Boards›Gameplay

LP Loss/Gain. - How about some individual performance points?

Konidias·11/3/2014, 7:19:03 PM·3 votes·2,667 views

The game is team based, I know... but your individual performance should count for SOMETHING.

Too often I find myself outperforming my team and/or the enemy team... yet due to a few teammate mistakes, we end up throwing the game and losing. You take a huge LP hit just like the rest of your team. But do you really deserve it?

How about the game actually looks at your KDA, CS, champion damage, turret damage, inhib damage, gold earned, dragon/baron damage, etc, and put that all together to reward you with some LP regardless of win/loss? (obviously assists would need to count a lot since supports aren't dealing crazy damage or getting a lot of kills) I mean the system isn't perfect but there needs to be some sort of metric for measuring and rewarding individual skill.

Think about it, instead of losing 20LP for one game and only gaining 17LP for a win, it would look like:

Win = 17 LP + 8 bonus LP for individual peformance = +25 LP Lose = -20 LP + 8 bonus LP for individual performance = -12 LP

This would allow people who are outperforming their team/the enemy team to actually climb out of the "elo hell" they are in.

Right now the game is 100% black and white based on your team winning or losing. But sometimes you get the potato teammate who throws the game, or the afk, or the troll, or the feeder, etc. If you could still at least earn SOMETHING back by performing well, then the losses wouldn't be so rough and the wins would be more rewarding.

For the worse performing players, they really wouldn't see any change. They'd still lose the 20 LP but not really gain any extra. Makes sense right? It rewards the winning team and punishes the losing team, but then it actually rewards people based on their individual performance as well.

My idea would be to take all of the stats that the game is tracking for each player, and create a final "score" for them based on those stats. Then compare that score to the scores of everyone else in the match. If your score is higher, you get more LP. If your score is lower, you get less (or none)

Yay? Nay?

9 Comments

Karcist11/3/2014, 8:44:39 PM2 votes

People would afk or surrender too early during losing games to avoid further worsening their KDA.

Legendari11/3/2014, 8:07:11 PM2 votes

I think you'd definitely see a lot less tower diving and kill chasing if the number of objectives you participated in taking would increase or lower your LP gain/loss when the match ended. I'd like to see something that recognized KDA, as I'm currently averaging around 5.0, but I'm afraid that it would just cause people to play ultra-conservative and leave their team members hanging out to dry in team fights.

I imagine there is probably a formula that Riot could come up using all of the available stats that might be able to determine how well somebody was playing. Sometimes it's really obvious (ie: you go 12-2-10 with 75% kill participation, participated in every tower kill, participated in every dragon and baron kill, had the most CS in the game, but your team threw and you lost). Other times, it may not be so obvious.

I definitely think it's possible, with all of the information that is available.

Mahnigguh11/3/2014, 7:24:33 PM2 votes

Definite YAY! I had a game last season where i was playing as Eve and we had 1 afk and one guy that kept reconnecting. I fought as hard as i could and ended up with a score of 43 and like 5 deaths and 20 some assists. of course we lost but it was an epic performance and i got absolutely nothing. (well i demolished the other team and turtled hard so a little bragging rights but :/ meh!)

DrCyanide11/3/2014, 8:20:33 PM1 votes

How about the game actually looks at your KDA, CS, champion damage, turret damage, inhib damage, gold earned, dragon/baron damage, etc, and put that all together to reward you with some LP regardless of win/loss? (obviously assists would need to count a lot since supports aren't dealing crazy damage or getting a lot of kills) I mean the system isn't perfect but there needs to be some sort of metric for measuring and rewarding individual skill.

This would allow people who are outperforming their team/the enemy team to actually climb out of the "elo hell" they are in

Play a support with an ADC who can't do anything right, and by your own metric, you'll be classified as dead weight.

  • KDA? Very upside down if your carry can't do things right.
  • CS? A good support normally has less than 50 in a 40 minute game (Relic Shield being the exception)
  • Champion Damage? You're consistently the benchmark for the bottom.
  • Turret Damage? Often this will be less than your champion damage.
  • Inhibitor Damage? Slow learner here...
  • Gold Earned? Gold earned is a measure of the other objectives you took, modified by rune, masteries and items. You're double counting stats that the support will be lacking on.
  • Dragon/Baron Damage? Really? You'd encourage teams to not pressure objectives because everyone would feel the need to get a few attacks on Baron.

And before you suggest them:

  • Not all supports have heals, so healing done wouldn't help.
  • Granting vision of the enemy killed will just encourage people to drop wards mid fight.

Directing your team on what to do when is often more valuable than these things you've listed, but there's no way to measure that.

TL;DR: Nay, a million times nay!

Konidias11/4/2014, 6:30:06 PM1 votes

I know some people are saying "people would play safer/avoid fights" in order to retain their KDA... but i feel like it would actually work the opposite.

If you are in a losing match, I think it would make you try even harder because the better you do (more objectives taken, more gold earned, etc) the less LP you'd lose when you lose the match.

Which in turn could result in you actually winning the match, since your team is all trying harder to perform better.

It would actually give you more incentive to play your best so you could get the bonus LP.

I mean, you're always gonna have those people trying to get a high KDA where they will just sit in base if the game is nearly lost. You can't really avoid that.

But I just want some sort of incentive for doing well in a game. It takes away some of the stress of playing with 4 random people. How many times has everyone been put on a team with a troll/afk/feeder/potato and it is just 20+ minutes of frustration, only to end with you losing exactly the same amount of LP as the guy who basically cost your team the game.

It just doesn't make sense to not reward somewhat on your individual performance. Sure it's a team game but even in team games there are MVPs.

edit: In fact, you could put more importance on getting assists by giving them more weight in your cumulative score. So each assist could count as like 3 kills. (since supports aren't really usually doing a lot of turret damage, or getting a lot of farm, or killing many champs)

This would actually create a situation where people WANT to play supports, as they have the potential to gain the most LP per game and lose the least if you play the role well.

And we all know that the support role needs some love.

Venompaw11/4/2014, 6:34:38 PM1 votes

Sure it's a team game but even in team games there are MVPs.

Some champs NEED their team to become mvps. I play karthus and I'm fully aware that I'm deadweight before level 11, then I carry afterwards.

Adding alternative point calculations is bad because winning is the ultimate objective and anything to detract from that is bad.

for example : If I suicide here, I'll lose 1 more lp but my chances of winning is increased,,,, so instead, I won't do that, and play it safer and save some lp.

I play karthus my teamates failures can become my successes. but my own success can cause my teamates to fail (by stealing gold /kills).

Konidias11/3/2014, 7:32:12 PM1 votes

I think it would definitely feel like an individual has more control over their ranking. Right now it just feels like I am rolling dice every game.

Your team is only as good as it's weakest link. If you have potato teammate, your team is also potato. Therefore the game thinks you are potato. So you get that whopping negative potato LP.

Jenova Synthesis11/3/2014, 8:01:35 PM1 votes

I Think that the point of the MMR system is kind of Riot's solution to this problem. If you do well consistently, but you lose games consistently, then you're going to get more LP for a win and you're going to Lose less LP for losing. It kind of makes up for it in a way.