So, why no love with Kha'Zix, Riot?

AChanceOfReign·1/27/2015, 4:21:06 AM·6 votes·1,790 views

I know they gave him a skin and it looks AMAZING! But...he's ad scaling sucks comparing it with someone like Rengar, Jarvan, and Vi. So I think you should give his Q more base damage. Then increase his base healing for his W because his sustain is pretty bad unlike Rengar's W. Or maybe just make a complete re-work that makes him more playable :T Just saying because Kha look fun and is fun but he's just really hard to play and his kit is to nerfed. Hell even the community agrees with me! Right guys?...right?

15 Comments

Gank in Progress1/27/2015, 1:54:12 PM3 votes

HIS AD SCALING SUCKS? HAHHAHAAHAH show me another ad assassin or any ad champ with a 2.6 scaling on his Q. go ahead

btw i main kha zix, dont buff him. maybe you should actually try learning him instead of wanting to buff him into oblivion so that even people who have no skill can play him.

Lafouboy1/27/2015, 4:24:37 AM3 votes

I was with you until "reduce his Isolation damage".

I am not sure if you know, but that is kinda his schtick and what makes his kit unique to play with.

I do think Riot needs to help him out in Jung though, because monsters kick his ass now, because he doesn't benefit off of Spirit Stone sustain (which helped him stay in jungle so much) anymore, as it doesn't exist. Elder Lizard also let his W do some true damage, so that is more nerfs to him (less damage) due to the shift to season 5.

TheBaffMan1/27/2015, 10:46:55 AM1 votes

He doesn't need most of that. Kha is still pretty healthy to play. Around three times Riot has nerfed him to varying degrees in order to get different responses out of Kha players but even after that he still goes strong.

Kha doesn't need buffs. He evolves and adapts. (Doesn't necessarily mean we wouldn't LIKE buffs, but I mean, who doesn't like buffs to champs they play?)

BeatzBoyFTW1/27/2015, 10:49:56 AM1 votes

I hate it how he gets resetting jumps on kills & dealing bonus damage on isolated targets, so no buffs please.

Knight SoIaire 1/27/2015, 2:00:59 PM1 votes

my answer to your changes is nope

kha's kit is too packed with diverse stuff if you give him a little bit power he will doinate again

he needs some serious tweaks aimed at: a)making his base kit without evolutions good b)making evolutions more like situatiional tools used for adapting to situation

AChanceOfReign1/27/2015, 3:52:49 PM1 votes

Thanks for the input guys! I just want to see more people play this guy but people don't see the greatness that comes from him. Again thanks for the response I really appreciate it :D

Blue Collar Bear1/27/2015, 5:34:04 PM1 votes

Jarvan and Vi are primarily bruisers. They have assassin qualities, but their primary role is that of fighter. It makes sense that they are tankier and more survivable than Kha'Zix. I don't believe it is fair to compare fighter assassins to assassin fighters. They are simply not the same thing. You also compared Rengar and Kha'Zix, so I will focus on that, especially since they share the same primary / secondary roles.

Their passives are not the same. Rengar's passive is a utility passive that gives him his unique mobility. Kha'Zix's passive has utility within it, too, but it also has damage associated with it. At max level, that's an extra base damage of 190 magic damage. In my opinion, this is what makes Kha'Zix's ganks scary especially from in lane. The same goes for Rengar.

Kha'Zix has a potential 400% bonus AD scalings on all of his abilities to an isolated target. Rengar has a potential scaling of 150% AD on his empowered Q, and bonus AD scaling to 70% on his E, regardless of empowerment. Without empowerement, that's a 120% AD scaling at max level on his Q. To compare, Kha'Zix's Q without an isolated target and evolution, deals 120% bonus AD in damage whilst also having higher base damages and a lower cooldown at every rank. As an example, both of these champions easily reach 400 AD at full build. Kha'Zix's base AD reaches 108, so 292 of that is bonus AD. His Q at max level would deal 170 + (292 *1.2) = 520.4 to a non-isolated target. Rengar's unempowered Q will deal 150 + (400 * 1.2) = 630. Keep in mind: this is not counting Kha'Zix's passive which can be activated multiple times. Let's look at isolation, evolution, and empowerment. Kha'Zix's evolved and isolated Q will deal 221 + (292 * 2.6) + (10 x Kha'Zix's level (18) = 939.2. Again, this is not counting his passive. Rengar's Q will deal 240 + (400 x 1.5) = 840. Kha'Zix will be able to continually pump out that same number on an isolated target. Rengar's burst is much more situational with empowerment. However, we can't forget that Rengar will deal more damage in autos, too, because the empowered Q has an attack speed steroid and AD steroid. These abilities do very similar damage at end game, and it's hard to say which could do more damage.

Both of their W's are sustaining mechanics whilst also being an aoe form of damage. However, Kha'Zix's is physical damage with a decent ratio and a slow. For this, Kha'Zix will always have the superior damage between the two skills. This ability also has a shorter cooldown. On top of that, Kha'Zix does not have to sacrifice clearing speed for sustain like Rengar must. This means that Kha'Zix will be able to heal and clear just as fast. Taking a look at the math, the most Rengar will ever be able to heal is 50 * (25 * Rengar's level). At 18, this would mean 500 health. Keep in mind, though, that's at extremely low levels of health. Usually, I would use Rengar's heal to stay healthy enough for a gank so it would be healing considerably less. Let's bring up that Rengar has a resistance steroid, unlike Kha'Zix who has a ratio on his W. I would argue that these two skills are a lot of what breaks their similarities. In a team fight, Rengar is always going to be tankier. Kha'Zix is going to deal more damage, though. In the early jungle, I would argue that it's Kha'Zix who actually has the better sustain due to the lower cooldown, being able to spam it more often than Rengar, and the fact that it scales with the skill level itself (not champion level, like Rengar).

Their E abilities can both be gap closers, but Kha'Zix can also use his to run away and outplay, just like Rengar can use his passive to outplay. Rengar's E is what I think makes a huge difference in assassin patterns. Kha'Zix might have more damage, but the sheer hard CC of Rengar's E is the reason why I think people pick him. The reliability of an instant root, instant engage is hard to beat. Kha'Zix can only slow them. He (it?) only has soft CC, albeit he has more than one ability that gives him it.

Their ultimates are both utility abilities. Kha'Zix's ultimate will proc his passive, though, while Rengar will generate ferocity passively from his. It is possible to be able to use up to three empowered abilities from Rengar's ultimate.

To me, they both seem fairly balanced. Kha'Zix will always be able to pick better than Rengar, because of his isolation mechanic. He also has more damage on all of his abilities and much lower cooldowns on those abilities, especially at early ranks. Rengar is more durable and a better team fighter, due to the durability he gains from his W. I would argue that Kha'Zix has a higher skill ceiling than Rengar, because of the sheer amount of outplay potential in his kit.

Now, about your question, "why no love for Kha'Zix?" Well, is Kha'Zix in a bad place right now? I do not think so. His numbers match up to a very popular pick, and he fulfills the assassin role better than Rengar (imo, since he pumps out more damage). I've played against many Kha'Zix jungle in the pre-season. I know it's possible that he can survive in the jungle, and have an impact. So, if he can have an impact and he's not in a bad place, why isn't there love for one of the most popular junglers of season 4? My answer is twofold. 1) the current meta revolves around very mobile champions that have a lot of dashes. Dashes are not affected by soft cc (slows). Kha'Zix uses slows primarily as a ganking tool, along with sheer power. Can you think of anyone who has a hard CC and comparable burst to Kha'Zix that also fills the assassin / fighter jungle role? If you guessed Rengar, you're right! His assassination pattern is much more reliable in the current meta. 2) Kha'Zix, to me, excels at invading the enemy jungle and getting a quick kill on their jungler, and then waltzing out safely. Counter junglers took a really hard hit with the current jungle changes. It is a high risk, low/moderate reward that doesn't really warrant taking the risk anymore.

So, my answer to "y nu luv fur bug" is that the bug is not the problem. It is counter junglers that are in a bad place, and this is what Kha'Zix does best. His assassination patterns aren't reliable enough to be picked consistently either. So until either the meta changes or counter jungling is made to be more rewarding, the bug won't be top tier. I still think he is a good champion to play in certain compositions against certain compositions. Picking him in blind, though? I wouldn't say it's a great idea.

If you're having troubles getting him to survive in the jungle, I'm a jungle main and I can help if you like.

P.S.

J4 / Vi compared to Kha'Zix is not really fair, especially since their ratios aren't actually bigger and their cooldowns are like hella long. More of their damage comes from armor shred and % health damage, anyways.

iateurdoughnut1/27/2015, 6:07:09 PM1 votes

I thought the same thing too when I first played him (this was in between all the nerfd to kha). I did pretty bad at first but I bought him after riot was finally done nerfing him and I have to say he is still very powerful if played right. He is more oppurtunistic now and takes some degree of skill to play (my friends told me stories of kha on release dealing 3k dmg to isolated targets) so I think he is in a good spot now. Buffing his heal may not be a bad idea but I'm pretty sure he needs no dmg buffs (his isolated q still deals abt 1500 dmg when evolved)

Condottiero1/28/2015, 4:20:48 AM1 votes

I believe he's still good, but not as a jungler anymore. Kha'Zix has high AD scaling, but low base damage on his primary damage ability, so it makes sense to put him in a lane to allow him to get the farm he needs.

The trick to laning Kha'Zix top lane is to:

  • Start Flask + 2HP Pots + 2 Mana Pots (Wait for the 4th pot).
  • Start W, and use it to deal extreme amounts of damage at level 1 along with an empowered autoattack to cheese the other laner. Max W 100% of the time, only use Q to last hit. After level 1, don't randomly walk up to the other laner and try to melee.
  • Rush item 3070 . After this item, buy item 3134 and then buyitem 3035 . Contrary to popular belief, Muramana Kha'Zix isn't "trash" or obsolete anymore, even in light of massive nerfs to W.
  • Evolve W first 100% of the time. The increased hitbox of W is too strong not to take advantage of. After, evolve E and then Q. Never evolve R, it's been overnerfed and doesn't give you more damage.
  • After evolving W, you want to use one spike to hit the minions, and another spike to hit the enemy champion. This allows for you to conserve mana by harrassing at the same time as healing yourself up.
  • Late game, always remember to activate Muramana to deal 1000 damage with each Q. When a squishy is slightly out of position, W>E>Hydra>Q and instakill it.

Final build:

item 3158 item 3074 item 3035 item 3042 item 3071

Final item can either be item 3072 or item 3508 . I personally prefer Reaver to hit 40% CDR.

Never build defensive items like item 3143 or item 3102 on Kha'Zix, because it doesn't help at all because resistances suck right now and it only delays your death by 0.5 seconds.

TTGOz1/28/2015, 4:31:02 AM1 votes

The last 3 Kha'Zix's I've played against have wrecked me. Literally would just fly in, 2 shot me, then fly out after my team tries to figure out what the fuck happened.

He had a mix of damage and resistances, and still melted me (ADC, and one game mid.) but his ult made him invincible and he could just ult, jump in, burst me, then ult again and jump out again with his reset.

I'd say Kha's in a good place right now. The last game I played as Kha too went about that way too.

AChanceOfReign1/29/2015, 4:31:08 AM1 votes

Well I fail at making complaints ._.

Mayor Stubbs1/27/2015, 4:24:41 AM1 votes

Because he's a disgusting bug. He deserves to be smashed into the ground like the rest of his kind.