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Can we get some context on the Viktor Changes?

doubleguac·4/21/2016, 2:13:08 PM·7 votes·1,062 views

Hi, long time Viktor player. He's been one of my top played champions since S2. I logged most my games on him before champion mastery was released, but if I had to guess, he's my most played champion by a very wide margin.

I was hoping to get some context on the Viktor changes, and offer my opinion of them.

First: why Riot has decided to substantially shift his power Second: why Riot has decided to shift his power in this specific way.

In regards to that first question: The changes look potentially very strong. if Viktor didn't exist, and this were a new champ being released, I'd be pumped for him. But I don't understand why Riot is making large-scale changes in the first place. His kit seems well designed, fun, and balanced to me.

As far as the specifics of the changes go: It seems like Riot is removing some of his flexibility in order to shift power onto his R.

His E is losing a lot of it's poke (though it has higher potential damage if you can lock the target into the second hit).

His Q's power is being shifted back into the fire-and-forget missile. This I don't understand. Riot outdid themselves with the last Viktor rework, and the new Q is the absolute best thing to come out of it. I love the Q. I love that most of the damage is loaded into the riskier auto attack.

Here's the thing: the new Chaos Storm looks crazy on paper. But (and I can only speak for myself here) I don't play Viktor for Chaos Storm. If Chaos Storm was my favorite part of his kit, I would just start playing Annie.

Viktor's E and Q are his most exciting abilities right now. They reward smart play and aggressive positioning. They make him what he is--a high risk/high reward burst champ.

To me, it feels like this rework is forgetting what makes Viktor actually fun. It's draining power from his most interactive and interesting abilities in order to give him a big moment on his ult.

But I'd love to hear from other viktor players. I'd also be very happy to hear from any Rioter who wants to offer some thoughts/info.

8 Comments

Sahn Uzal4/21/2016, 3:45:26 PM3 votes

I'm fine with changing power from his Ultimates initial burst to the Damage over Time part, this way you'll HAVE to micro manage the ultimate, you'll lose a lot of damage if you just leave it stand where you cast it. His E is an awesome ability that is a really large part of what makes Viktor unique and is really iconic to him. I'm really sad they are shifting power away from this ability, IMO it should hold a large part of his power budget.

Maniacal Doom4/21/2016, 3:22:34 PM2 votes

I completely agree! I've been a Viktor main since S3 and well...I think his changes are unnecesary. Especially because the way the direction of his rework is going...it's just so...bizarre.

Viktor, IMO, is a mage with a fairly healthy kit, a lot of flexibility..(can be seen in his build path....because it can change so much.) And just fun to play. Changing his power from his E (Even though it's now so much better at farming.) To his Q and Ultimate is just bizarre. I don't like how they're trying to eliminate his burst... the new changes seems almost designed to convert Viktor into a battle mage...something he has never been.

I've played him in the PBE and he feels so...different and clunky.

I hope riot does not go ahead with the changes.

Mogarl4/21/2016, 4:40:19 PM2 votes

I actually kind of like the change on his q, sort of. I wasn't really a massive fan of the auto damage scaling by level because it made it feel bad to rank it up, although I would like to see a return of the flat shield from ranking it up (reduce to 6% mana give the shield 10 points to base at 1st rank and 50 points at 5th).

I like having the option to raise his Q before E if I'm in a situation where I have to trade constantly, however I don't like the idea of E being worthless outside of a teamfight or waveclearing. After these changes what am I supposed to do against a Lux or Xerath? Unless Viktor is so overturned that he can bully them out of lane with his Q he's just going to get harassed out of lane with no chance to trade back.

I like the direction on his R though the delay is a little too much but I'm fine with the dot getting more of the damage. Doing half the damage every 1.25 seconds over 7.5 seconds would be a bit better without stepping it up too much.

Overall I find most of the changes are reasonable but the change to his E is just bad it will be just as bad as when they put they delay on Veigar's fence. Viktor will have a lot of damage when someone get's locked down but won't have the means to do it by himself unless your opponent is brain dead.

Knight Devout4/22/2016, 11:39:31 AM1 votes

I don't mind the damage nerfs on Q, but I think the changes are going in the opposite direction.
Riot stated that Viktor feels flat as his gameplay is mostly around landing high damage in a short window. What they did was just increasing the delay on that damage, but that doesn't address the main issue: by changing his damage and adding delays, Viktor will still feel flat, but he will also feel slower and clunky.

I think that, for the goal they want to achieve, they should keep the fast tick on R to put pressure, keep the delay on E, but fiddle with the damage and cooldowns. Q is just a generic poke, you can bring any other mage that can reliably land a damage spell from further away. If you want to make Viktor feel more engaged to teamfights, then nerf E, but reduce its cooldown so he can't afford to walk all the way back to base when waiting for the cd.

Adolf Hit R4/22/2016, 12:38:26 PM1 votes

I think the Q change is pretty good. Don't really like the mana ratio on the shield and I think the damage is a bit too low for the AA portion, but I like the fact that it doesn't scale with level anymore, both because that really made his midgame way too good, and because it potentially opens up Q max in some situations.

The ult change is interesting. Making the dot more impactful is cool, and while I don't like where it is right now i think the idea has potential.

The E change is awful. Viktor's E is his one truly unique ability. It takes skill to use and it feels really rewarding as it is right now. Making his signature ability into a clunky mess is a horrible, horrible, horrible idea. His W isn't really reliable enough to make his E land reliably, and needing an allied champion to make your abilities work feels terrible if you're not a champion who's designed for a duo lane.

ArlanKels4/22/2016, 12:49:29 PM1 votes

Alright let me try to take a crack at this... I'll try to channel the knowledge of a Rioter here...hopefully I don't get IronStylus otherwise I'll only be thinking of Leona.

Part of the main issue with Viktor is the distinctly powerful nature of his kit. Whenever he wants to he can drop damage, a very large sum of damage, on a targeted area between his highly potent ultimate and his double-layered E. This up front damage creates a Viktor who is hard to play against as well as to balance. While it has a similarity to Annie, and requires a bit more tactical capability to pull off via the skill shot on E, the damage can easily surpass Annie's own as well as impact far more enemy champions.

In order to try and adjust for that we've tweaked Viktor so that he's designed for longer engagements. His Q will create a larger shield overall so that you can dip in and out of the fight with less concern for your health. His E with the long delay means that you not only need to strike the target but also keep them in the area, which means you can't simply fire and instantly gain huge damage on the secondary blast.

This along with the significantly increased Damage over Time aspect of his ultimate puts heavy emphasis on strategic, accurate usage of his W as well as teamwork. If you play on a team with little to no crowd control than Viktor is going to have a tough time, but on a team composed of heavy stuns, roots or strong slows you'll be able to shine in team fights.

We're hoping to tweak the numbers as we continue to test out the new design for Viktor, so please be patient with us as we look for the sweet spot that'll make him feel powerful without being overpowering.