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This is why I don't like facing Vayne

fountainAFK·5/14/2019, 5:47:56 AM·47 votes·15,439 views

Vayne is not "OP", arguably she is weak in pro play. Often when I lane against Vayne I win the lane, often very hard, she falls behind like 60 cs or so and dies multiple times.

Vayne is problematic however because this is not enough, I can not in any way what-so-ever stop her from snowballing. I had a game where I went vs Vayne toplane, I was winning and zoning so hard Vayne only had 36 cs at 18 minutes and had died 4 times, I had 4 plates down. We both recall and Vayne at this point however decided to go mid, and somehow gets a double there in no time when my jungler and mid tries to tower-dive. She recalls and comes back top, and she just press R, and pretty much 3 shoots me now.

Vayne is just too forgiving, and even if she falls hard behind she just need like one lucky fight and she is right back and outscaling everyone, despite being like 80-120 cs and 1-2 items behind. Champs like nasus at least will suck if they don't get farm for the first 20 minutes, most other adcs will as well. Most ADC's depend on being ahead or at least on pair with everyone in farm and items or they become super weak. But Vayne is fine being massively behind.

Vayne is due to her comebacky nature a massive issue in none pro play. In Pro play you have a team of professionals that are on the same page and want to end asap. In solo Q you don't have this. You have a team running around and chasing kills.

Sadly Vayne for some reason has to be designed with pro play in mind and therefor riot allows for Vayne to be annoying in other ELO's. Yet for champs like Teemo a different philosophy is applied and Teemo have been gutted for long due to being so annoying in low ELO. Nobody talks about balancing Teemo around pro plays. If they were Teemo would need some massive buffs.

Vaynes kit is also an issue that makes me hate facing her.

Vaynes kit gives has something to deal with everything, the only thing that matters is usually how Vayne is playing, not how I'm playing. If you play a hard engage champ, she can push you away, go invisible, tumble away etc, and probably 3 shoot you. The only way you get her is if she screws up. Vayne got an easy time itemising vs anything too, let's say you play a poke hero, she soon has life steal with runes + items and your poke no longer matter. She can just eat it and heal up from 3-4 autos on minions.

Vayne is just never a bad pick, she is good vs tanks, squishy champs, poke champs, none poke champs etc. While most other champs are situational. But what I hate most is that there is no way of shutting this late game carry down. The "conter play" is winning pre 20 min, this basically requires that all your lanes are winning, but say mid + top is loosing, good luck "winning pre 20" from botlane.

23 Comments

Tahminatrix 5/14/2019, 5:54:53 AM25 votes

Shes one of those champions that has too many of what I call (ignore) mechanics...things that ignore what you have in your own kit and can screw you over based on what you are....and all of these (ignores) are towards a specific group of champions while being useless against another group of champions.

Her tumble is a low enough cd to make her resistant against slows....its especially triggering to not even see her try to avoid my skillshot slow and instead just tumble while slowed.....but useless against point and clicks unless combined with R, and even then she can still be hit while in r just not likely to be targeted.

Her E bullies immobile melees too hard while being relatively useless against most assassins/ranged damage dealers (Im just talking about the knockback)

And her max health true damage is max health true damage...that's about it, yes she has to put herself at risk but if you/your team doesn't have the damage to kill her in a timely manner then you lose because she cheeses stat checks despite being an offensive oriented champion.

Basically she is too feast / famine based on the champions you have on your team and if the people who are playing the champs that can deal with her are actually competent at playing the game...and this isn't an issue with just vayne.

Craft Zeppelin5/14/2019, 7:00:45 AM9 votes

Veigar Nasus Yasuo MasterYi

We heard this before somewhere didn't we

OtterlyLost5/14/2019, 2:09:04 PM7 votes

The thing is, as a champion who is intended to only do damage, she can't actually be put behind. She kind of starts the game out ahead of everyone else already. Just for references sake, her passive gives her 30 MS toward enemy champions(which is already more than tier 1 boots) and her tumble, at level 1 with just a doran's blade and standard ADC runes, will give her roughly 36-37 AD.

That is 1552-1553 gold in stats. At level 1. Just for being Vayne.

That is absolutely insane. It basically means that, even if you put Vayne behind, she's not really behind. She's just even now. That's absolutely bullshit for a champion that scales like an absolute monster.

Critmaster Garen5/14/2019, 11:34:47 AM7 votes

this nerf means nothing. her winrate might drop by a few % but she will probably still be a regular pick as long as its above 50%. i will still keep perma banning her. fuck that champion and her unfair design.

Hayaishi25/14/2019, 4:53:20 PM5 votes

This is exactly what her problem is. There is no way of keeping this champion down.

Meanwhile i fall behind on Varus good luck ever recovering.

Hammermancer5/14/2019, 3:24:06 PM4 votes

her w needs to be physical damage

her ult AD needs to be lowered or even removed with a portion worked into her base AD

she should be encouraged to build pen and lethality if she goes invisible and abuses top lane... sorry but i'm not sorry

Laçez5/14/2019, 1:18:39 PM4 votes

I agree with you. Some champions just benefit too much off specific items, e.g. item 3124item 3078 and of recent, that dumb item item 3161 synergizing with passives making them op, so win or lose you're never irrelevant and have a higher than average chance of getting back into a game. It goes for a lot of champions other than Vayne like: MasterYi Yorick Yasuo Jax & Nasus Veigar (because of their infinite stacking bs). I would say though that Vayne is the least worrysome out of them all because she needs team work to excel. The rest seem to do just fine on their own or require specific team comps which counter them. I find that blatantly unfair & a bias that they aren't in the same league of other champions and you're either cucking yourself by not playing them or choosing a team composition to deal with them exclusively. They require a different focus in game and divide it to the point where you feel as if you are in a 5v6 where the 6th player is the clock. You have to watch them in the sidelanes and you can't even push lanes early if it means they can free farm safely and work towards those items.

The inability to fall off is one thing in itself but having a clear and unfair advantage over so many other champions is another. When I'm fed as Kindred (steam rolling games), I'm not one shotting people like an underfed Vayne would and I lose quite easily to champions like Yi despite playing a lot better. Of course there are counterpicks to certain champions but damn, sometimes it is unplayable because of how other champions work.

Vlada Cut5/14/2019, 12:33:19 PM3 votes

PRO PLAY DOES NOT EQUAL SOLO QUEUE [sg-shisa]

Ragnaveil5/14/2019, 3:55:18 PM2 votes

And we "nerfed" her btw. All it means is she'll likely take over toplane since she cant go bot.

AnotherFeeder5/14/2019, 11:26:36 PM2 votes

This is a huge wall of text to complain about the entire concept of scaling champions. If a scaling champ was useless after a lost lane, thered be no point playing them. It would be lane bullys every lane, every match.

ChaosReyn5/15/2019, 12:46:42 AM2 votes

I mean, the easiest answer (and a way to bring more balance back to the entire game is to nerf Vayne's cooldowns so she isn't firing a fucking machine gun while stealthing every half-second, and to make CDR less prevalent so that literally 100% of the game has a BARE MINIMUM of 20% CDR without even building for it.

Dingding1235/14/2019, 10:09:04 PM1 votes

Unless you're playing something equally as hypercarry, or as someone who can actually lock her down in teamfights: ya she OP.

It really is a matter of letting her teamfight or not.

Daddy Ants5/14/2019, 10:23:12 PM1 votes

Her winrate is down below 50%.

She's fine now.

https://i.gyazo.com/717f8843818d82e58d361e27bc459f5e.png

Most of the mains on the discord have agreed the go to build now is item 3153 item 3046 item 3031

Captainn Ginyu5/15/2019, 6:23:48 AM1 votes

vayne ether needs to lose all that damn true damge shes doing or nerf something on her ult im in favor of nerfing that Q cd reduction on her ult

Daddy Ants5/14/2019, 10:33:23 AM1 votes

The item that was breaking Vayne has been nerfed.

Gorderkiller5/14/2019, 6:36:15 AM1 votes

Yeah i played vayne and i was getting really close calls with xin. I almost died a few times early. Ive never taken vayne top before but i super know adc's and top well so i wanted to try it. I never died and played safe because i couldn't 1v1 xin i only used my q and e to farm and disengage. Vaynes E is fricken nuts when disengaging a gank. I could easily Q to turret or if they were cutting me off i would E them into the wall stunning them.

Eventually i scaled up and when i went all in on xin there was NOTHING he could do once i hit him. I used my R and stunned him against the wall and he was gone in seconds. I started shredding everyone with my awesome autos :3 im good at the game so i know what to do in team fights. Vayne is a monster but i could see her being shut down early if you have a gap closer.

Her E would probably suck though and unless she overextends its gonna be really hard to get close.

TSM Reptilian5/14/2019, 5:29:20 PM1 votes

I believe she feels like this because of the nature of her kit.