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Hey there! You want to talk about Vel'koz?

Protroid·1/22/2016, 5:51:27 AM·16 votes·2,051 views

Hello!

As was hinted by several rioters, Vel'koz will be one of the main six champions to be featured in the immobile mage update. I want to try to talk about some of my opinions on the champion, and what should be focused on for when his kit is tweaked.

For some background about me/why should you care about what I am saying, I'm a Vel'koz main, and have been pretty much been playing him since I had the IP to do so. Right now I am sitting at around 200K Mastery on Vel and achieved Gold last season almost exclusively using him. In addition, I am also an indie game designer, which I know in this industry is basically the equivalent of "Wait until my mixtape drops", but I am, and I have been able to work with some pretty neat people in the past because of that.

But lets talk Vel, starting with what Vel'koz is, both in terms of gameplay, mechanics, and lore.

Vel'koz is a creature of the Void that scours Runterra for knowledge through disintegration; The more Vel'koz disintegrates, the more he learns. Vel'koz puts whatever he encounters to the test, and makes them suffer greatly should they fail, not that Vel'koz would care however, seeing as their failure (NOT being disintegrated by a floating eye in armour) is his success. In gameplay terms, this is most noticably reflected in his passive; Organic Deconstruction, representing Vel'koz gaining an understanding of his foes. This three hit passive (do groan if you must, but I adore it), is applied in varying degrees by each of his spells, once by his Q; Plasma Fission, twice by his W; Void Rift, once by his E; Tectonic Disruption, and 5 times by his ultimate; Lifeform Disintegration Ray.

Previously, Rioters have discussed why they want to focus on Vel'koz, one comment coming from Riot BelugaWhale, noted this;

> [{quoted}](name=Riot BelugaWhale,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZadVZBdQ,comment-id=001e,timestamp=2016-01-07T21:17:23.229+0000) > > We understand the concern around Vel'koz/Roster updates. Personally I've seen multiple threads and posts specifically on Vel'koz - so here's a bit of clarity on our current thought process on him: > > Any change we implement on Vel'koz will almost certainly not be a major shift on his character or play - think Caitlyn scale rather than Graves. He IS under consideration however, because it is wrong to say that he is ideally designed as he is currently. For example, two such problems he currently has are: > > * All he does for his team is damage, which is hardly unique to him - there's no specific reason to want to bring Vel'koz onto a team > > * Many of his abilities don't quite feel right - for example laning mid involves spamming W down the creep wave repeatedly instead of focusing on creative Q play. > > Potential changes will likely be aimed at addressing these kinds of issues.

(This was taken from this thread; http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/ZadVZBdQ-legitimate-request-for-the-immobile-mage-update-leave-velkoz-alone?comment=001e)

I want to focus on the two issues highlighted. The first being "All he does for his team is damage", and the second being "His abilities don't quite feel right".

It's true, Vel'koz's main objective is to do damage, and a lot of it. This stems from the true damage on his passive, and his high base damage abilities (encouraging you to buy magic penetration to do even more damage). These lead to why I loved picking Vel'koz and playing him throughout season 5. If Vel'koz has any identity beyond do damage, its this; Vel'koz is a tank buster. Vel'koz should be the guy you pick to work your way through all of that magic resist to help weaken your enemy's front line. He's the champion you lock in when you start seeing Juggernauts, because his kiting and poking abilities can help make sure Darius gets dunked on by your team before he can go in for the dunk. The dreaded counter-dunk, if you will. Is it the way Vel'koz plays right now? Not entirely. Is it the direction I would want to see Vel'koz take in the coming immobile mage update? Yeah. When I play Vel'koz, I stack Magic Penetration. I work to land three hit combos, and if I am against an especially tanky team, the dreaded Rylandries can make even your Q tear away at an enemy tank.

As for the second point, Vel'koz abilities not feeling right, I simply disagree. The primary example given is how Void Rift is used in lane predominantly more that Plasma Fission, an opinion I agree with. But to say that that discourages creative Q play would be like saying Orianna fast clearing the minions with her ball prevents creative ball play. Both Orianna and Vel'koz look to clear the lane exceedingly fast. That way they can focus on making their enemy laner's life a living hell of split projectiles and balls until they return to the respawn pad. Even then, that is not to say that I never use my Q in lane. Whether I push my opponent in, face a stagnant lane, or get pushed in myself, I still regularly need to fire plasma fission in order to apply pressure, especially if I am against a ranged champion. Against a melee champion Vel'koz W-E combo works wonders.

Do I think Vel'koz should be updated? I don't really want him to be, because change is good scary, but at the same time, I also think that he stands a lot to benefit. My primary concern as a Vel'koz main is losing the cohesiveness of his kit. His abilities and passive just seem to naturally glide into eachother, and the tweaking of an ability or his passive could damage that cohesiveness.

If I was to break down why I play Vel'koz, I would narrow it to this;

  1. It feels extremely satisfying to land abilities. Both in terms of splitting his Q or proccing his passive.
  2. His abilities mesh well with eachother, allowing for some neat wombo combos should you have passed your geometry classes.
  3. Oh Darn

I know I'm not the only person who plays Vel, and I'm also certainly not the best person who plays Vel, but to lose those attributes would be devastating to me. Really I just want to hear more opinions, from community members, rioters, and anyone inbetween. What do we want to get out of a Vel'koz update, and is whatever we are gaining worth what we are potentially losing? I personally think Vel'koz is in a great spot, and even with the issues noted to draw him into consideration for the immobile mage update, there are other champions that need this update more (Such as Birdman Swain, or Galio).

27 Comments

ScurvyNave1/22/2016, 5:58:07 AM3 votes

Amen! Vel'koz is fine as he is and I feel puzzled as to why Riot wants to change him when there are many other mages who could use the attention more.

CerberusLycan1/22/2016, 12:07:03 PM2 votes

I think you hit on some really nice points. Vel'Koz in his present state is perfectly functional, and fun to play as well since his abilities flow into each other smoothly. Riot's looking to change him, which I'm admittedly hesitant about due to how completely fine he feels as is, but the track record of the team which will be working on him gives me faith, and I think they're completely right in their reasoning for looking to change him; he basically only brings damage to a team composition's virtues. Objectively, he's almost completely indistinct from Brand, for example, in terms of what he brings to the table. They're both immobile, have some CC, and their main strength is high AoE burst damage which can allow them to demolish teamfights. Quite a few mages can be summed up in this way, really. I like your identification of what makes Vel'koz unique that could be accentuated, though: tank-busting. Making him the mage you want to take when you see Juggernauts and Tanks on the enemy team seems interesting, and I think it fits with his character rather well -- everything is a specimen. Not even the most durable of champions are exempt from being researched.

One of the things I like most about Vel'Koz is how his kit meshes with itself right now. Abilities can be used to help land other abilities, and I appreciate how efficiently his passive can be applied as his kit works now -- every ability can be used to apply stacks to multiple targets if used well, and I just really like that, for some reason.

BLU Medic1/22/2016, 12:31:05 PM1 votes

Well said.

I really don't understand the "Vel'Koz has nothing distinct about him" vibe. His Q is an amazingly unique ability, his W provides an interesting form of wave clear that makes enemies have to count when he last used the skill and whether he has another W available and his E is amazing at setting up for both Q and W as well as giving him a tiny bit of hard CC.

He's way more interesting than Lux's Shield/Snare/Slow/Laser set up, or Ziggs' bombs and that's it. Vel'Koz is also in a really good, balanced spot, always has been, and they risk ruining that by reworking him!

rabbiter9191/22/2016, 1:37:44 PM1 votes

Honestly I love velkoz the way he is, but I did just think of a possible addition to his kit just based off his lore. Maybe he could gain something specifically against the champion he procs his passive on (extra pen, % damage, idk - something small) every time he procs it.

It might be a terrible idea but it just came to my head. That way he is truly learning about his target and getting an advantage from his new knowledge.

No changes is still the best though :)

cllesh1/22/2016, 2:23:36 PM1 votes

its terrifying to think of riot messing with Vel.... i mean... i dont think many peole complain about vel one way or the other... and a cait lv rework... wow... that could destroy him...

im scared and i dont even main him, i just like to play him every once and a while, guess ill say sorry now

Vanic9981/22/2016, 3:02:48 PM1 votes

I have almost half a million mastery points on VELKOZ. About 406k. I heard riot wanted to inspire more fancy q plays so would it be cool if he applied 2 stacks of his passive on the secondary bolts?

Veraska1/22/2016, 3:48:47 PM1 votes

I wouldn't say I'm a vel'koz main, he's definitely my favorite mage tho and I have m5 on him so I can share my thoughts

On vel'koz not being unique amongst other mages, I can agree there's little nuances people who play him recognize (your tank buster vision of him is an example) but that's not inherently obvious niche for him, so I can see them adding some strange mechanics to him involving deconstructing and learning like as he deconstruct targets he permanantly gains understanding of there structure making his passive do more damage as he learns more, something like that I could see, I'm not a big fan of this idea tho as I feel it'd be more of a limiter then an amplifier and on the end it's just another way to do more damage

On his W being maxed out primarily being used to clear waves instead of maxing Q, this I understand, riot wants every lane to be engaging and not just farm fests, so they remove champions tools to play safe and ignore the match up, shen's rework does this and I understand why it's needed for fighters, but mages don't gave the agency of assassins/fighters, if they fight they fight until they die or flash away, I don't think removing wave clear magically makes them fight the enemy zed more, just makes the class overall weaker, bit that's more of an opinion then a fact.

I'm a big fan of vel'koz and I'm hoping they don't make a mess out of him, I'm also excited to see what cool concept they come up with to distinguish him from other mages. I just hope his high moment still involves melting the enemy with a good ult

Meep Man1/22/2016, 8:15:24 PM1 votes

Vel'Koz's spells need to do more things besides combo together easily for lots of damage. Thats all they want. They also said his Passive, Q, and R wont be changed much. Only his W and E are getting changed a decent bit.

MrBuffington1/22/2016, 10:56:22 PM1 votes

I think having a niche as a tank buster would be really cool; you should cross post this on the Dev Corner thread if you haven't already, since I think more reds are checking there than on the regular boards

GhastlyGhoulMan1/23/2016, 1:52:24 AM1 votes

He would definitely be cool as a tank buster, I also feel though that he finds the most advantage in tight spaces/corridors (aka the jungle). That being said, I feel like he could get some awesome use from changing his W void pool a bit. Here's my thought.

What if his W created a circular, permanent void rift that would pulse with aoe magic damage every time you used one of your abilities? Enemies could destroy them by channeling energy to close them, like in Dominion. Otherwise, they would stay permanently on the map unless you reach your cap of total rifts (kind of like Rek'Sai).

Additionally, void rifts will pulse (wherever they are located) every tic (or few tics) of his ultimate.

This would make it so he keeps his ability to waveclear like his old W would, while adding not only some cool interactions that the enemy can be involved with but also adding some serious damage and the ability to bait them into channeling and holding still long enough for you to attack with something else.

BUT HE HAS TO PLAY SMART. If he just opens rifts willy nilly without caring WHERE he places them, they will become... irrelevant. But placed in the jungle path... Oh. OH!

Anyway, this is just a way to keep perhaps the INTEGRITY of his W while making his play feel SMARTER. As in, additionally rewarding a Vel'Koz player for LEARNING his opponent's movements and outsmarting them.

Thoughts? If it's a terrible idea, please downvote into oblivion. I'm all for Vel'Koz being great as well. :D

SKT Fakir4/13/2018, 2:59:42 PM1 votes

Vel'koz why dont use E. MAn wTf