The idea behind Nasus

WhamBamBoozler·Jun 22, 2015·7 votes·1,742 views

So here's a question. Is the idea behind Nasus anti-fun?

Now we all know the idea behind Nasus is to farm up your Q as much as you can and then build tanky. So you pretty much last hit with Q and more often then not lose your lane. However you become such a monster in the late game that you one hit almost anyone that isn't a brick wall with legs. SO you pretty much just negate any advantage that your lane opponent had by beating you in the early game. I know there are a fair number of champs that can punish Nasus for farming early game but what happens if you don't get a chance to counter pick him? Are you just supposed to hope to hell that your other team mates can help you win the game before he has the chance to farm up?

In all honesty if anyone has any ideas on how to fight a Nasus please let me know. Or if you happen to agree/disagree with me let me know why

36 Comments

Only Play DariusJun 22, 20157 votes

But you forgot to mention his hidden passive!

"Passive: you are 50% more likely to have a team that feeds extremely hard during early game, and have the fed enemy camp you the rest of the game as a result"

It's not a joke it's true, go play him.

LICENSED HOOKERJun 22, 20151 votes

i just had 800 something stacks last game, and we couldn't win. Why? because the infamous premade bot lane feed and by the time late game rolled around, i get focused down and then the rest of the team dies

Hard4HamstersJun 22, 20152 votes

Nasus's Q is the only real problem with its infinite stacking component. The problem is that if there was a cap put on the Q to where you no longer could stack it after it reached a certain level or if it had diminishing returns after a certain number of stacks, people would rage. People like to play Nasus believe it or not, and I think one part of that is the fantasy of his Q damage; they want to get dem stacks on that Q.

If the Q was capped though, Nasus could get meaningful buffs in other areas of his kit to make him a stronger champion throughout the game rather than a lategame massive tank carry that only exists in the early game to farm.

JJI744Jun 22, 20159 votes

See, I rather strongly disagree. From an opponents sandpoint, everything but Q discourages any sort of meaningful interaction.

Passive: why bother trying to do some poke damage or make a favorable trade? Doing so will inevitably push the wave, and Nasus will farm under turret and heal off any damage you dealt.

Wither: Want to brawl it out with Nasus? You are either withered and watch Nasus walk away, or are withered and try to fight with drasticly reduced damage output.

Spirit Fire: AoE "can't fight here" zone. Seriously, ignoring its frankly absurd base damage, the armor shred means that if you try to stand and fight, minions alone will wreck you early-game.

Fury of the sands: Want to all-in? OK, Nasus has bonus HP so he is harder to burst down, deals more %health damage than a max CDR Elise, and just for fun, gains bonus AD which just so happens to make him heal for more thanks to his passive.

His entire kit, outside of his Q, discourages Nasus' opponents from fighting.

Now on the other side: Q obviously encourages Nasus to just farm and avoid fights. Using wither offensively means by the time your in-range to fight, the slow has worn off. Spirit fire is much less effective when used offensively, both because your opponent can move away, and because they will not be the ones with minion aggro. Popping ult is an excellent way to make your opponent back off and wait out the duration.

His entire kit just creams inaction on both sides.

AutoreactiveCD4Jun 22, 20153 votes

Pretty much sums him up.

On paper I like Nasus because he seems like a utility/debuffing tank, but in practice he is boring or frustrating to play against.

Hard4HamstersJun 23, 20152 votes

I see it yeah. I was more under the impression that players used the abilities in that way to promote noninteractive play, rather than what the abilities' purposes were.

For instance his kit could also look like a champion looking for duels against his opponent as he has some builtin sustain, his wither, and Spirit Fire to make sure he can come out on top when he or his opponent engages a fight. But you could also just use those tools to dissuade a fight instead and fall back to stay safe.

Really I guess with the tools that Nasus has, you'd be crazy to try and 1v1 him unless you had a serious advantage. And even then, Nasus would probably just run away using whither. So you're probably right in saying his kit promotes noninteraction.

ZileanUltJesusOPJun 22, 20152 votes

coming from a nasus main, i will give you a couple of tips.

you cannot stop nasus from csing. Ive played every matchup and you just can't. I got lifesteal quints and support and defense masteries so i walk into lane with 17.5% lifesteal cloth armor and 5 biscuits. You will not push me out of lane. It just won't happen. You need to accept this.
you don't need to stop his csing to stop him. Group much earlier than normal with your team and take objectives. Take tp and go to fights that nasus will not be at. Get other lanes ahead. and force nasus to help his team when he isnt ready.
Counter picking him is worthless, he will outscale all of his counters., AP or AD. Oh picking renekton or darius? congrats i rush ninja tabi and frozen heart and have 250 armor. Oh picking teemo or ryze? congrats i rush spirit visage merc treads and laugh at you attempting to damage me. He will find a way to cs it doesn't matter what you do, so fuck it harrass him as much as you can then go destroy other lanes with your team.
If you really want a good pick against nasus, there is one dude that i always have issues with. Olaf, he is the only character in the game i cannot free farm and build for and ignore. Every single time he walks up for cs you E him then w then auto him all the way back to his tower and keep Eing him. It is extremely annoying plus you basically have a free cleanse for his wither so when you are ready to kill him E him and wait for him to wither, ult and slam his face into the dirt. I would even consider taking ignite in this matchup and making it your sole purpose to anally penetrate nasus is hard as you can all game.

Muh boiiJun 22, 20151 votes

Don't forget about Trundle whose ult will steal your life and as well as armor, and with q he can take some of your damage away, but also use the auto reset to keep attacking even when withered, and since most trundles build BoTRK he also has that life shred.

ZileanUltJesusOPJun 22, 20151 votes

his problem is his lane poke and harrass. He just doesnt have any. It's a free farm lane for nasus. He builds a thornmail and watches you wreck yourself. The second you ult him he withers you and just walks away until your ult is done. Also his q damage is based completely on his stacks not his AD. His ad is only a small part of it.

PikmintsJun 22, 20152 votes

Stonewall talked about Nasus in one of his more recent videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gK4ay0sYS8Q

He was made in a time where top laners were not very dynamic and were mostly slugfests. He was designed to focus on farming and directly get more powerful as a result, having non-immediate power in his kit. Ultimately if Riot changed the way his Q worked, they'd be changing his identity at this point and he would need a little compensation, one that I've seen nobody suggest an alternative for.

Nanuk PihoqahiakJun 22, 20151 votes

It's only anti-fun because it requires a minimum of one person babysitting him. This in conjunction with a team that might not do so well early game quickly leads to frustration or flaming if Nasus somehow comes out ahead.

Meep ManJun 22, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Nanuk Pihoqahiak,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HEteQTXU,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-06-22T10:55:50.390+0000)

It's only anti-fun because it requires a minimum of one person babysitting him. This in conjunction with a team that might not do so well early game quickly leads to frustration or flaming if Nasus somehow comes out ahead.

Yeah, but thats not Nasus, thats the community.

SuffocationJun 22, 20151 votes

His passive is the problem IMO, because everyone says you must deny him and wreck him during lane phase but, he'll will build tanky, and he has a natural sustain with his passive so your harass won't hurt him that much. You can't move at mid because he'll afk farm at top and will roll on your team during late game but he benefits more if he stays on lane than you so yeah, I don't really see what you can do against him.

DaxterrJun 22, 20151 votes

I agree, nasus is very far from a fun champ. From the very first stack you get a creeping feeling of inevitable doom. His passive is over tuned at low levels resulting in many factors working against you when you try to stop him from farming. Whither is an absolute joke too, considering the cooldown.

WillHealForHonorJun 22, 20151 votes

I often play mundo vs him.. I can actually outscale him imo.. Ofc in theory he should outscale me.. But the games are NEVER so long he can reach that point.. I just get a thornmail.. and watch nasus kill himself :P

ZileanUltJesusOPJun 22, 20151 votes

If nasus is attacking you in team fights something is seriously wrong with that guy

WillHealForHonorJun 22, 20151 votes

u do know that he can be kited ver well.. u just need to hit ur cleavers and hes permaslowed... what choice does he have then.. ?? and u stop his splitpush with mundo.. mundo is gud against him imo

AnidanJun 22, 20151 votes

The one time I played a Mundo against Nasus it was pretty much the same deal. Maybe Nasus just can't always hang around with Mundo? Not sure, but either way every time I've seen Mundo v. Nasus, it doesn't favor Nasus. At all.

ZileanUltJesusOPJun 22, 20151 votes

lol what? if you are focusing all of your cleavers and damage on nasus in team fights, you will lose that team fight. Also nasus doesnt care about your cleavers. He will just ghost and his ms will still be 400 after cleavers if you manage to hit him. Also your harrass in lane is a joke. As soon as nasus builds a spirit visage and frozen heart you can't touch him. I'm a nasus main and mundo is like my favorite matchup next to malphite. They can't touch you in lane and its basically free csing all game.

WillHealForHonorJun 22, 20151 votes

Its true.. Nasus is a hard matchup but the funny thing is that later on i can 1v1 a nasus even tho he has stacked like a god.. When er are both full build the matchup favors mundo.. but before that the matchup favors nasus ur right.. But the thing is i have played against nasus many times and i can only remember one time where i shat on me.. But the rest of the times i went at least even with him late game.. And btw the peel for ur adcs is very valuable.. trust me ;)

ZileanUltJesusOPJun 22, 20151 votes

ok there are a lot of things wrong with this. If nasus's ult is up mundo has 0 chance of dueling him. It does 5% of your max HP per sec converted into bonus damage. Since you are a tank that is a ton of damage converting into his AD. Second no nasus above bronze gives rats ass about you any point i nthe game. when i play against mundo i probably don't even q him the entire game unless i get a gank or if hes the last one left in a team fight. Mundo does no damage to me so idc about him. He isn't a threat to me. Also, i nteam fights if you are peeling for me to not get to your adc that means you aren't peeling for our mage or assassin, which means i did my job and your adc just died. Or if you peel for them i slow your adc for 95 percent and do 3/4 of their hp per Q on a 5 sec slow and AS slow which is cancer for adc's Nasus is the best late game champion in the entire game, if you let it get to 40 min you will lose the game. to end my argument, mundo is no threat to nasus at all. I will gladly take nasus against your mundo and prove that to you.

WillHealForHonorJun 22, 20151 votes

Well im just saying what i have experienced im my games.. dont know about all that theory u present..

AnidanJun 22, 20151 votes

Did... Did you just offer out a 1v1.. in a team-based game?

Good game, kiddos, The forums got him!

ZileanUltJesusOPJun 22, 20151 votes

I could care less if i beat him or win the game. The point was to show that mundo cannot stop nasus from csing and can't 1 v 1 him. Will mundo have a bigger game presence? maybe idk. I wasn't going omg noob 1 v 1 me get rekt. I was saying it in a friendly way in attempting to prove my point or show him that nasus doesnt lose to mundo. This entire argument if you read it at all was based off of mundo being able to 1 v 1 nasus and stop him in lane and outscale him. Only once did we say anything about team fights and it still involved his damage output to me. Maybe next time you try to be a dick on the forums and make a complete ass of yourself you will actually pay attention to what you are posting to

AnidanJun 23, 20151 votes

Wasn't being a dick, just pointed out that you called out for a 1v1 at all, which is innately hilarious. And I make an ass of myself all the time on the internet and in person, so that's pretty old shit. I paid attention to what I read, and what I read was one person replying to some potentially wrong or biased arguments with other potentially wrong or biased arguments, and then some hyperboles got in on it and it was great fun for everyone.

Muh boiiJun 22, 20151 votes

If the Nasus is diving your carry of course you should be focusing cleavers onto him to help kite.
Cleaver's slow by 40%, ghost speeds you up by 27%. Nasus with a base ms 350+45 for boots would be moving at around 300 which is about 100 ms slower than most champions. Nasus is also has a large model and will be very easy to hit.
Nasus is really easy to hit if he is just running in straight for your adc.

ZileanUltJesusOPJun 22, 20151 votes

Thats the point, if you are focusing him, you aren't focusing the carries on his team.

Sightless66Jun 22, 20152 votes

And he isn't hitting yours.

FHMarshyJun 22, 20151 votes

See, I think you are confused about one thing. Nasus really isn't about winning lane, it's all about his Q stacks. Chances are, if you can zone him enough, he can't farm Q at all. And if you manage to take all the towers with a kill advantage, go snowball other lanes. With Nasus not farming Q early game, he would basically need to farm every single second to get back into the game, making team fights 4v5 in your favor. if he abandons farm and joins the team fight, then he is an easy target. Without any Q stacks, he is just useless.

All you need to do if you beat a nasus in lane, is to pressure map 5v4 and win that hard. Trust me, even the tankiest Nasus can't take on a fed APC and ADC when they have peels.

EnosetcJun 22, 20151 votes

honestly, the only thing stopping me from pulling the "power without gameplay anti-pattern" card on nasus is the fact that every role aside from support needs farm to be effective

Confron7a7ion7Jun 22, 20151 votes

There are several ways to beat a Nasus. He has NO mobility and is easy to kite, if you can kill him a few times in lane that will slow his progress significantly, he cant carry 4 other players that all got shut down even if he was fed in lane, The Q damage is mitigated by armor, You can always counter his spit push because he cant be all places at once.

Yes. He turns into a monster. No, You cant really stop that, you can only slow him down. However there are a lot of ways to play around that.

WhamBamBoozlerJun 22, 20151 votes

Would having his passive level up with him maybe help some of his early game ability to just shake off whatever damage you can put on him?

Sightless66Jun 22, 20151 votes

It already does. His lifesteal is 10 - 20% based on his level.

WhamBamBoozlerJun 23, 20151 votes

Well that's pie on my face haha