Too many champions are dumpstered because of pros.

Koechophe·8/14/2018, 6:19:09 PM·87 votes·19,212 views

I'm not normally a fan of winrates, but they demonstrate the point pretty well: Ryze 44% Sejuani 46% Gnar 46% Kalista 47% TahmKench 47% Maokai 47% Galio 47% Azir 45% Gragas 47% Shen 48% Gangplank 48% Karma 47% Zac 47%

That's about a tenth of the champion pool, and I'm sure someone is going to point out people I missed. These champs range from sub-par to nearly unplayable without team cooridnation (which you won't be able to find in solo queue, and the worst part is that a fair few of them (sejuani, Galio, Ryze, Maokai, Zac, Gragas, Gangplank, Karma) are sitting in this position because of their VGU/reworks.

Having an underpowered champion is just as gamebreaking as having an over powered one. More needs to be done to support regular players for "pro-centric" champs.

141 Comments

JedenVojak8/14/2018, 7:51:03 PM48 votes

Not all champions don't need to be equally powerful.

Not all champions need to be balanced.

Not all champions need to be viable in pro play.

But all champions should be _playable _ in solo queue.

EDIT: Error noted by Koechophe

Profirix8/14/2018, 6:36:27 PM46 votes

Support Tahm Kench is officially dead after this patch. Rarely did Kench in a support lane use is W offensively. He always wants to give his carries the kill. They make Q slightly more spammable but don't touch its cost. TK will become more abusive top lane now but gone are his days as solo or duo support. So much for giving power back to tanks. His tankiness wasn't changed at all.

Oh my God I just realized they did away with the damage buff. This is a straight nerf.

Blakiepug8/14/2018, 7:44:01 PM29 votes

I hate Riot's balance team so much this patch. Like why are they gutting Tahm Kench as if he were some high skill cap champion like Azir? Not only that, but even if these hard nerfs to his kit are to lower his pick rate in pro play, then shouldn't he be getting some compensation somewhere else in his kit? I don't understand why they are dumpstering my favorite champion. :(

Holgranth8/14/2018, 7:54:46 PM24 votes

Yeah I feel like the attempt to balance the game with the pro scene in mind has been a dismal failure.

AirKingNeo8/14/2018, 8:02:20 PM15 votes

Don't blame the pro players. Blame the balance designers.

Also, you forgot someone: Aatrox

Marothennan8/14/2018, 9:46:27 PM10 votes

To be fair, some of them deserve it because of their kits being beyond toxic

Thefrostyviking8/14/2018, 7:53:13 PM7 votes

Ashe isnt unplayable but she also sees her balance keyed around pro play a lot too i think x)

DeusVult8/14/2018, 11:55:03 PM5 votes

If a champion has 48-52% WR then IMo they are fine. If they have a 51+% winrate combined with an above 15% Play Rate, then they should begin to be looked at. Ban Rate also factors into those considerations, as a champ with an abnormally high ban rate, play rate with a decent win rate might need to have balance considerations taken since a champ with 100% P/BR should not have above a 50% winrate.

Also, the meta figures into these considerations, especially since Riot is not looking into actively fixing or shifting it atm. The current meta calls for high burst and mobility, with less emphasis put onto tankiness or DPS. Scaling champs, crit users in particular, are going to have a lower WR.

You can knock 3 champs right off at the start. Ryze Azir Kalista are never going to become viable without large kit changes. They provide too much emphasis to the user and none to their opponents. WHEN zoe finally receives substantial nerfs that her kit deserves, she will be in the same category.

Gangplank has a lower WR because games dont go as long as he wants them too, plus he lost a large chunk of raw damage in the IE changes. His barrels already ignored % of armor, he doesnt want true damage, he want MOAR DAKKA

Shen will never be strong in solo queue because if hes OK in SQ he is a god in team play.

All the tanks that you have listed up there have poor WR atm because no one plays a tank when the meta is all about level 2/3 burst with electrocute+ignite adding ~178 damage at level 3.

Which leaves us with Karma, who was overnerfed because she has both ranged burst and shields (nerfed for poke, then nerfed during the shield support nerf patch.) and Gnar who just isnt as strong a sidelane deulist as Fiora or camille, the reason he is picked in team play is because he can provide both side lane pressure AND front line engage, which makes him incredibly tough to balance as a champion.

Saying that pros are the reason that a champ gets nerfed or overnerfed is misleading. They can just take a champs skill ceiling as high as it possibly can and expose flaws that most players aren't able to ever see.

MYSTlCFLOW8/15/2018, 3:14:10 AM5 votes

revert zac

EvilMoustacheMan8/14/2018, 10:32:55 PM5 votes

You forgot to add Malzahar

HaIlMonitor8/14/2018, 11:25:25 PM4 votes

You could add Syndra to that list. The only reason they wont buff her more then they did is they dont want her pick and ban in Pro play.

Quort8/15/2018, 2:58:13 AM4 votes

Any day that Gragas is not viable is a good day in my book. C:

SweedishGunner8/15/2018, 1:11:04 AM3 votes

Kalista needs a rework, she can rot in the mean while.

RainXBlade8/14/2018, 9:22:26 PM3 votes

LC$

Athenes Lulu8/15/2018, 12:08:48 PM3 votes

I don't wanna be that guy, but that has long been a thing since season 3.

Maybe with periods of "balance" where a wider selection of champions become playable in soloQ, but that's not news.

Cµpcakke8/15/2018, 2:42:19 PM3 votes

Azir Hes a great example of riot looking at pro plays and not all elos

Blåbæret8/15/2018, 12:10:43 AM3 votes

I can't even play Sejuani anymore because she's literal walking trash in solo q. All thanks to pro play. Ridiculous.

nGio8/15/2018, 6:12:14 PM2 votes

Zac Still pissed about this one. A 50% wr and 2% pick rate for the better part of his existence, he gets randomly reworked. From his highest win % being top lane as an AP bruiser as God intended, to some clumsy balance nightmare that turned him into a troll pick in solo queue. I'm fucking tired of champions being chosen at random to get turned into some 'pros only' trash. Competitive play is the worst thing to ever happen to League.