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Riot Lets talk about Fiora

Inorì Yuzuriha·3/17/2019, 9:31:07 AM·19 votes·8,727 views

Please Give this a serious thought before deciding to downvote or upvote. Also Comment on your opinon.

Fiora doesn't feel like a "Grand Duelist" when thinking about champs of the category I felt Irelia, Riven, Yasuo, and Renekton felt like actual duelists. They are able to 1 v 1 really well as well as being able to team fight, however looking at Fiora she can't really do that as well as them. Sure she can 1 v 2 or 1 v 3 if she plays it well or they lack CC but she doesn't feel like her title states for "Grand Duelist". I feel like she is also rather weak due to being squishy, thinking maybe slight buff to hp per level or something, other bruisers are way Tankier but do equal or more damage than "Grand Duelist" with Trinity-Force only lets look at jax or irelia they are surprisingly tanky with just item 3078 Tiamat compared to Fiora with just a item 3078 and Tiamat. The damage she does is fine I see no problem to that, I feel like shes due for some buff of some sort or minor rework, I feel this way because compared to every other champ she doesn't feel very good to play currently.

Another issue with fiora is the fact that her mana feels rather limited, lets say at level 18 when you have maxed out abilities you use the abilities of:

( keep in mind fiora has a base mana of 980 )

R (100) + Q (40) + W (50) + E (60) = 250 Mana

and you should have about maybe 1 or 2 vitals hit already so you throw a few more Q's

R (100) + Q (40) + W (50) + E (60) + Q (40) = 290 Mana

That was basically 1/3 of her mana and afterwards she will probably have to shove wave fast so another Q and E

390 mana total wasted

if there were buffs I would expect something small like:

HP: 550 (+ 85) -> 570 (+92) Armor: 33 (+ 3.5) -> 33 (3.7)

and if there were a mini rework to her kit maybe some form of waveclear or a hard cc on one of the abilities. For example E doesnt slow but instead stun for .5 s which would give her some form of hard CC besides the long CD parry.

Edit: I do know these issues are caused by indirect nerfs, thats why I was stating that something small for early game could help. Not more Base AD but maybe more HP or Armor scaling increase or base stats buffed by 20 hp, and amor growth increase by .1 or .2 thes changes wouldnt impact her to where shes broken but rather to where she feels a bit better.

Edit 2: shes currently also a 46.7% wr according to champion.gg

Edit 3: Also her items are expensive, lets look at Hydra 3500 + tri force 3733 + DD 3500 = 10733 gold while

Renekton:

Black Cleaver 3000 + Steraks 3200 + Hydra 3500 = 9700 which is ideal for a cheap build while he can also 1 v 1 or 1 v 2 way Equal to or better than Fiora

Vladimir:

Rabbadons 3600 + Spellbinder 2900 = 6500 gold

(with that he can beat a Fiora in burst and sustained fight dmg)

I know there will be people who just think shes straight up broken in terms and end up down voting without giving a thought and that's fine. I tried to make this post as reasonable as can be. The moment someone sees "Fiora needs a buff" they think "That would make her broken" but I can't stop people from stating their opinions or views. Funny thing was we didn't post this to make a big overpowered buff happen, we did this to hope for something small like 2 seconds off the w early game, base stats, hp or resistances per level, or something of the sort to happen.

Fiora isn't the only champion that needs a buff, there are plenty others but regardless this was what I and a few others think about the state of Fiora in the moment.

Thank you for reading this post if you read the whole. and even if you skimmed this post thank you for your time even clicking on this post.

32 Comments

Grand Peperoni3/17/2019, 12:46:41 PM8 votes

Hi!

This post is not the first on the current state of Fiora, there's others on reddit and red tracker (which Riot doesn't respond to them, probably because some was written by jerks).

I played Fiora a lot of times, actually i play others champions because there are just better actually (actually 390k masteries points on gold elo, i consider myself to be an average player). When two years ago i've played Fiora 30-40% of my games, she represents now barely 2-3% of my games. I stopped to play her because like OP, i think she's on the weak side).

She didn't have change for a long time, her weakness probably comes from meta changes.

First: Shorter parties (a point that will probably never change because it was the will of Riot to make parties finish faster). Fiora is a late game champion who start to become really strong only at a really advanced stade of the game (with 2 items you start to becomes strong but you really need 3 items for begin to make a difference). Actually others late game champions comes online faster (exemples: Jax starting doing the job with trinity and boots, Irelia same, Kayle, two items and level 11 (or 16) are enough, For Nasus if you had 400 stacks at 15-20 minutes it's bingo!. Vayne makes the job perfectly with Botrk/Guinsoo/Boots).

Second: Nearly everything in toplane became more useful. There are better splitpushers like Jax. Tanks could win the match up against Fiora with Bramble vest (When Fiora normally is counter to them) until she got 2-3 items and provides a lot of utility for their teams. And on another side, we have few very popular bruisers with better laning phase who love more the new conqueror and/or spear of shojin and are strong for teamfighting and splitpushing.

Those are the two most important phenomenons which explain her weakness, but the question is still, should Fiora be buffed?

I think yes but not too much just for helping average players and focused on early-mid game not late. I think shorter parties will be permanent, Riot will never accept a return too longer games like before. So make Fiora powerspike earlier in the game could be a solution and have a more reliable early lane could be a solution.

Ideals buff could be:

-Increase HP and HP/lvl like the autor of the post suggest (550 -> 580 lvl1 85HP/lvl -> 90HP/lvl. 1995 -> 2110 HP lvl 18 ) Probably a consensual buff.

or

-Passive deals more damage early game. 2.5%(+4.5%) -> 3.5%(+4%). Give her a boost of damage on early lane without making her a lane bully and even with base damage increase and ratio cut a bit, Tank build still remaining suboptimal and AD build would still be better. You lost a bit of power on very late game but games are generally over before you're reaching this point (200 bonus AD, 3 full items). This kind of buff is probably not consensual at all but it could be more impactful than just HP increase.

or

-W CD down a bit to 22-14 (actually 24-16). A buff more for skilled players than average players but a buff is a buff.

Well this is my thoughts.

P.S: Sorry if you see many English faults, it's not my maternal language ;)

Azulian3/17/2019, 9:37:23 AM6 votes

You forgot to mention every patch her wr % drops :(

innubs3/17/2019, 11:38:06 PM5 votes

Rework fiora back to original state like when she first came out

Secretly a Phos3/17/2019, 5:29:23 PM4 votes

Fiora feels fine to play, it's more that she's been receiving multiple indirect nerfs such as the ER rework and her main rune getting nerfed thrice over a patch and a half.

Average Ahri3/17/2019, 10:39:30 PM4 votes

Well, first it depends on what rank you are. Fiora in high plat/d5 is pretty strong starting from lvl 3 and spike at 7. I was a fiora main once so i can guarantee if u play her right at lvl 3 u should first blood. Let me explain, fiora's passive has a pattern. If you are a serious about fiora here's some pointer. If it spawns right the other one has to be from the opposite. If its bottom it goes left. If its right it goes top. Although i havent played fiora in a while so take it with a grain of salt. Lvl 1 get q and then w. E at 3. If you couple it with wave control. Your set for 6. However in low gold/low plat. Wave control is pretty bad. So why i say she spike at 7? Well if im not mistaken, her q should have 3-4sec cd if hit thus if you hit ur q. Ur opponent cant escape.

Hex Trevelyan3/17/2019, 7:11:05 PM4 votes

All honesty most people can agree the old flora didnt really need a rework. Especially in this stage of league where a few other old champions like Xerath( his passive where his ap gives him armor) could literally fit right in this state pf league. Some champs would jusy require a visual update more then a whole rehash. But back on Flora. Your right she doesnt feel like a duelist. A duelist should be quick moving( far more then any other bruiser) and more precise then any other champion especially in 1v1 situations. I actually would prefer her as a 1v1er more then a 1v2 or more.

Small rant dont mind it I just wanted to out it here:

How are y'all gonna take away objectively the best looking ultimate out the entire league group and let Yi have his alpha strike I feel kinda offended as a old Fiora main. She didnt need that rework.

sinZsoul3/17/2019, 5:45:46 PM3 votes

So someone might have said this already, but right now it's an early game meta. Fiora is generally a late game champion. She maybe could use some buffs or her items could be buffed, but in general she should be weaker in an early game meta.

On a side note, Jax I think is overturned. If it was a late game meta, he would be overpowered easily and need nerfs.

Since league has so many champs and the meta can easily change from patch to patch, I don't think it's necessary to have every single champ balanced perfectly for every patch nor do I think it is possible.

Final point is that I blatantly disagree with a couple of your opening statements. Fiora's kit is what makes her feel like a duelist. Her ability to outplay with parry and the point about needing to hit vitals is what gives her this feeling. It doesn't matter if she's strong or weak in the meta for her to have this feeling.

MAY I LEAD3/17/2019, 5:13:09 PM3 votes

Honestly I think the Juggernaut update made it so Skirmisher top laners are just not viable. Tanks even outshine Juggernauts. So, Skirmisher as a whole are weak. Not just Fiora.

That said. I do agree. Fiora needs a buff. She's arguably the worst Skirmisher in the game right now. Which says something because Yasuo is in that class and has a 47% win rate, even with the doubled Crit chance passive and a Wind Wall that brakes on a semi regular basis. So, yeah. Fiora is not good right now.

The place where I disagree with you is I am not sure it needs to be a direct buff. I would actually prefer either buffing Tri-Force or making a new Bruiser item to help Skirmishers play against Tanks and Juggernauts.

MajorDanger3/19/2019, 12:29:11 AM2 votes
  1. Fiora is lategame scaler - if you give her too strong an early game it isn't fair
  2. Fiora can duel anyone in the game 1v1 if even or ahead - make sure your runes are correct and hit your Qs
  3. Fiora is buffed by the crit changes but no one realized it yet - try the new PD
DMcKlusk3/17/2019, 8:20:53 PM2 votes

Fiora is op

MartialArtsForY3/17/2019, 9:38:34 PM2 votes

She should honestly be reworked completely as her kit is very unhealthy for the game in general. Either she sucks or she is pick or ban

Alvinnater3/17/2019, 9:46:09 PM2 votes

I feel like her old play style before the rework was more effective especially when it came to team fights. Although she had no escapes she was able to take if not one at least a few champs in team fights with her before dying. Regardless the old one was pretty balanced out and way more effective.Fiora

Akmee3/17/2019, 10:29:15 PM2 votes

I have feel like her ultimate is very lack luster as they can simple just walk away after. Very different from her original ultimate days

1Holo3/17/2019, 10:31:31 PM2 votes

I agree on most of it. To be honest I feel like she is too good of a 1v1 champ. Sure it's what she was meant to do but after laning is over she doesnt have any real purpose afterward other than splitting and maybe guarding the adc. I feel like they should nerf her 1v1 potential and maybe make her more viable in team fighting. How would they do that, I'm not sure but it's how I feel they should work with her.

SkilledAsheBG173/18/2019, 12:10:41 PM2 votes

I think before the rework Fiora was a bit broken but so much better. I like her like this now but yes she needs a little buff or sth more when she's spell immune and if she counters skill she gets 25% of her mana back or the skill will go 1-2 seconds longer and if someone again is attacking her with skill it will continue the spell immune effect and skill will go longer so she will become cc tank and the longer it charges up the more dmg it does so if she gets hit by skill and she counters it it will charge up longer and because its easy to escape it would be to increase her range the longer she charges it, but it will be only possible if she counter skill with her W

LightWraith3/18/2019, 5:00:42 PM2 votes

Being a new player to her, and not fully heading her mechanics, I understand where this is coming from. I'm a Tryndamere (well, any spin to win, heh) main, and I agree with your point. She is very complicated, and one misuse of a skill means utter annihilation by any of the aforementioned champions [in your article]. I have easily 1v2 a Nunu and Kaylee, but it was when they're mid lane came up (I think a Zed?) And he just danced around me and knocked me out. Her kit is ok, but he was near fully built, without being too fed, and I only had a Rav, DD, and Sheen. I think I went with berseker boots, can't remember. Anyways, like you said, anyone else with a slight mobility advantage, it light cc even, just dominates Fiora :/

Devölution3/17/2019, 9:50:15 AM1 votes

Disagree,she is skirmisher not an actual bruiser.But I do agree that she is behind champs like Yasuo or Riven right now,but its more that this champs are kinda of strong or op.She outduels Irelia for sure,she 50/50 Jax,dont know about Riven,because Riven is broken af right now,she 50/50 Yorick.

She really doesnt need any changes,its not her meta.

Also grand duelist is Ryze,watch any pro game Kappa

Bløød Zerø3/18/2019, 2:37:50 AM1 votes

Okay don't compare AP and AD costs. Its harder to itemize as any AP champ as their build are rather limited and actually costly. Sure at that point Vlad can beat her but even so the build path he goes isn't that and if you are a smart Vlad will never be that unless fed or against a bad fiora.

Not to mention Vlad is basically immobile and can only bully you so all you do is let him shove and freeze near turret and ask for camp. Even with his w if the jungler abuses that window of CD which is absurdly long at that stage even he will inevitably falter. And he can't deal with a fiora who is ahead of him.

Turtle8283/18/2019, 2:02:05 AM

This comment doesn’t matter very much because of my elo (bronze omegalul) but I think Fiora is in a fine spot. Her true damage is just incredible, and she doesn’t do poorly in laning phase. She feels like a great duelist to me. I understand that currently League is in an early game meta but I still usually get to atleast level 14 before the game ends.