The problem with these "Nerf Yasuo" posts is that nobody is thinking about how to balance him.

Kadexe·2/4/2019, 7:55:37 PM·9 votes·6,891 views

Let's suppose Yasuo was Akali'd on a scale never seen before. Wind Wall lasts only 2 seconds and can only tank 500 damage, passive shield is gone, bonus crits are gone, and Yasuo can only dash once every 3 seconds. He drops to 30% winrate, and how Riot has to buff him. What exactly do they do?

  • Buffing his base stats, base damage of spells, and AD scalings enough to compensate for all the damage he will now be tanking would make him an insane bruiser. Without the shield passive, there is no longer any strategy in how he approaches enemies. He just dashes on them, overwhelms his enemies with superior stats, until one of them dies. Almost like Master Yi and Tryndamere do. He becomes a massive low elo menace because now it becomes more important to kite him.

  • Buffing his other cooldowns just makes him insane. Throwing tornadoes twice as often becomes necessary because he has so little protection from CC and damage, and relies more on stunlocking his enemies to death. Or maybe he windwalls multiple times every fight.

  • Without the crit passive, he instead would have AD scalings like Riven's, and would itemize more like standard bruisers. He's now too tanky to burst quickly, while doing massive damage to squishies. He'd be something similar to Irelia, but since he'd be less mobile, he'd be tankier or doing more damage. Or stunlocking his enemies more.

I'm sorry, but I can't imagine a world where Yasuo is more fun to play against and more balanced than he already is. It's very hard to balance these melee-ADC types and I firmly believe that the devil you know is better than the one you don't here.

66 Comments

Taliyahc2/4/2019, 9:15:34 PM10 votes

I think the really frustrating thing is seeing Yasuo carry on for years now as players have tried to get Riot to look into his kit and remove some of the abilities to make his kit not so overloaded, but they have done nothing for years now.

Honestly, people complained about Irelia and Akali and they got their kits toned down why is Yasuo an exception? feels like Riot double standards in champion balancing

TheSingularity2/4/2019, 8:39:29 PM9 votes

When it comes to champions like yasuo (have mechanics that bend the rules, that nobody can match and are plain frustrating), people don't want them balanced... they want them gone and tbh most can understand why. He brutally overloaded. He has 8 components in 5 spells (P2, Q2, W1, E1, R2), his Q breaks the rules of life steal (he heals for 100% per point, should be 33% as it's splash damage), his windwall mechanic is broken (not in the cri OP way. In that it blocks from all directions and originates from behind yas' model allowing panic windwalls when the spell is on top of him) and his R for some reason grants 50% armor pen on a champ who alrdy deals mostly true dmg with IE. This issue is exacerbated with his PD rush which, upon purchase makes it almost impossible for even his counters to 1v1 him.

We saw similar issues with kalista (hopping), azir (soldiers), akali (true stealth), irelia (disable+shield shred) and zoe (steals summoner spells). They have a tool that bends or breaks the rules, that no one can match that makes them inherently frustrating and obnoxious. They crushed 3 of them and maybe fixed akali/irelia. They're reluctant to crush yasuo because his playrate is so high. But his banrate speaks volumes of how the non-yas players feel, the highest of any champ at 56.7%.

When you then consider he hasn't once been balanced since his releases, why would you want him to be? They've had every opportunity to balance him and yet, here we are. 6 years, during which a single champ was never balanced. TBH crushing him and going back to the drawing board would be wonderful for the majority. But the minority fuels riots pockets to too significant a degree for that to happen.

To directly respond to your 3 scenarios: WInd wall is changed to wind slash on a 10 second cooldown: he slashes at the air removing a projectile, has a tiny frame so it must be accurate. Enemies can see the E indicator, his Q heals for 33% of the norm due to it being splash damage, R armor pen removed, shield charge slowed down. Double crit changed to 1.5X crit I've akali'd him, but I haven't kalista'd him (crushed vs deleted). He's weaker early, just as strong and potentially stronger late if we add a skill based reset mechanic on his new W

King Lego2/4/2019, 8:19:03 PM9 votes

When it comes to a champions that's frustrating to play against (even if you stomp him), pretty much nobody will be fair to that champion.

While i personally don't care about Yasuo, he is overloaded.

But like how i always say: You can blame CT for making the champion in the 1st place. [slayer-jinx-wink]

420 grams2/4/2019, 9:11:53 PM7 votes

He doesnt need a nerf, he needs a W rework. He's way too weak in some match ups and way too oppressive in others. Honestly just bad game design

Akali is SO HOT2/5/2019, 5:09:53 AM5 votes

They don't want him balanced they just want him gutted.

AirKingNeo2/4/2019, 10:58:39 PM4 votes

The problem with the nerf Yasuo posts is that Yasuo isn't a problem.

ROYALR3IGN2/5/2019, 7:24:47 PM2 votes

{quoted}

Let's suppose Yasuo was Akali'd on a scale never seen before. Wind Wall lasts only 2 seconds and can only tank 500 damage, passive shield is gone, bonus crits are gone, and Yasuo can only dash once every 3 seconds. He drops to 30% winrate, and how Riot has to buff him. What exactly do they do?

its not that all of these changes need to go through, its the fact that he has all of these things and so much safety while also having so much access to free stats. Yasuo is one of those champs where against most of the roster, save for Malzahar maybe or Azir, if you beat him its less so that you outplayed him and more so that he misplayed.

I don't think anyone is stupid enough to ask for all of his stuff to be removed, I think removing just one of these things is enough to make him bearable to lane against.

Vekkna2/5/2019, 5:28:22 PM2 votes

This post is actually pretty dumb. There are lots of ideas on how to add counterplay without gutting the champ. Any one of these examples would work wonders:

  • Give Windwall a flow cost
  • Give Windwall a flow threshold without a cost, decreasing with rank (100/70/40/10/0%)
  • Give the champ some actual cooldowns that don't decrease from building a primary stat?
  • Make passive shield a spell-shield rather than a Janna shield
  • Show shield value as gray shielding on health bar when shield is available
  • Autos/spells that proc passive shield do not draw minion fire
  • Windwall only blocks projectiles after end of cast animation, not instantly from center of Yasuo's hitbox
  • Yasuo's E marks are visible to his enemies

Literally any one of these things would help.

I can't imagine a world where Yasuo is more fun to play against and more balanced than he already is.

Which is an obvious failure of imagination.

3TWarrior2/5/2019, 5:00:19 AM2 votes

there have been plenty of balance suggestions

thing is, none have ever been listened to

most people just want his windwall gone OR CHANGED so he can be more about numbers and interaction instead of "I press a button and you can't do anything about it"

even when his winrate is not that great, he still holds the power to change the match at any time with his windwall and of course, he has his 0/10 powerspike that shows how quickly he can scale

CyanSolution2472/5/2019, 7:37:02 PM1 votes

I hate to play against yas as much as the rest of you, but is he really OP right now? how i would fix Yasuo to make him feel less oppressive: (not all at once) (also he would require buffs to bring him back to playable)

-Remove either his double crit or walking sheild passives -make it so his tornado q is on fourth cast not third (delay tornado when he is chasing you down) -Delete him from the game -decrease/remove his armor pen after ult -give certain abilitys special interactions against wind wall (nami ult splitting in 2 and going around) or (braums ult to go through) (Draven ults/q to bounce back) etc...

Both Irelia and Akali have been gutted recently could the same happen to Yasuo? Should the same happen to Yasuo?

anyways those are just some of my thoughts.

5050BS2/5/2019, 8:33:02 PM1 votes

Make Crit rate passive only 100% when he Draws his sword. Make Q Tornado slower and 1/2 the Range (its faster then Janna's Tornado) Make WW only block true Projectiles not any and all things Change E so it has a 16s CD with 3 charges. He has to make choices when he is chasing and can only chase in ONE wave not from Nexus to Nexus Make Passive 1/2 the value and recharges at a set Energy style rate. Make Ult not auto script him out side Turret range.

He is now lane able.

Yami No Ignis2/5/2019, 8:51:32 PM1 votes

simple, nerf his early game, and make him a late game champ so he can be playable

PopcornBunni2/5/2019, 9:56:46 PM1 votes

I had a yasuo changelist/rework on my old laptop before it died but can't recover the files, so forgive me if I misremember everything I'd thought of.

Passive: Yasuo builds flow by moving. Yasuo's abilities cost flow. Once he reaches 100 flow, Yasuo can cast his abilities at no cost and the next damage from champions, large or epic monsters, or turrets expends 100 flow to create a shield equal to 12.5% of Yasuo's max health. As long as the shield persists, Yasuo can continue to cast abilities at no cost. (Removed: doubled crit chance and lowered crit damage)

Q: Steel Tempest Cost: Free -> 15 flow Cooldown: 4-1.33 based on AS -> 4/3.5/3/2.5/2 Removed: tornado (moved to R) New: Upon reaching 2 stacks of gathering storm, the next cast of Steel Tempest hits in a 120 degree arc in front of Yasuo, stunning enemies hit for 1.5 seconds.

W: Windwall Cost: Free -> 50 flow Cooldown: 26/24/22/20/18 s -> 17/15/13/11/9 s Width: 300/350/400/450/500 -> 300 at all ranks Wall travel distance: 400 -> 800 Wall travel time: 0.25s + 3.75 s -> 4s, initially moving quickly then slowing down over the duration until it reaches its final range Wall duration: 4s (unchanged) Wall now has 2/3/4/5/6 health. Basic attacks deal 1 damage to the wall while ability projectiles deal 2.

E: Sweeping Blade Cost: Free (generates 7.5 flow) (unchanged) Cooldown: 0.5/0.4/0.3/0.2/0.1s -> 10/9/8/7/6 s Removed: on-target cooldown Cast type: Unit targeted -> aimed dash Dash length unchanged Damage type: Magic -> Physical Removed: Casts of Sweeping Blade cause increasing damage on concurrent casts New recast mechanic: If Yasuo passes through at least one enemy unit, he can recast sweeping blade. This effect can be used to allow a maximum of 3 total dashes. After the final dash the ability goes on cooldown.

R: Last Breath NEW: First cast: Fires a tornado outward 800 range (from 900 on former Q) Cost (First cast): 50 Flow Tornado damage: 60/120/180 + 100% Total AD Second cast: Yasuo blinks to an airborne target, generating 100 flow and suspending them while dealing damage. Removed: Critical strikes having 50% armor pen after casting R for 15 second NEW: Yasuo gains 40/50/60% armor pen (on all damage) against the targets hit by the second cast of Last Breath for 10 seconds


The buffs don't need to be in the form of damage or other raw numbers if the character itself is tweaked around different up or down times. This, for example, increases Yasuo's one-on-one dueling power, especially against melee matchups, while adding more means to play around him and hitting his biggest "nope" button in group fights.

Linna Excel2/4/2019, 10:56:10 PM1 votes

I'd remove the critical strike stuff from the passive. If he wants 100% crit chance he should build it like everyone else. I'd also have his E consume flow every time it is used so he has to choose between damage/mobility and defense.

Infernape2/5/2019, 7:38:44 AM1 votes

I can remember Riot saying that they were going to take a look at Yasuo's kit for a small rework a while back. Obviously they iceboxed the hell out of it.

Irelia Bot2/5/2019, 8:13:23 AM1 votes

Thinking of the balance that riot is providing to Irelia and Akali nothing worthwhile will be returned.

wildfox9T2/5/2019, 8:47:38 AM1 votes

keep his passive shield,it's not what it makes him frustrating since you can bait it with any cheap damage (the problem is when you add his windwall on top of it it looks too strong) make his ult give shield based on how many enemies he have around/he hit with his ult (the value is the same for a single enemy)

this will allow him to be more viable in teamfight without being too strong in a 1 vs 1 or needing an ability as broken as his windwall for not getting oneshot the first second that he dives in in any case it would make room for some nerfs

his crit passive it's also fine,after the early game the rest of the kit would deal like 0 damage without it,i think it feels too strong because his windwall doesn't allow you to fight back

yeah you got it,i think that the only problem in his kit is his W just make it last like 0.5 sec at lvl 1 then make it scale with levels (maybe removing the width scale?) up to whatever you want,but having 4 seconds where your enemy (if ranged) can't fight back it's too much for early trades

Illabethe2/5/2019, 9:07:26 AM1 votes

We've given advice before:

Reduce his shield size by 30%

Reduce the amount by which Q cooldown scales down per attack speed, so that it requires more than 1 item to max its cooldown reduction.

That's it in a nutshell: Yasuo's Q does more auto attacks/auto like skills per second than a friggin adc does. he can literally duel an adc by standing skill. He doesn't even need his ult or the Knockup.

Jinzo best card2/5/2019, 12:57:51 PM1 votes

It's not exactly players job to take time out of their private lives to try and fix Yasuo. That should be balance team one since they have more tools at their disposal to assure that the changes translate well from paper to reality.

SUCC Ghast2/5/2019, 5:56:53 PM1 votes

Well an obvious solution to nerf Yasuo and make us lower elo players feel better is too get rid of all the minor things his abilities give him. Get rid of his passive shield and movement speed, he already gets double crit he doesn't need 2 MORE PASSIVES. Vayne and sivir and now singed get a small amount of move speed from their passive... that's it....and Blitz gets a small shield... that's selective to magic damage... that's it. But Yasuo gets them both, plus double crit. Another thing is simply, get rid of his Q cooldown scaling with his attack speed. He shouldn't get all of this "quality of life" shit in his kit. He simply doesn't need it.

In all honest, if Riot wants to be ballsy, they would do these things, and here is a drastic one. Make it so Yasuo's ult doesn't give him free armor pen, and make his tornado mark targets instead, so he can only ult to the people HE HITS. Yasuo already gets invulnerability when he presses R, why does he need it to be easy to hit, and to get additional effects after it's finished?

Hügö2/5/2019, 7:00:12 PM1 votes

You know why people bitch about such champions same with akali and irelia? Because they have obnoxious shit in their kit. When riot removes them they can start getting balanced.