a group of friends in 4v4. Imagine them srhinking down the field 22 players play on, because it is too large for a 4v4.

That is really similar to what balancing around SoloQ is like. Because we are not playing League of Legends, but borrowing the rules and playground to play a 1-player base conquerer game, where everyone besides yourself can be viewed as a AI, since that is the amount of interactions you have in that mode.

skills of luck2/8/2019, 5:03:06 PM2 votes

I think a more accurate title would be "Nerfing" for pro play, champions are almost never buffed because they specifically suck in pro play. That being said all of the champions you listed are still great in niche matchups as counterpicks, they just lost their ability to be blind picked. Ex. azir is still gonna destroy annie and few other low mobility mages in solo queue. Having a small champion pool (like me) is more the player's fault than the games, we put ourselves in a spot where 1 big nerf can completely wreak us. the game wasn't originally designed for a person to spam only 1 or 2 champs.

ShakeNBakeUK2/8/2019, 7:35:13 PM2 votes

{quoted}

It does. Balancing EXCLUSIVELY around pro play is a horrible design. I understand that certain champions are just too strong in pro play, but how does that justify making the champion unplayable in solo queue? WE are the consumers, WE keep this game running. If WE weren't interested in this game, fucking pro play wouldn't save it. Balancing for pro play is important, but not EXCLUSIVELY, which is Riot's habit.

Akali, Azir, Ryze, Shen. These are all rather popular champions that can no longer feasibly exist in solo queue. Meanwhile, in solo queue, since it isn't a problem in pro play, we have Spear of Shojin Jax and Fiora, completely outdated champions like Pantheon and Shaco... I mean cmon. I agree that you shouldn't balance for low ELO, but at least balance for solo queue.

Find a different solution for pro play. I don't care what it is. Straight out ban champions in pro play, for all I care. It DOESN'T EVEN BEGIN TO IMPACT THE BAST MAJORITY OF PLAYERS.

unfortunately in League, pro play is vital to the survival of the game. there are a tonne of ppl who watch lcs and dont even play the game any more. so having a balanced pro scene is more important to riot than having a balanced game for casuals.

if you want to play a MOBA without a pro scene to worry about, HotS is waiting 4 u with open arms.

Big Wánk2/8/2019, 2:51:13 AM1 votes

Aatrox has literally been sitting at a 45-47% win rate for 2 months and he still gets gutted to the point where he's not even viable in the jungle, a far better role for him to play against. He got 3 nerfs in a row for no other reason than "he was strong in comp.", and now he's literally one of the worst solo queue champions sitting between Ornn and Ryze. But they made him a 100$ prestige skin, so I guess they made their money's worth for the now worthless champion.