Riot, if you want to stop losing players, it's time to clean house

Smitemuffin·6/8/2017, 1:23:52 AM·50 votes·4,313 views

I hate to call out people in public who doubtlessly give their best effort all the time, but I don't think anybody (them included) could even fault me at this point. And with good reason. I'm pretty sure we're at least 2 years past that. So let's get down to brass tacks:

Just how many times has the balance team made the same mistake over and over and over again?

What do I mean exactly? Well, I mean 2 things:

  1. How many times do you have to waste months of time and resources reworking the same champions over and over because every attempt at balance just makes them worse than they were before? We're on what iteration of Ryze? He's currently holding the distinct honor of worst champion in two different roles on this patch. I'm pretty sure Leblanc is back on the drawing board after what...a year since her rework? And then let's not forget Azir who is a relatively new release, yet totally unplayable. Are you even going to bother trying to deal with the monstrosity that you turned Mordekaiser into? It's been almost 2 years since you waved the white flag after his reincarnation as a bot laner and dumped him in the trash heap. How many times will you have to redo Urgot if his rework ever gets done? _How about that _Aatrox rework huh? His play rate isn't even 1% after 2 patches of work on him. You only let him be viable for about a month and a half back in season 5 before you nerfed him back into the same don't-ever-pick-this-champ dumpster he's been trapped in since Season 2. All this wasted time could be far better spent working on outdated champs like Tryndamere the right-click wonder or giving Malphite either an actual laning phase or more than 1 relevant spell to cast in teamfights. Heck, why don't we throw everybody for a loop and make Teemo more than an auto-loss for the first time since you nerfed his ultimate by 30% AP?

  2. You have this pattern of making new champs/reworks mechanically unfair to play against, then if you try to bring them down to match other champs, have to nerf them to the point of uselessness because your core champion design was absurd to start with. Where do I start on this one? Oh...how about...Mordekaiser RekSai Skarner Kalista Ivern Azir Camille Fizz Fiora Jhin KogMaw Leblanc Katarina Lucian Poppy Ryze Talon Viktor Yasuo Shaco Shyvana Quinn Graves AurelionSol Lulu Kindred

Is that enough of a list? Every single one of those champs hinges on a fine line of nerfs/buffs that either makes them never-pick or must-ban. There is no in-between with these champs. And in every case it is because their core design was an unadaptable failure. "Hey, what if we give an ADC infinite dashes?" "Hey, what if we take a mage and just make his AP ratios so high that our only alternative is to make all his spells hit in at least 2 stages?" "What if we rework Kog'Maw and then have to revert it because he's either a free win or a free loss?". I could go on through this entire list. And I haven't even touched the champs like Evelynn Elise or LeeSin who completely ruin the jungle meta for anything not horrifically overtuned for not being in the aforementioned 3 champs we see in the top tier. 2 of those 3 have been the top-tier jg for every single season since season 3. BOOOOOORIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNNNNG. "Oh, gee. I wonder what new and exciting pick I'm going to see TSM choose this ga-LeeSin LeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinElise LeeSinLeeSinLeeSinLeeSinElise LeeSinLeeSinElise LeeSinElise Olaf

I sure hope you don't wonder why you're losing veteran players. I haven't even scratched the surface yet, but this is probably enough to keep you busy for at least a year.

126 Comments

ModAcademy Kayn6/8/2017, 6:07:22 AM16 votes

Why should a rework have to improve playrate? Just because each champion isn't equally played, doesn't mean that some champions are worse off. Aatrox is actually doing pretty fine numbers wise.

AirKingNeo6/8/2017, 4:50:23 PM9 votes

I completely agree. I love Riot; I'd even enjoy working for them, but I cannot understand why the balance team has been allowed to keep up this constant imbalance since about season 4's beginning. Just looking upon the past since Ekko's release we've had:

  • Sated Devourer exist for about a season.

  • Release Kindred being broken for months.

  • Multiple champions who were nerfed because of Sated Devourer, then once it was removed (or effectively removed from their use) where never compensated back for those nerfs.

  • Leblanc premage update.

  • Leblanc postmage update.

  • Release Preseason 6 Rageblade costing way too little. (It was fine once the price was raised.)

  • Post-Mage-Update Rageblade being complete and absolute garbage on all but 1 melee carry, Yi. (If you were to say Jax/Irelia/Xin Zhao, I would say, "Why don't you build them full crit?" You would reply, "Because they would have to build full damage crit based builds for it to be effective, but then they'd be blown up for not having tankiness." And that is the same reason why Rageblade sucks now.)

  • Maw no longer stacking with Sterak's Gage (which especially no longer makes sense because Sterak's Gage can't be built by squishy characters anymore).

  • Syndra, Viktor, Jayce, Kennen, Tank Ekko, Lucian, Ahri, Kog'maw, Graves, Lulu, Ivern, Malzahar, Maokai, Rengar, Graves, Kha'zix, and Lee Sin were left broken for multiple months until they finally got nerfed.

  • They have absolutely no clue how to balance Camille right now. Same for Kalista and Azir.

  • They let Camille be released as overpowered as she was.

  • Mordekaiser.

  • Pantheon and Fiora are still top tier top laners now and it's been over a month.

  • The current Kindred rework sucks and if you don't believe me you can look at the Kindred mains subreddit just to see how many people fucking hate it. Oh, and did I mention that her best build involves skipping a jungle enchantment and rushing Infinity Edge?

This list probably isn't even complete, but the lack of care for balance is extremely disheartening.

Warhammer Titan6/8/2017, 1:38:54 AM9 votes

Its not as easy to perfectly balance a game

FreeVolibear6/8/2017, 1:38:38 PM5 votes

When I see posts like this, my first question is: Where are the statistics showing that players are leaving?

doiminat0r36006/8/2017, 3:26:52 PM5 votes

The balance team and the rework team and the new champion team are 3 different areas. Stopping the production of one area does nothing but put many out of work.

Funkin Dunkin6/8/2017, 2:14:35 PM4 votes

Don't touch my Urgot !!

ZT Xperimentor6/8/2017, 4:06:08 PM3 votes

At this point, I wonder if things could be worse by swapping the rework & balance teams with eachother. I concur the game has been going downhill, ever since they started avoid common sense when it comes to gameplay; anymore they seem to follow the rule 'fun to play as, frustrating to fight against'.

To those who question 'how are they loosing players?' Consider this, people who play nothing but ranked have been complaining increasingly loudly about being setup with players outside their rank, why do you suppose that is? If there's not enough people in that rank, the matchmaking system will pull players from other ranks to fill the match. It's a symptom of the growing problem, loosing players.

Tobias Brackner6/8/2017, 7:13:27 PM3 votes

It's not about the balance team.

If LoL is losing players it's because of toxic babies.

Which is why Riot is reworking the Honor system and I am hype.

Scary Door6/8/2017, 11:43:33 PM3 votes

Take my upvote and if you had something to sell I'd say 'take my wallet'. OP is 100% right. Let me expand on this.

For all the love that the balance/design team gets for their reworks or Sion and Poppy (well deserved I might add), there are MANY champions in this game that have glaring issues in terms of raw power, game health or just general viability that need to be addressed.

What do the following champions have in common? Azir, Camile, Nidalee, LeBlanc, Rek'sai and Ryze.

They are all in the bottom ten in terms of win rates and in the case of Azir, Nid, Rek'sai and Ryze they have been for a long time now. All of these champions (other than Camile) have received reworks of a small or grand scale over the last year or so and they have all objectively failed to address their core issues or have made the champion worse in every way.

Ryze has been on the chopping block a few times and each rework has made his win rate tank further (now at 36% as of this writing) and his playstyle absolutely awful to play. But why stop there, let's look at a few other cases that need to be addressed...

AHRI : Still sitting at a 52% win rate, surprisingly this is the lowest her win rate has been in 24 months, even at that there is not another champion in all of League of Legends that has her consistently high win rate, not one. She is just too safe and too easy to pick up and win with despite not having experience playing her. Mobility rules and she has it. Any immobile midlaner might as well pack it in and head for the fountain when playing against even a modestly "skilled" Ahri.

AZIR : It is virtually impossible to balance this champion, period. His kit is just too overloaded and oppressive or if any one element is taken down he becomes completely useless. If you give him any power it's just too punishing to his opponents because of his very design, but if you take that power away he can't even do what he was (poorly) designed to do. He just needs a complete overhaul. Unlikely to see that anytime soon.

CAMILE : She hasn't even been out for a year and Camile is already relegated to the dumpster with the ninth lowest win rate in the game presently. Again, there is no way to properly balance her though, because her kit is just way too overpowering if her numbers are brought up at all. Who thought that giving a champion true damage, a heal, a massive gap closer, innate tankiness and, most of all, an ult that you CANNOT ESCAPE would be a good idea? Whoever thought that shouldn't have a job today, period.

EVELYNN : Another champion that simply cannot be balanced. Either she is incredibly strong or despicably weak---she's been the latter for a long time. Personally I'm pretty happy about that as I think stealth mechanics are terrible in all PVP games, nevertheless one cannot ignore that she is tragically unfun to play against when ahead but in her current state not at all fun to play, period. Her ult seems to be where her power is these days and it just doesn't leave much room for the rest of her to do much. Most people probably never even use her E and why would you? It does nothing!

FIORA : I almost long for the days of old Fiora at this point. I liked her rework, the vitals and working off of her theme as a duelist, but she has become completely overbearing in top lane against almost all opponents. The real problem here is that Fiora has no weak or vulnerable period during a game. She can flat out destroy just about anyone at any time even at level 1. "But she's a duelist", sure... so is Jax, but Jax cannot outtrade most people at level 1 or 2. Fiora can.

FIZZ : Currently the second most banned champion (behind Yasuo) with a 65% ban rate. Don't wanna play him as he was intended? Cool, just build tank. Now, Riot has attempted to mitigate this with various balance changes, but as long as Fizz has his troll poll on a 5.5 second cooldown with max CDR, he's viable with ANY build... ANY. BUILD. That shouldn't happen. Make his troll poll a 20 second cooldown at all ranks, and maybe we've got something. But Fizz shouldn't have the damage and easy in-and-out that he does without having some consequence. If he had a meaningful 'window of power' then I think the above would be justified.

KALISTA : I actually like Kalista, but she's borderline unplayable as she is now, all of her power has been stripped---the last straw was taking her AD and reducing it to 90% effectiveness. I get it, it's hard to balance an ADC with virtually limitless mobility, but isn't that the entire point of this thread? They should have NEVER released an adc that can simply bunny hop and chase down or out-kite anyone in the game. Now, of course, since her autos hit like some rejected Chef-Boy-R-D product, it doesn't really matter, but it's frustrating when someone on my team picks her and I see her destroyed by just about every other ADC.

LEE SIN : League of Legends is a business venture of Riot games first and a video game second, I get that. I know that some champions are always going to remain viable no matter what, because in the era of e$port$ it's all about the bucks---but come on, there is just no reason that Lee Sin should have the (I'll use one of your buzz words) 'agency' that he does without having any real trade offs. Lee is strong early game, mid game and late game for different reasons, but at no point is he ever worthless or even lackluster.

Lee has mobility, high damage and the ability to pick off and seperate teammates with a poing and click ultimate. What's his weakness? He really doesn't have one. His ult does a shitload of damage, but even if it did NOTHING the fact that it's on such a short cooldown and is so gamebreaking just doesn't make sense. And why does he still have ward hopping when it was removed from Katarina? I'd argue that Kat should still have it and Lee shouldn't. (Kat with her 44% win rate certainly needs something right about now).

LUCIAN : This guy... ugh. The Zed of bot lane is just a balancing dilemma. Lucian is the reason that BoRK had to be nerfed, meanwhile it's the only item that makes Kalista even close to playable---and she still isn't. His passive and subsequent burst just makes him a pick-or-ban type of champion every single game. I almost never play Lucian, but I played him in a game a few weeks back going 13/2/11 against an opponent who was higher ranked and, candidly, better than me... but since I chose Lucian and they chose Corki, I win easily.

MALZAHAR : What was wrong with the original Malz? He was a lane bully, sure, but his late game was very mediocre, I get that you wanted to try something new, but at what point are you just going to admit that the attempt failed and bring him back to what he was before.. just revert the changes like you did with Kog'Maw. There's no shame in admitting mistakes.

MORDEKEISER : Morde was reworked because his old playstyle felt too binary---he just smashed abilities and blew you up too quickly... or at least this was Riot's reasoning. So let's look at what happened to ol' metal man since. They tried to force him bot lane, that failed. They gave him a pet dragon... that was neat, but at the cost of the rest of his kit it seemed to be a waste. Morde's core issues were never really addressed...

So where does Morde stand now? Well, he's back to being pretty binary, he either feeds hard or is unstoppable in a solo lane---it really depends upon matchup, but there is very little "counterplay" in a sense which was something that the rework was supposed to address. I LOVED old Mordekeiser and now I just can't bring myself to play him. His abilities feel so disjointed and his W doesn't even fit his theme at all really especially compared to the old W.

RYZE : Just bring back the original Ryze already, apologize for the last few years and move on. Sure, original Ryze as pretty one dimensional, but at least he was "balanced" in the sense that his winrate was 48-51%, he was immobile, got destroyed by long range champs, but did pretty well in close combat. Each time Riot has reworked him or made changes he has become worse... his winrate drops, his playstyle becomes more spammy but feels less satisfying. Ryze is just not a fun champion to play, to play against, to have on or against your team. He has the lowest win rate in the game by far in the 36-38% range... as of this morning it was 36%, the lowest I've ever seen any champion attain in League of Legends.

TALIYAH : Yep, Riot has already forgotten the stoneweaver, left on the scrap heap by and large. What was wrong with her original W? Taliyah is just outclassed by just about every other midlaner that there's very little reason to play her. Personally I love her abilities that she had upon release, but the changes to her wave clear and W have made her a troll pick at best. She's never been above a 48% win rate (currently 47) and likely never will be. While she isn't the most blatant case of poor balancing, she is definitely one that needs to be addressed.

ZYRA : When can we actually play Zyra again? Simple question. Outside of a very niche situation or two, she is completely unviable in mid and barely passable as a support. You've left her for dead just like many of the other champions I listed.

General Esdeath 6/8/2017, 11:48:10 PM2 votes

Ryze needs to be a champ that relies on something other than his point and click snare. Leblanc is supposed to be the deceiver, but she doesn't really do that when her clone disappears after walking in a manner that no player ever would (making it too obvious) not to mention in higher elo players ping MIA and watch the map. I've even called the bluff. There's no way that LB just killed my mid and is now up here top 4 seconds later. Her damage on her W needed that nerf but the bigger issue was her E hitbox being so random. Azir needs his soldier damaged/attack speed toned the fuck down so his other skills can actually get damage on them and give him the ability to make plays. LeeSin honestly just needs his damage on R and Q (It doesn't need an execute on the 2nd cast) toned down, and maybe lower the range on his W by one Teemo

BigBellBrute6/8/2017, 8:38:13 PM2 votes

Expecting over 100 champs to always be perfectly balanced is foolish. There will always be champs that will be better than others. When you nerf that champ, some other champ will take its place as "broken" The only way to get perfect balance is to give every champ the exact same stats, the exact same moves the exact same everything and make them only superficially look different. Is that what you want?