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Shyvana and Yi don't need increased AP ratios...

Maikal·5/10/2016, 12:00:54 AM·27 votes·2,479 views

Shyvana and Yi don't need increased AP ratios to make guinsoos more attractive. Stacking guinsoos 6 times on a squishy Yi build will never happen, and Shyvana has no AS steroids and her Q does not stack guinsoos which is why no one built guinsoos before the nerfs to it either.

Yi doesn't need to deal more true damage than he was before his nerfs. He needs his ult nerf reverted, that's it. The E nerf being reverted would make crit builds less awkward (Zeal items don't affect E) but I can see it causing problems in the future if on-hit/bruiser itemization gets out of hand again.

Devourer junglers were fine before sated was released. When you had to nerf 2 champions that were balanced for 3 seasons MasterYi Udyr , that should have been an indicator that you done fucked up somewhere. Bloodrazer is currently a bit weaker than old (Pre-sated release) devourer, so just revert those champions nerfs and put them at the same strength that they were at before all this bullshit.

31 Comments

BluePolarizer5/10/2016, 2:20:12 AM7 votes

Can Yi just be reverted back to his season 3-5 state, where he was a mediocre 49% win rate champ even when infinitely stacking flare and devourer existed?

Sated Devourer was superior to even a 100 stack old devourer or feral flare, and you NEVER got a 100 stack old devourer/flare. You rarely even break 60.

Teridax685/10/2016, 9:45:57 AM5 votes

There are literally just two AD/AP hybrid items in the game, and out of those two, Guinsoo's Rageblade is overwhelmingly picked by AD champions (the AP is, in most cases, filler to make the item's stats deliberately inefficient), and Hextech Gunblade can be easily swapped out on those champions for Blade of the Ruined King. Neither Yi nor Shyvana need AP ratios in the first place, and balancing them around a quirk of itemization, which makes no real immediate sense to them, is going to end up playing to their disadvantage if Guinsoo's ever receives AP-related changes.

I think the main issue with Yi right now, as with most other melee damage-dealers, is that he dies too quickly when going for a damage build. Fixing his buggy Q could help him a lot, and potentially buffing his W damage mitigation could also help him clutch-block incoming attacks at the right times. Shyvana's abilities innately all scale with attack speed, so it's good of her to build the stat (she's probably the only champion who truly deserves to benefit from a tanky on-hit build), and she should be be able to stack Guinsoo's with her Q, but ultimately her problem right now is that her tanky damage fantasy doesn't sync that well with her build path (she's too squishy early and can't focus on dealing that much extra damage late). She needs a way to be a bit tankier while building damage items early, so maybe her passive could receive a buff to its early game numbers.

clement12135/10/2016, 1:55:43 AM4 votes

Agree, revert his R nerf.

LankPants5/10/2016, 8:39:53 AM4 votes

so just revert those champions nerfs and put them at the same strength that they were at before all this bullshit.

All Shyvana needs now and has ever needed is for her ult to act like Malphites. Seriously it makes no sense that the giant, fuck off dragon flying at you at 100Km/h can be not only stopped, but have her momentum completely reversed by a small bolt from a crossbow.

I'd take immunity to knockbacks on Shyv's ult over nerfs being reverted any day.

Rinky Dinky5/10/2016, 10:06:00 AM4 votes

Or we could just fix his obnoxious Q bugs. Thats 5% for experienced yi players right there.

folsomdsf5/10/2016, 5:56:46 AM2 votes

What's worse is that Shyvana has a non devourers build that is close to 50% winrate, cinderhulk. Just give her a little bit of her W damage back and call it a day. Yi? Revert the E and R nerfs and call it a day, he'll prolly hover between 47-50%.

MLDzXnRRR5/10/2016, 8:13:46 AM2 votes

Yi's Q is still bugged.

Evewynn5/10/2016, 10:46:51 AM2 votes

I really like the shyvana AP ratio, mostly because I miss AP shyv...

Profirix5/10/2016, 3:06:07 PM2 votes

Guinsoos is a trap on Shyvana. It costs 3600 gold and doesn't utilize twin bites effect. By the time you manage to get the 6 stacks, you've either already won or lost. Making an item feel 'less bad' by compensating for a stat that the champion already doesn't utilize effectively is a Band-aid fix for a laceration. If they really want to make it a workable item on these champions, they need to allow abilities that double auto-attacks to apply 2x stacks for that item.

Not that I think Shyvana needs all that much help in her current state. It is mostly just how bad she feels at the moment building the items she was meant to build (Bloodrazor, and Guinsoos apparently). The idea is to boost her on-hit because her E scales so well with AS and double-proc items. You can't really build her all tank because then she does no damage, but you can't build her all damage either because she doesn't have effective burst. You have to get 2-3 offensive items and go full tank afterwards in order to get the most out of her front-line, brawling, tank-shredding power.

Celeste Benal5/10/2016, 4:39:46 PM2 votes

Have you ever tried Rageblade Shyvana? The damage is incredible. And she already had AP ratios on her E and R. While I don't disagree that going devourer+rageblade made her squishy. The amount of damage output was insane. It was the kind of build one would go if they got supremely fed early and really didn't need to worry about getting burst down.

Honestly, there's nothing like ulting in as Shyvana, facerolling the keyboard, and watching the entire enemy team simply explode into flames.

Viperjcs19855/11/2016, 12:31:52 AM1 votes

Sadly I had to abandon Yi... and he is the champ i had the most skins for (even chroma). he is currently unplayable unless the enemy is completely retarded.

ModAcademy Kayn5/10/2016, 5:04:20 AM1 votes

They aren't being forced into buying Guinsos. They're making Hybrid items a little less waste of stats when it comes to the AP portion, and we all know Yi is building Guinso's regardless of his abilities Ratios. He really likes that Phantom Hit and early game AS boost.

Kapppaccino5/10/2016, 6:11:56 AM1 votes

i dont even play league anymore but i feel like league could take a break from stacking, AA junglers. it was the most unfun thing when the jungler comes out of the jungle at 25 mins and just 1v5 wins the game. i think riot should sloooooooowly buff them back to viability, but they can take their time lol

SpecterVonBaren5/10/2016, 5:08:57 PM1 votes

I dunno, I remember back when I was level 15 or something in Season 4 and how I built Rylais on Shyvana because I saw she had AP scaling. I'd actually be rather interested in seeing Shyvana open to the ability to build AD OR AP.

Traptintime5/10/2016, 7:52:43 PM1 votes

The real question is why add an ap ratio to nocturnes kit. Its such a little bit extra sustain in his passive that procs so infrequently I just dont see the point. He never built rage blade before and this (even with the ap scaling on his e) isn't going to push him any closer to building it.

69469238DEL15/10/2016, 9:30:17 PM1 votes

Nerfing Yi's R has Basically forced him to build Ghostblade for the CDR and the active, the active serves as the replacement for your always on cool down R

PiVoRx5/11/2016, 7:00:14 AM1 votes

Yi and Shyv are dumpster tier champions, dont expect any fireworks from Riot for them.

MunchCrunchLunch5/10/2016, 2:32:41 AM1 votes

they just want to force rageblade on every damn champion that auto attacks and is melee

Sheolik5/18/2016, 2:46:29 PM1 votes

Riot's been doing it for a couple of season - introduced op items, certain champions benefits from them a lot and their win rates skyrocket. Then Riot is nerfing said champions and later remove or nerf the item, leaving those champions completely unplayable. And I have big doubts whether it is that RIot balancing team is horrible incompetent or they are doing it all on purpose to force meta shifts.