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Dont fix something thats not broken

DeBigMoist·12/21/2015, 1:56:13 AM·65 votes·3,964 views

Champion.gg - Kog'Maw ADC Stats, Builds, Runes, Masteries and Counters

Why fix something thats not broken. I have no idea. Kog was the healthiest hypercarry in the game. He was trash early and his winrate got higher as the game got longer. Thats what a hypercarry is supposed to do. Kog was not a carry early.

If you were good you could get fed and carry but thats every champion. Now kog maw is broken. Not broken op broken as in fucked up. Kog kept a 50% wr in normal winrates and spiked at 52% in the tank meta. As it should for a tank shredder with peel. Now Kog is no longer a "hypercarry" He falls of late game the statics show it.

I dont need to argue with anyone about that. Kog maw is best around 30 min because he completed his hybrid items and people dont have both armor and mr. but kogs winrate falls of as the game gets longer because he gains no more damage after rage blade hurricane and whatever trash he is building. This is no hypercarry this is ezreal without mobilty and with a less powerful mid game.

Kog lost his ability to kite which was not that bad with his e q sheen procs and phage. He lost his abilty to carry games late game. He lost his solo q power for those who mained him. And he lost a good build path. Tri into prob what was bork might be rage blade this patch was smooth. tri pats were cheap good and smooth and bork was also nice. Now you get rage blade hurricane boots And not even professor milk knows.

I want to ask you riot do we want another cass rework lying around nobody does. Revert the changes or fix him i know nobody from riot will respond to this but at least i tried.

tldr Kog lost damage lost kiting falls of late game. LOST HIS DAMAGE AND LATE GAME POWER

thank u for reading this

-A sad kog maw main.

38 Comments

zecastar12/21/2015, 5:46:58 AM17 votes

I want my poke Kog'Maw back. Having his ult. be so weak until they're below 50% HP contradicts the whole idea of using it for poke! What if they did this to ADCs that are supposed to shred tanks? Vayne W now does 2% unless they're at under 50% where it now does 15%. My guess is Mundo will almost never even get to 50% vs such a Vayne lol.

I don't even care about his new W. It seems pretty boring in concept... right click and press W to root yourself and auto-attack fast... so cool and skillful. It's not even better than before. You hit like a wet noodle.

ofart12/21/2015, 5:41:40 AM14 votes

I agree so much! He was fun to play and had diverse build paths with many viable styles both as mid or ADC. He had his niche in both roles and wasn't overly dominant. The weaknesses and strengths were both well-defined.

People who wanted to play Kog were generally happy with his kit. No one was demanding changes and this rework is a one-dimensional farce lacking both creativity and power. The marvelous build and stylistic flexibility has been replaced by a stale W focused build. The funny thing is that on-hit Kog was perfectly doable even before the changes with something like BoRK-Wit's End-Sorcs-Runaan's-Shiv-GA. It seems a common theme in Rito's reworks is pigeonholing a champion into one ability (Cassiopeia's E anyone?) instead of allowing us to play intelligently and whatever style suits our temperament or the game.

There's a lot more in these threads and I am really hoping Riot will tell us what their plan is: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/txlGL51M-so-meddler-said-koggy-is-the-sustained-damage-centerpiece-adc http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/yAOq9HeA-lets-congratulate-the-new-adc-with-the-lowest-winrate-and-a-way-forward

Rebonack12/21/2015, 2:59:45 AM9 votes

Reindeer KogMaw Sad singing

I seem to be in the minority of Kog players who likes the remake, but I feel like Riot didn't go far enough with it. Riot drastically underestimated how much of a weakness effectively rooting yourself for six seconds is. Riot also half-assed the remake without giving Koggy a new Innate and tying his whole kit together. The remake can be salvaged, but it needs work.

Xietnin12/21/2015, 10:45:00 AM8 votes

Cassiopeia KogMaw Sona Mordekaiser They're just not the same as they used to be.

LaughingStapler12/21/2015, 5:51:11 AM5 votes

Yeah, it would be nice if Riot asked for feedback and whether we want a rework instead of randomly shoving it down our throats. It's just change for the sake of change... keeping that hamster wheel spinning. There were so many better ideas for reworking Kog if they really wanted to do it. The new kit actually removes skillful elements and gives less opportunity to demonstrate mastery. It's not even just that he's much weaker.

Count Zubat12/21/2015, 3:20:42 PM4 votes

Before I say anything, I must tell that I never, ever played Kog'Maw. But, I once considered starting playing him. Why? 1. Build path diversity: I loved how Kog'Maw was able to be both mid lane poke mage and bot lane AD hypercarry. That's a great deal, you've got 2 different playstyles packed into one champion for 4800 IP, for me, it seemed awesome. 2. I wanted to start playing adc and I thought: "why not try Kog". Finally I didn't buy him because of his visuals: I'm not saying they're bad, no, Kog has very solid visual design. It's more that I wasn't keen on vomiting on everything xD But, to the topic. I also hate this Kog'Maw rework for a lot of reasons:

It killed Koggie's build diversity. Let's be serious, AP poke Kog is right now dead. He was in good state pre-rework, but now he is useless because of completely unnecessary ult change that (probably) nobody ever asked for.
The overall concept of Kog as adc. I may be wrong, but I always saw Kog as the sheen procing % damage shredder, who built TriForce and BotrK as his 2 core items. He was immobile, but had some means of kiting, like Phage from Trinity, his E etc. Right now, he is that on-hit completely immobile gattling gun. Stand in place and fire. If you move, you loose a lot of potential DPS. So, how do I outplay my enemies if I can't even move my ass to reposition, unless I want to sacrifice shit tons of my DPS? Which brings me to 3rd reason why I hate this rework.
Protecting Kog'Maw. Let's be honest: as an adc with least CC and mobility, Koggie needed some protection and a quite good communication between team mates. That's why his win rate in SoloQ wasn't very impressive, but he was really good in 5v5 and competitive. In soloQ, especially lower elo, where there is no communication, it's harder to play champ like Kog'Maw. But, in teams and competitive, he was reliable and effective, because there is a voice communication in such teams. It's much easier for Kog'Maw and his team mates to properly position when they can communicate with voice. But even then, Kog was able to reposition himself in certain situations and kite. But right now? He HAS to stand still. If he moves. he is nearly useless. Which means that, in order for Kog'Maw to deal as much damage as possible, he has to stand still and be protected. The team comps with Kog have to be even more centered around protecting him then ever. And any good play from some burst mage, assassin, initiator etc can completely screw Kog's team. He is even more team reliant then before and because he lacks any reasonable means of protection, he is completely unreliable.

That is why I don't like this rework. It effectively turned me away from ever trying out Kog'Maw. Good job Riot.

Tanadris12/21/2015, 6:37:11 AM3 votes

Kog needs to be able to move without losing his auto attack. Like 50% speed or something like a person with a gatling gun running. Think Heavy from TF2.

Tyaldan12/21/2015, 5:44:51 PM2 votes

Idk what most of the people are talking about in this thread. Kogmaw is insanely strong now, but its not his q or his e or his r that makes him so. Its his w. If you hit full 5 attacks a second, which is quite doable, you have decent sustain, INSANE damage, and some amazing kill potential. One of my more recent games started with me killing a zed mid lane at level 1 with kog, getting a dagger, and then going to my top lane and killing riven a couple times in lane. People underestimate kog and if they close in on you and THEN you pop your w there is no running before they are dead depending on how close to full build you are and how much mobility / mr they have. My typical build for kog goes nashors bork beserker greaves wits end (interchangeable with devourer for when you are jg kog) and guinsoos. That hits you at 5 attacks a second once guinsoos is stacked up, with 0 attack speed runes, and leaves you one extra item, which i usually make gunblade for even more insane sustain. Level q then w then e for the added attack speed. I usually start picking up kills around nashors being done which helps snowball the build. Run the stacking extra attack for a flat 80 extra damage on top, and low ad / mr doesnt matter. I also run my ap page because they removed the ad scaling from w, which was a buff to ap kog a bit.

To be fair though, i never picked up kogmaw till AFTER his rework. I have no clue how he played before. I agree that r isnt really a poke mechanic, but i also say he doesnt really need a poke mechanic. His whole thing is to sit down and kill anyone that gets close for 6 seconds, then run till he can do it again in 5 more seconds. If i throw an r right as i get into combat with someone it usually lands when they are half health, and if i throw a second one sometimes they are dead before it lands. Especially if you can land your q on them before using your w, to shred their resistances. He is one of my favorite champions right now, as long as there is ANYONE AT ALL on your team who can peel for you. He is weak to cc, extremely so, which is a good trade off for his literally insane damage. I hope he DOESNT get any major buffs as they might end up majorly nerfing him in return because he would become too good at that point.

Pierce The Veal12/21/2015, 11:33:35 AM2 votes

{quoted}

Why fix something thats not broken. I have no idea. Kog was the healthiest hypercarry in the game. He was trash early and his winrate got higher as the game got longer. Thats what a hypercarry is supposed to do. Kog was not a carry early.

If you were good you could get fed and carry but thats every champion. Now kog maw is broken. Not broken op broken as in fucked up. Kog kept a 50% wr in normal winrates and spiked at 52% in the tank meta. As it should for a tank shredder with peel. Now Kog is no longer a "hypercarry" He falls of late game the statics show it.

I dont need to argue with anyone about that. Kog maw is best around 30 min because he completed his hybrid items and people dont have both armor and mr. but kogs winrate falls of as the game gets longer because he gains no more damage after rage blade hurricane and whatever trash he is building. This is no hypercarry this is ezreal without mobilty and with a less powerful mid game.

Kog lost his ability to kite which was not that bad with his e q sheen procs and phage. He lost his abilty to carry games late game. He lost his solo q power for those who mained him. And he lost a good build path. Tri into prob what was bork might be rage blade this patch was smooth. tri pats were cheap good and smooth and bork was also nice. Now you get rage blade hurricane boots And not even professor milk knows.

I want to ask you riot do we want another cass rework lying around nobody does. Revert the changes or fix him i know nobody from riot will respond to this but at least i tried.

tldr Kog lost damage lost kiting falls of late game. LOST HIS DAMAGE AND LATE GAME POWER

thank u for reading this

-A sad kog maw main.

Hey wth are you talking about!

If you have above 600 actions per minute Kog should be easy to play and become god tier.

If you don't then obviously you need to git gud.

Sincerely, Riot

LoL Ergo Urgot12/21/2015, 6:06:24 AM2 votes

I like seeing the insane attack speed on the battle cast skin. Makes me feel like I am firing some serious artillery. Though, I only play in solo que (around gold), so my games are even more hell than before.

SpongebobIsLife12/22/2015, 3:05:57 AM1 votes

Yeah...I think Riot really failed hard this pre-season.

Only Play Darius12/21/2015, 7:13:57 AM1 votes

I like that he is more dependent on finding a good position and sticking with it instead of kiting. If they would just remove the stupid 50% damage reduction he would be completely fine

Full Brain12/21/2015, 7:45:39 AM1 votes

You should probably build item 3072 instead of item 3153 and a item 3089 after item 3115 item 3124 item 3085 for late game viability. I don't really like what they have done to him either they put him in a very tiny box.

Call A Dr12/21/2015, 12:12:01 PM1 votes

Rito have been picking on the weaker champs for some reason, and buffing the alrdy op champs, like who nerfs Malz? who nerfs Swain? XDDDDD

RITO BE LIKE $_$

Borbland12/21/2015, 5:41:52 PM1 votes

He's balanced. It's just the shitty 15 minutes meta that makes him unviable.

MargaretThatcher12/21/2015, 7:23:33 PM1 votes

Kog is balanced now. He just changed as the post says but he remains the same late monster if played well. Try to play him with some friends and teamspeak/skype and a bit of comps with brain. He changed, like ahri did, but he still the same: a living inmobile artillery that destroys all your team if he isnt focused. For sure he is going to be focused, that's why you want teammates. Kog lost a lot of potential in solo Q, but he is a freaking monster in team games if played properly. "but kog lost damage because he needs to kite" if they are able to get on the range that you need to kite them, you will be probably dead anyways,stand in your place, fire your Q, ask for some help and destroy everything that goes in your range. Kog has been my second main since a lot of time, and since i only play league with friends right now he is very fun to play, he is on his way to be the main champ. He is balanced, he isnt in the meta and since he is "new" with the rework a lot of people played and builded him very bad, making his winrate drop. item 3124 item 3006 item 3085 item 3153 item 3087 build changed, AD koggy playstyle not.