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Derp Princess·5/17/2015, 3:43:39 PM·3 votes·1,159 views

Let us be real for a moment.

Something is seriously wrong when every single game there is Blitzcrank Leona Nautilus or ALMOST ALWAYS Thresh. They aren't very hard to play champions, they have simplistic designs, while Thresh in particular is overloaded with utility, tankiness and even damage. Honestly, perhaps too simple. They're tanky and can't really be punished for their mistakes like other supports are... not that nautilus or blitzcrank are supposed to be a support, right? At least according to their designed roles... Lets take my favorite Lulu , squishy as hell but fun to play... and gets outclassed by people who sit in a bush and zone you hard. You get caught you get punished by dying, they get caught they get punished by wasting a health potion. Whether it is their champions core strength or not, it's clear that anyone who isn't using this bad boy item 3302 are in bad positions right now.

Does the problem lie in item 3302 's line itself? Probably. It gives 75 health on already tanky champions at level 1! A bit too much. Meanwhile item 3303 gives a whole whopping 5ap... on champs who scale at a typical .5 ap ratio or lower. item 3301 God forbid this thing ever be bought, thought item 3069 is the best sure.

I mean, if a champ is in every game while people who are ACTUALLY CLASSIFIED TO BE SUPPORTS are OUTCLASSED by those who aren't, is there not a problem at all? Am I the only person to have an issue with this? Thing is Riot won't address this issue and the community seems to look the other way and call anyone who says anything about it a scrub.

For example, playing Lulu vs Thresh .. I have to go the extra mile to be even on par with him when she as a poke champ is supposed to counter him... it used to be that way, not anymore that is for sure.

So perhaps we can actually get lanes back to being more than just "hey I'm tankier than you so I'm going to engage on you and kill you because I can and you can't do shit about it" straight from level 1. That would be nice, wouldn't it? I mean sure, you could say hey poke them down so when they engage on you then you can kill them. But oh you know item 3302 allows these tanky behemoths to HEAL. Hey, I'd be fine with them healing the ADC some, but they get to heal themselves too? All the poke I do and damage I do to either the support so they can't engage or the carry themselves, they get to heal it all right back up? What bullshit is this?

So I ask you a serious question from a game-play perspective: Why on Earth should I bother playing anyone (who are actually supports) besides Thresh or Leona? I don't get much out of it at this point... This has been an issue for over a year too, not just because of the tank meta. My answer is: you have no reason to do so... period, other than for fun.

19 Comments

Wickedfates5/17/2015, 3:52:00 PM5 votes

[{quoted}](name=Neko Kagami,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PUt0WLq1,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-05-17T15:43:39.644+0000)

So I ask you a serious question from a game-play perspective: Why on Earth should I bother playing anyone (who are actually supports) besides Thresh or Leona? I don't get much out of it at this point... This has been an issue for over a year too, not just because of the tank meta. My answer is: you have no reason to do so... period, other than for fun.

i only play this game for fun....

Sona ftw

SpectralWraithX5/17/2015, 4:06:05 PM2 votes

Hmmmm disagreed. I main Nami support. She has good cc, hard disengage and a really good heal for long fights. Her heal does cost mana which is why after I pick up my gold generation item I build chalice into athene's for mana regen and then I can sustain my adc all day long. That heal from face of the mountain is minuscule in late game compared to nami or even sona heals. And I normally finish off by selling my gold generation item and going tank. My final build for nami usually looks something like this. Athene's unholy grail, Mobi boots, Ruby Sightstone, Locket of the iron solari and Randuin's omen. Using Nami, I 1 v 1 a leona and won. I also 1 v 1 a fiora who was foolish enough to tower dive me on nami.

SpectralWraithX5/17/2015, 4:10:36 PM2 votes

Although, in saying that, it is difficult for using support champs with little sustain for their adc's. Namely, lulu, karma, morgana. Nami and sona don't have that problem because they have high sustain for their adc's and themselves.

Erockandroll5/17/2015, 5:29:58 PM1 votes

Leona and thresh are good for picks because of their engage tools, But with support level gold, they can't be the team's tank. This does make them fair in a pick comp. Then again, if the team goes in with the expectation that the tank support is going to be for picks, then they really don't need many items.

One of the things I noticed is that Poke is quite fair in the Tank meta, because you can start to wear down the enemy tank, before they can get the chance to engage, (Assuming you have the range to do so.) And they have been buffed with the introduction of Luden's echo. And against a poke comp, sustained healing is a lot more effective.

I recall back in season 4 when the support items where created. item 3303 High risk, high reward item 3302 Moderate risk, moderate reward item 3301 Low risk, low reward

Though I think in retrospect these were not good means of balancing these items, as they encouraged very different playstyles. The coin, while passive in it's gold generation, provided a ton of utility that almost any support would actually enjoy. But people would still take spellthief over coin because of the greater gold generation. Even when Talisman had better utility that any other GP10 item, people would still start spellthief just to sell it later for talisman later.

Inversely, Spellthief has the least appreciated late game build. NO support really upgrades it, in favor of more important support items like sight stone and mobi boots, they just use spellthiefs, gold gen to get their. And from a gameplay stand point, they support aggressive poke supports. (as well as some sustain supports.)

However the whole relic shield line is useful at all stages of the game. Which may be part of the reason why tanks support are so good, because they benefit too much from their own item. If riots going to balance these items, they need to focus less on how much these items make in gold, and more on how they help their receptive class of support.

DJ Di05/17/2015, 5:46:16 PM1 votes

Imo they should buff item 3303 's gold income. I know that supports in general don't need much gold to be effective; but I feel that some (mainly AP Supports like Sona Morgana Zyra Karma ) are pretty item dependant.

Gwellaouen5/17/2015, 5:52:58 PM1 votes

I don't know but I have a lot of fun playing Thresh. I find myself able to make tons of plays. His kit is fun. Anyway for me. On the other hand, I really like playing Karma and Janna too. I find myself able to search for good plays as when I play Thresh.

It's just taking the right champion on the right situation. Tough ... What I like the most is playing against a Support who counters mine. Being Thresh vs a poke/mage support. It's a sort of challenge to me.

So no, I do not find those agressive champs easy to use. I find them having a wondrous kit. Anyway, for Thresh. Don't tell me to play Blitzcrank. XD''

FantasySniper5/17/2015, 6:11:56 PM1 votes

Zyra Ahahahahahahahahahaha!

Lulu is sort of in a bad spot right now, so she isn't a very good example. It isn't because of the meta or anything, she just got nerfed hard to make up for her lane prowess, and they have yet to "fix" her.

Hex the FenFen5/17/2015, 6:33:13 PM1 votes

I agree and disagree. I play Janna and Zyra support quite a bit. If you manage mana enough poking with Zyra is the best feeling cause they wont want to all in her, and Janna has an awesome shield and disengage. However, playing supports like Janna, Zyra, Sona, Nami and Lulu against Blitz will always be hell...I also agree, he isn't a support, yet no one wants to do anything about him or his stupid high damage.

doiminat0r36005/17/2015, 6:57:20 PM1 votes

It's really saddening to see that Riot has yet to do anything about the support role. We only have sightstone that still only gives health which is near useless to champions like Janna, Sona, and even Soraka (since there is no HP Regen). Even what is considered to be a support character Gangplank is outclassed by a midlaner or even Cassiopeia (as a support). There needs to be something done about the support role. Maybe in PRESEASON 2016?