The counterplay to Veigar's live stun: QSS, Cleanse, Zhonyas, Mercs/Tenacity, Smart Positioning, Difficulty of the stun, Banshee's Veil Rito's Conclusion: Toxic AF THErE IS NO COUntERPLAY SO brOKen must rewoRK
The counterplay to Zed's ult: QSS, Zhonyas Rito's Conclusion: Zed is healthy and balanced champion layered with counterplay
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Welcome to the League of Acrobats/Mobility.
"The counterplay to Veigar's live stun: QSS, Cleanse, Zhonyas, Mercs/Tenacity, Smart Positioning, Difficulty of the stun, Banshee's Veil"
Also add in: His only escape, high cd, only useful with one time burst that can be countered with q farm denial. Veigar was a champ that was actually layered with nuanced counterplay options and weaknesses. Now he's garbage.
lets be real veigar stun is broken
The stun definitely needed a nerf/rework. I mean being able to stun an entire team for 2.5 seconds was ridiculous. I do NOT think this is the right way to do it tho, a range nerf, a cap on the number of stunnable characters (the cage breaks after 3 people walk through it)
Although a beef with the OP, Zhonyas doesn't help against vei stun, he can kill you before it wears off, even if he lands it at max range and had to waddle up.
ummm your comparing an ult with an 80sec cd at max, and a stun with 16sec cd at max, how does this prove anything?
Riot's chaning it, because of a multitude of reasons
So, Riot is changing it to fulfill the ability to truly allow the opponent to react to the skill by
This means that players can actively make a decision on how to react to the skill, rather than OMG VEIGAR IS SUPER LOW, I"M GONNA GO IN. And he just goes "NOPE!" Stuns you instantly before you can even react then blows you up before you can even press the button for cleanse or QSS.
I find that stun terrifying. D: It can go down at anytime I'm lane without warning, allowing him to get free poke on me and later on, absolutely destroy me.
Zhonya's only works if I'm not stunned, QSS has a 90 second cooldown and doesn't stack if you're a mage or tank. Cleanse is super risky if you aren't playing ranked, and banshee's veil can fail in hundreds of ways, including you accidentally walking inside. Difficulty isn't counterplay because that means whether I win or lose depends completely on the other player. Most non-tank/bruiser builds don't give a drop of tenacity.
You just have to use the smart positioning thing you were talking about and pray to the League gods that he doesn't place it right on top of you or where you going. Now while I agree with a small "wind up" I'm fine with it hitting infinite people and its range. I just want a meaningful chance to dodge.
Zed...well the items work a lot more reliably. Not that that will solve his energy costs, lane safety, harass, and the cooldown of said items.
LOL
yeah why just hate on veigar? You used to be able to use cleans, QSS and other forms to break out of malzahar's ulti and beat him while he stared at you. but it seems they changed it to where you cant. So where is the counter play in that?
To be fair Zed is also countered by hard CC which isn't hard to apply at all when he jumps in the middle of your fucking team. Unless he builds QSS too (and it upgrades into a 120 AD item so why not?), then you are fucked.
WRONG! The counterplay to Veigar's stun is smart positioning. The rest of those options are either counter building or a mistake from Veigar.
The counterplay to Zed's ultimate is to send a stun behind you as he lands. Alternatively, Smart positioning (admittedly smarter than against Veigar due to the W, but it still works) and also to dodge his abilities (you will almost always get hit by at least two shadow slashes and a Shuriken against a good Zed, but you should be able to dodge the second Shuriken, which early game stops the kill).
Pretend I'm Red.
"We understand that we might have undercut the compensation buffs needed for Veigar to be viable. We are still looking at the invisible magic data. We plan on adding some adjustments to him either the patch after next, or soonTM. Specifically, we're looking at reducing the mana cost on his w by 5. We hope this will do something. And seperate the something from the something late game fantasy strategic counterplay diversity."
First off, none of those things that you mentioned are forms of counterplay, for either Zed ult or Veigar stun, outside of positioning, which applies for Zed ult as well.
Second of all, where did you get that Zhonya's was a counter to Veigar stun? You can't Zhonya's while you are stunned. Likewise, Veigar can play around Banshee's Veil so that it doesn't block the stun. And tenacity helps, but doesn't matter because Veigar's stun is so long. You could buy some Tenacity from items like Merc's, but it doesn't change the fact that Veigar can still stun you for over 2 seconds, which I believe is all he needs to get his combo off.
You look at Zed, and there isn't any direct counterplay to his ult, but the counterplay to it is that you dodge the abilities he uses after, although that still doesn't change the fact that he is still broken.
Mawp2/15/2015, 6:35:57 AMur dum
