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Senna NEEDS to be given a HARSH choice. DAMAGE or UTILITY.

R0ses R Red·11/29/2019, 9:18:38 PM·138 votes·20,591 views

As most of us know, ADC Senna has a 54% wr. Everyone has their own thoughts as to why, BUT this post isn't about the why. It's about a realization that Senna has NO real tradeoffs between her damage and utility. I want to highlight just how advantaged she is and I'll do so by comparing her to Draven.

https://lolalytics.com/lol/senna/?lane=bottom

https://lolalytics.com/lol/draven/?tier=platinum_plus&patch=9.23&mode=ranked

Draven is a lanebully with practically ZERO utility in exchange for the fact that he outputs HIGH damage. His DMG ranking is 18/40 of the champions played in the ADC role. For reference, that ranking is better than Kai'Sa, Jinx, and Lucian's.

You want to know what Senna's DMG ranking is? 10/40!! Why does a champion(Senna) with so much utility outdamage a champion(Draven) WITHOUT any? Then, it GETS worse. Not only does she outdamage him, she also outheals him. She ranks number ONE in healing among the ADC role. Why? How is this fair? What's her tradeoff?

Being immobile? Draven and Jinx are immobile too, yet neither gets these ridiculous perks. Now I'm about to blow your minds here.

The main downside to being immobile is that it means you're easy to catch and kill right? So following this logic, Senna should die about as often as Draven(12/40 most deaths among adcs), Jinx (29/40 most deaths), or Varus(20/40 most deaths). Senna sits at 40/40. This means she is the **SAFEST CHAMPION ** to play in the ADC role! She is safer than Ezreal(37/40), Xayah(34/40), AND Kai'sa(32/40).

This also isn't just an issue about ADC Senna, Support Senna also does a disproportionately high amount of DMG for a champion with so much utility and healing.

What I want Riot to do is force her to choose. Utility or DMG. She cannot have both AND her safety. Either gut the heals, the DMG, the CC and stealth, OR the cooldowns if you insist on her having it all. Being immobile DOESN'T mean a champion can't be OP.

155 Comments

NTrumpWeTrust11/30/2019, 1:24:39 AM23 votes

Riot learned nothing from Pyke. Support-carry hybrids make sense ONLY if they're locked into support. But they aren't. If the only thing keeping a champion from popping off is a steady income of gold (like pyke) then you simply run them in a different role where your income is higher. Riot said they would try and balance her for both but if it came down to it they would balance her around being a support. Looks like we've already hit that point

NuggetMilk11/30/2019, 4:26:12 AM15 votes

I'm down to gut her damage and put her into more of a support role since we have an ADC on the way anyways.

Pika Fox11/29/2019, 10:27:00 PM14 votes

In no world is senna out damaging draven. Senna has a negative crit and AS modifier, and the damage on her abilities isnt all that high either. She physically cannot put out the damage other ADCs can.

Crescent Dusk11/30/2019, 9:03:31 AM9 votes

The range of her snare is also way too long. It's ridiculous how hard to gank a bot lane with her is because she can just throw out the snare and pop her shroud and that's immediately most gank attempts foiled. She's as aggravating to gank as Karma, except Karma is just a poke mage lacking in sustained damage and her utility is single target mostly whereas Senna's utility is multiple targets with better scaling and itemization paths.

CØulrophobia11/30/2019, 4:44:09 AM9 votes

Bot lane in general has turned into a fiesta. Senna is not an isolated occurance, nor can she be fixed for good until underlying issues are fixed.

As someone who is spamming support with Shaco and Swain "support" I have drawn 3 conclusions about botlane.

Support is not defined by healing, CC, damage or utility anymore. Any champ that scales decently well into lategame with low income can support if they have enough power crammed into their kit.
Enchanters are useless even in matchups they should be winning due to poor itemization and lack of damage(obligatory grain of salt here, they dont lack the damage, everyone else has too much damage). 2-3 years ago, I would never even think of diving Lulu or Janna while they are at 100% HP. With damage levels as they are right now, it is quite easy since even if I lack a bit of damage to kill them, they cant kill me.
Ganks and Dragon fights tend to decide the future outcome of the game. Teams need to be bot-centric to win the game, because if you dont gank bot you lose drakes and the game soon after.

All 3 of these problems need to be adressed before going for the Senna, because right now, we are 1 good cheap mage item away from mages replacing adcs entirely.

TonyTonyMordecai11/30/2019, 4:51:03 AM9 votes

Draven technically has utility with his E (knock back and slow), not reliable, but it's something given his ridiculous damage output.

BUT this isn't about Draven.

Anyway, I'd love for Senna to be modified to work better with enchanter builds so she can work as a healing SUPPORT, not a second carry. She's classified as a marksman support because she uses her auto attacks more often than her abilities, shouldn't be because she can "flex" into more than support. The problem is I'm not sure how to "force" her into just support or make her role diversity just more difficult, without fully changing her.

Anime Fizz11/30/2019, 5:50:09 AM8 votes

Senna is so broken, shes like imagine an ashe that had heals, had infinite scaling and had damage.

Its just way too good, she needs half of her kit to be gone basically, no more self healing for Q and R, base range down to 525, passive scaling nerfed.

Crimson Zeppelin11/29/2019, 10:11:03 PM8 votes

honestly most mages supports provide the same. It's the fact that she has shields and heals. Its too easy to apply them

siilentdeath11/29/2019, 11:50:43 PM7 votes

they need to get her in line like they did with pyke. if she is a support eliminate any ability she would have to wave clear or already has. this would force a support designed character to be kept in the support spot.

Karn Bishop11/30/2019, 1:31:51 AM3 votes

She does have tradeoffs, she has power and ok utility because when someone jumps on her she has zero response to that besides die unless flash is up and even then you might still die.

Say what you mean which is you dislike the tradeoffs she makes lack of mobility and instant death if gap closed on in exchange for power and decent utility, this is why we can't have nice things because when a champion has clear weaknesses the community bitches about the strong aspects of her kit instead.

I hope riot does not listen to your complaints as senna is in a decent spot and i would argue its other support items being weak sauce for tank champions thats causing this rather then senna herself.