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My Thoughts On Smite Buffs And Why Riot Is Removing Them

Mister Fishey·10/30/2016, 4:43:30 PM·59 votes·5,920 views

(DISCLAIMER: I am not a game designer and I am also incredibly stupid, so take everything I say with a grain of salt. Or a pound of salt. Or a bag.)

Greetings!

Today I'm giving my thoughts on why I think Riot is removing Smite buffs and also why I agree with their decision to do so. I don't expect everyone to agree with me, frankly I'd be surprised if any of you agree with me, but, since there's been a lot of negativity directed towards the upcoming Jungle changes, I figured I'd balance things out a bit and provide a more positive perspective on the whole scenario.

Now, based off my experience, Riot has about 3 overarching goals when working on the Jungle:

  1. Make jungling more fun for Junglers.
  2. Give Junglers more strategic options.
  3. Increase Champion Diversity in the Jungle.

Making the Jungle more fun is pretty important, because fighting unchanging monsters in the jungle, in the exact same way, over and over, can get really boring, really fast.

Giving Junglers more strategic options is important because, not only does it make jungling more fun, but it also adds depth to the gameplay, which is valuable, 'cause the more depth there is in the game, the more opportunity there is for players to show off their skill.

And increasing Champion Diversity is always a core goal in every role. When you're forced to pick from a pool of only a few champions because those champs are the best right now, that isn't fun, as that takes away choice from the player. This is even more painful when you hate playing whoever is Meta right now, but if you want to have the highest chance at winning you have to pick them anyway. Having to play the exact same champions over and over again, whether you want to or not, is a legitimate threat to how fun the game can be, especially in the Jungle, where the gameplay is already at significant risk of being repetitive and dull.

The influence of these goals is evident in every change Riot has ever made to the Jungle. For example, they added different types of Smite and the ability to Smite enemy champions, which is incredibly fun. It also added strategic depth, as you had to pick which Smite you wanted while also deciding what to use it on. And in order to increase Champion Diversity they added a Blasting Smite that dealt AoE damage to camps while restoring Health and Mana. The idea was that if weaker Junglers had an easier time clearing, then maybe they could compete with the other S Tier Junglers. While a good idea on paper, Blasting Smite ended up being just as good on the best Junglers as it was on the weaker Junglers, and when everyone on the Tier List gets an equal boost in power, the worst stay the worst while the best stay the best, and that meant the Champion Diversity was mostly unaffected. Making the best better wasn't the point of Blasting Smite, so they retired it, but while their third goal was not achieved, the different Smites did achieve their first and second goals, and that's why they are still in the game.

Which leads me to Smite buffs. It is in my opinion that the reason these are being retired is because they failed to realize the majority of Riot's goals. Let's cover the list.

Goal 1: Make jungling more fun for Junglers.

What counts as fun is obviously subjective, but, honestly, I really don't think the majority of Smite Buffs are all that fun. The Wolf Spirit is neat, and properly utilizing Krugs to clear camps can be satisfying, but that's really it. The rest of the Buffs are either boring and useless, like Smiting Blue, or boring and strong, like Smiting Raptors. Oh wow, now I can clear wards. What enthralling gameplay. -_- But seriously, even if you enjoy the Smite Buffs, they are definitely not as fun as Smiting Enemy champions. Regardless of which is more tactically advantageous, Smiting Champion is always far more interactive and engaging than Smiting Jungle creeps. Or at least that's how I see it. Again, whether this goal was achieved is entirely subjective, so you guys have to decide for yourselves whether it was a success. Did you find that Smite Buffs enriched your games? Feel free to let me know. Thankfully, the other Goals are far more objective, and as such easier to analyze.

Goal 2: Give Junglers more strategic options.

Y'all might find this surprising, but this is where I am 100% certain that Smite Buffs failed. Why? Because, Junglers have two primary objectives: Gank Lanes and secure Epic Monsters. And the only Smite Buff that significantly helps Junglers do either of those is Raptor Buff. The rest are useless at worst, and mediocre at best. Don't believe me? Well then lets go through the list.

Gromp: Provides mini-Thornmail effect, scaling with Bonus Health.

  1. Ganks: Useless. The amount of things that must go perfectly for this to do anything at all in a Gank is ridiculous. You have to be stacking Health, you have to be Ganking a Lane that has an Auto Attack oriented enemy Champion, and said enemy has to choose to Auto you instead of running away or attacking a different Champion, all just to get any use out of this Buff whatsoever. And, since the Buff relies on Bonus Health to do damage, a stat you have very little of during the time when you're going to be Ganking, even if you do get the perfect scenario in a Gank where this Buff comes into play, the damage you're going to be getting out of it is absolutely minuscule. You're better off saving your Smite to use on the Champion you're Ganking.

  2. Epic Monsters: Dragon only uses spells, Baron uses a mix of spells and Auto Attacks, and Rift Herald just uses Auto Attacks. This means that the Gromp Buff only works half of the time. Note I said "works", not "is useful". Due to how the Rift Herald has to be taken before 20 minutes, you are unlikely to have much Bonus Health, and as such the Buff just does not contribute anything significant to clearing it. And while you should have more Bonus Health by the time you go for Baron, considering Baron only uses Autos half the time, and the fact that it is more likely to switch targets since your whole team is there, Gromp Buff's usefulness is drastically reduced. And something that I cannot emphasize enough, is that in all of these scenarios where the Gromp Buff works, it only does so IF the user is a tank. On anyone else it is useless. So in short, this is a Buff that only works on specific Champions against specific enemy Champions in specific scenarios at specific times, and even when it works, the advantage it provides is mediocre at best. This Buff adds absolutely nothing to this game at all.

Blue Buff: Gives Mana. Whoopty freaking doo. Everyone knows Smiting Blue is worthless. I don't even need to split this into two sections to explain how bad it is. Any good Jungler gets sufficient Mana sustain from their Jungle item, and if they don't they get Hunter's Potion. While you could imagine someone Smiting Red for some sort of outplay, the idea of someone Smiting Blue, specifically to get Mana for an outplay, seems so incredibly rare and unlikely that if Riot were to tell me that no such outplay had ever happened, I would believe them. Smiting Blue is useless. Moving on.

Wolves: Gives vision in the quadrant of the Jungle it was Smited in via an enemy-tracking Wolf Spirit.

  1. Ganks: Only works in the Jungle, ergo, is useless in Ganks.

  2. Epic Monsters: The only way this could possible affect the taking of Epic Monsters is if you use it to spot the enemy coming towards you while you're taking said monsters. The problem with this is that it is visible to the enemy, meaning that it may alert the enemy to the possibility that you're taking an Epic Monster. Plus, while the tracking provided by Wolf Spirit is theoretically valuable, it also makes the vision it provides unreliable. The Wolf is indiscriminate in who it chases, meaning that the vision it provides may get wasted on someone inconsequential, like the Support, while allowing the enemy Jungler to move towards you unseen for the potential steal on the Epic Monster. As a whole, this Smite Buff is basically just a less subtle and less reliable version of a ward, and when the advantage a Smite Buff provides is less valuable than something I can get for free on my Trinket, you know it's pretty bad.

Raptors: Gives a better version of a Sweeping Lens.

  1. Ganks: This is incredibly powerful in Ganks. First off it gives Junglers the ability to deny vision, which is a tool that has been incredibly powerful and important for Junglers to have since the inception of League. And secondly, this Buff also allows you to know if you've been spotted, and having the knowledge that an enemy Laner is unaware of your presence can have a massive impact on whether your Gank will succeed or not.

  2. Epic Monsters: This is also fantastic for taking Epic Monsters. Having the ability to clear vision and take control of the area around a major objective is always incredibly valuable. And since Raptor Buff lets you know if you've been spotted, this opens the door to letting you potentially sneak an Epic Monster, which can singlehandedly win you the game.

Red Buff: Heals you. I don't really have anything to say about this buff, since it's the only Smite Buff that's survivng into the next Season. So yeah. NEXT!

Krugs: Occasionally stuns monsters, consumes Buff for True Damage proc on Towers.

  1. Ganks: Useless. Has no impact on whether your Gank will succeed.

  2. Epic Monsters: Useless. Does not affect Epic Monsters.

You beginning to see what I mean? Riot has been saying that their reason for retiring Smite Buffs is because these Buffs ended up just being a puzzle to be solved, in that they provide several wrong choices and one legitimate choice, which was not what they were supposed to do. These Buffs were intended to provide a range of equally viable strategic options for Junglers to choose from, and at first glance they appear to do so, but upon closer inspection, as I have shown, this is far from the case. Raptors provide a significant and reliable advantage to Junglers that can be game-changing, whereas the rest of the Smite Buffs range from completely useless to situationally mediocre. To put it another way, Smite Buffs add complexity instead of adding depth. Depth is achieved when players are provided with legitimate and meaningful ways to impact their game in a way that highlights their skill as a player. Complexity is achieved when systems are added to the game that provide little to no benefit, even when you utilize them properly, and instead just make the game more muddled and difficult to learn. When the majority of Smite Buffs give little to no benefit, they end up just making the game more cluttered, forcing players to dig through worthless mechanics in order to find the legitimate ones. In short, Smite Buffs absolutely fail to add any meaningful choices to the game, which means that Riot's second goal was certainly not achieved.

Goal 3: Increase Champion Diversity in the Jungle.

Similarly to the Blasting Smite before it, the majority of Smite Buffs were intended to help weaker Junglers clear. Krugs, Red, and Gromp all directly help you survive the Jungle, and Wolf warns you if you're getting invaded by a stronger enemy Jungler. The problem is that, like Blasting Smite, these Buffs ended up helping the best Junglers as much as the worst Junglers. In fact, you could make a legitimate argument that Smite Buffs help top tier Junglers more than weaker ones on account of the fact that the best Junglers, who don't need help clearing, can save their Smite for Raptors or Ganking, and proceed to have an impact on the map, whereas weaker Junglers have to waste their Smite on inferior Buffs just to survive the Jungle. This discrepancy heavily discourages the picking of weaker Junglers, and, unfortunately, this may have actually hampered Champion Diversity more than it helped it, which is literally the opposite of what Riot was hoping to achieve.

While whether Smite Buffs are fun or not is a matter of opinion, with regards to the other two goals, Smite Buffs didn't just fail, they failed miserably. Instead of adding strategic depth, they added pointless complexity. Instead of improving Champion Diverstity, they worsened it. Improving the Jungle is arguably the most difficult task on Riot's plate, and by having useless and complicated systems littering the Jungle, it just becomes more difficult for Riot to improve it. As such, I agree wholeheartedly with the removal of Smite Buffs.

As for the new systems that are replacing Smite Buffs, only time will tell if they are a success. At first glance I think they have a lot of potential, but I won't bother judging them until they are on Live, as judging incomplete features before I've gotten to try them myself is silly and pointless. (HINT HINT)

And those are my thoughts on Smite Buffs. If you actually bothered to read this whole post, THANK YOU! You da best! [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

67 Comments

Baron of Bread10/30/2016, 6:12:56 PM9 votes

While I primarily agree, you do put less value on the Gromp and Krug buffs than I think they deserve. After lane phase and when you aren't planning to take an epic monster soon, Gromp and Krugs can be legitimate picks. If you are planning to tank it up in a teamfight, Gromp will help get that enemy carry down in health. If you plan to split push then Krugs can be helpful, that extra chunk of damage can be the difference between a tower going down or not.

Yet, as I said, I still primarily agree with you. Only a few champions really used Gromp or Krugs and even then it was only some of the time.

Marshbouy10/30/2016, 5:08:51 PM8 votes

Thank you. I wanted to make this post but i did not have the experience, the brains, or the mental endurance to write this.

ChaddyFantome10/30/2016, 5:45:20 PM6 votes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01ZNEvcaGRY

Well fucking said. Couldn't have put it better myself even if i tried. Upvoting so more people can be enlightened.

Around999People10/30/2016, 8:48:35 PM5 votes

TBH I loved the krugs smite. That stun made me love to jg again. Now that it'll be gone again I probs won't jg again. That stun made my clears workable early game so I can gank at lvl 3 and not be at 10% hp.

I also used the blue buff smite, when playing a mana hungry champ like Yi the smite lets me heal before finishing blue. It helps me get that last set of Q's as Xin.

I power clear, doing all my camps before I B for items, and without the krugs the pool of champions I could have chosen goes down to like 1 or 2 instead of the half dozen or so I used to be ok with.

ProfDrDeath10/30/2016, 8:35:51 PM5 votes

Well said.

One point for you, though: The jungler is not just there for the ganks and epic monsters. Rather, ganking is an important part of providing map pressure, by being an unknown force on the map, something that has to be in the back of the mind of all enemy players: Where is the jungler now? What does he do? Could I get the kill/get out if he would be here right now?

This is obviously more important in higher tiers and especially in organized play - in unorganized play, the two aspects you mention are much more important and prevalent.

This is also what makes Wolf Smite so good - since it automatically tracks whoever is entering that part of the jungle, it gives away the position of the enemy jungler and allows players to answer the questions above. More specifically, it makes the third question irrelevant, since you know the exact position of the enemy jungler right now and also where he is not for the next 15-30 seconds.

OHminus10/31/2016, 12:56:28 AM3 votes

The entire point of junglers is to gank lanes and take epic monsters?

Triggered.

Jungle Lux God10/31/2016, 3:38:05 AM3 votes

I really like how this post was well-though out, and had to upvote it on that alone. I also like its content, and had to support it by adding to the conversation it started.

I feel like your grasp of the smite buffs' strategic usefulness might be a bit misleading. A jungler's primary focuses are to gank lanes and secure objectives, but that wasn't all they had to do. They could choose to counterjungle (in which smiting the enemy wolf camp was extremely powerful) or you could just farm the jungle (in which Gromp and Krugs were decent, although not very interesting). In addition, taking Gromp into a teamfight was really good on tanks, and the Wolf smite's vision control was an extremely powerful vision control tool in the mid-late stages of the game.

I think your thoughts on smite buffs not increasing champion diversity in the jungle is perfectly reasonable, although there's one thing that you might have forgotten about (or possible not thought of at all considering how most people won't think about it), and that's the possibility that champions that don't have good synergy with the smite buffs but were almost usable in the jungle could have been rendered unviable due to their lack of synergy with said smite buffs. This mostly has to do with off-meta AP champions like Malzahar or Brand that didn't have particularly good synergy with the smite buffs but could almost jungle well, and doesn't really apply to most meta junglers (although you could make the argument for Rammus).

LankPants10/31/2016, 1:10:49 AM3 votes
  1. Make jungling more fun for Junglers.
  1. Give Junglers more strategic options.
  2. Increase Champion Diversity in the Jungle.

Their changes fail abysmally at these goals, I don't believe these are Riots goals because the changes Riot has put out do the exact opposite.

Riot are slashing jungle diversity in the preseason. Farming as a jungle playstyle is utterly dead, you can't farm creeps with a 150 second respawn timer. That means tank junglers have no fallback and carry junglers have nothing. So playing a tank jungler is now a giant risk as if you ever fall even slightly behind you're fucked and carry junglers are now non-existent because they can't farm up in the early game. What does that leave you with then? Lee Sin, Elise, Nidalee and Rek'sai, basically the cancer of the jungle is staying the same while every other champ is losing reliability. This is the worst possible change for the jungle. That alone kills fun for many junglers and kills champion diversity.

Plants don't offer much in the way of actual strategy either. I've seen high elo players play on the PBE and what they do is destroy every plant they see regardless of whether it's useful to them. The reason for this is that plants have an attackers bias, if you're invading into the jungle the plants are more useful for you.

Hitting a vision plant to spot out an invader is really fucking hard, because you have to know the time on the invade already, which makes the vision plant questionably useful defensively. In contrast hitting it as an attacker always gives useful information, it either tells me where the enemy is or where they're not. In either case it's usable info.

Since the Blast Cones spawn into the jungle they're only useful for getting onto jungle, not away. This means that an invader can close the gap to you with one, but you can't really re-open it.

The logistics of where the healing plant spawn make it more accessible for a fleeing invader than someone chasing them, this one's just a common sense thing.

With all that in mind, what do you do with every plant you see in your jungle? You just destroy them, because the risk for leaving them up is way too high. You may occasionally be able to set up a gank with one, but even then, is that creating more choices than Raptor buff. I'd argue no.

CrazyBear198710/31/2016, 2:21:57 AM2 votes

Alot of good points and put in an informative non aggressive manner.

Well put summoner!

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Pus10/30/2016, 8:40:28 PM2 votes

  1. Jungling is already fun for junglers, it's the most healthiest jungle I've seen even as a jungle main even AFTER the red/blue timers, the addition of them being an actual mini objective adds more teamplay before the big dragon/baron fights.

  2. Jungle pathing in and of itself is all about jungle experience, knowledge and strategy. Removing the buffs on the epic monsters in return for a small heal is fine as long as they kept the red and blue buff intact, instead we get Pseudo-RNG plants which not only kills strategy but makes the jungle much more casual, which I guess would be okay for non jungle mains right?

  3. Jungle champion diversity is a bad thing and we've all seen that with season 3 and 4 jungle. Season 6 (post-bloodrazor) is probably the healthiest jungle I've seen so far in this game and making it easier for more champions to jungle (ie like in S3 and S4) is just counter-productive.

What I personally think they should change for the current jungle (not pbe) are to make skarners jungle relics a permanent addition to the game that can only be captured by champions with smite AND a completed Tier 2 or Tier 3 jungle item. This makes it so early game invades still stay intact while also giving the jungler a way to have some sort of offensive/defensive answer like laners do with turrets once they start investing into the jungle items.

VivaLaKitten10/31/2016, 1:54:30 AM2 votes

are they taking away the red buff giving you health or not? >.>

AMYS GRAVE10/31/2016, 2:45:47 AM2 votes

Y'all might find this surprising, but this is where I am 100% certain that Smite Buffs failed. Why? Because, Junglers have two primary objectives: Gank Lanes and secure Epic Monsters.

In order to effectively gank and secure drag/baron they have to farm, and the krug and gromp buffs help them clear the jungle and stay strong enough to do so. Also the wolves smite is really strong to counter jungle and prevent counter jungling. Tracking the enemy jungler prevents them from being able to effectively gank and that is useful in its own way. Every smite buff has its uses in different phases of the game and understanding what smites to put when is the strategic aspect that they wanted in the first place.

The smite problem has been solved, but so has basically everything else in the game. Replacing smites with plants doesn't change the fact that the problem will be solved again, and they are changing up the jungle yet again just to realize that they've replaced one problem which is solved with another one which will be shortly after it goes live.

The Deckowner10/31/2016, 3:25:47 AM2 votes

What counts as fun is obviously subjective, but, honestly, I really don't think the majority of Smite Buffs are all that fun. The Wolf Spirit is neat, and properly utilizing Krugs to clear camps can be satisfying, but that's really it. The rest of the Buffs are either boring and useless, like Smiting Blue, or boring and strong, like Smiting Raptors. Oh wow, now I can clear wards. What enthralling gameplay. -_- But seriously, even if you enjoy the Smite Buffs, they are definitely not as fun as Smiting Enemy champions. Regardless of which is more tactically advantageous, Smiting Champion is always far more interactive and engaging than Smiting Jungle creeps. Or at least that's how I see it. Again, whether this goal was achieved is entirely subjective, so you guys have to decide for yourselves whether it was a success. Did you find that Smite Buffs enriched your games? Feel free to let me know. Thankfully, the other Goals are far more objective, and as such easier to analyze.

So are you suggesting that the new jungle camp changes makes the jungle fun??????

WOW I just had to not clear my raptors because I am XinZhao with no aoe damage! Also doing Krug takes forever and it loses me tons of momentum! Oh right we got these gimmicky blue plants that just randomly spawns and tells the enemy where I am because RNG is great! WOW SO FUN!!!!!

Goal 3: Increase Champion Diversity in the Jungle.

The removal of smite buff and changes to jungle camps as well as the introduction of the plants WILL NOT help increase the champion diversity in the jungle. Champions with AOE & SINGLE TARGET damageNidalee will ALWAYS be superior to those with weak AOEAmumu or only SingleTargetWarwick in terms of clearing and farming, For example, making raptor super broken against single target damage champions will only make Warwick XinZhao Shen Trundle 's clear hell and not affect Nidalee Graves Hecarim at all.

PixTron10/31/2016, 3:47:46 AM2 votes

One thing that I thought would be a nice touch: Riot adds MORE than the average amount of monsters. Similar to rotating dragons, there's different types of monsters (wraiths can be in place of raptors, baby dragons can replace krugs and other unique monsters) I'm still trying to figure out how this shouldn't end up as just more RNG but more of a fun and unique way of fighting more monsters, though. But I think taking the DOTA 2 route would make things much more interesting!

Dukues10/31/2016, 3:01:13 PM2 votes

Thanks for posting this. Originally I was sad when I heard about the jungle changes. Still not sure how I feel about plants but I am happy they going back to smite healing you instead of all the other buffs you got from different camps. It feels really sad not playing xxx jungle because first clear take so long or you get so low you have to back right away. Or if starting red side on xxx champ feels bad because you really need to smite red around level 3 to full clear or have enough health to gank.

Large Minivan10/31/2016, 5:06:30 PM2 votes

at first I thought the removal of smite buffs were bad and the plants were bad but you changed my mind good sir!

dunkeroni10/31/2016, 5:23:29 PM2 votes

I agree with most of this, except one thing:

Without smiting blue buff, Ivern has to back before he goes to the second half of the jungle. He just doesn't have enough mana otherwise.

The Yetii Rider10/30/2016, 5:56:27 PM1 votes

"I'm not a game designer"

Starts the thread with a Ben Brode "Greetings!"

Hmmmm....

Lord Desert10/31/2016, 8:45:34 PM1 votes

Ok while you only view about half of all points in the jungle, lets put that aside for a second, how on earth are these plants having a positv effect on all of these "goals"?! And yes the removal of smitebuffs goes hand in hand with the plants... The smite buffs may need some tweaks to be better, but those changes do NOT improve anything... You need to look ahead and not just behind.. but alot of people get that wrong so i dont blame you

"fun" The bombplant does not increase "fun", just because you can jump over some walls to be faster at a camp, and those plants will be cleared before drakes/barons will be startet in about 99% of all cases. And the plants do not interact with your jungle clear at all! Meanwhile they can be used to better/safer counterjungle, get bullies a mana/hp sustain and free vision of your position + clearing all of your wards. Yes technicly the "stronger" junglers/laners will have a bit more fun, because snowballing and opressing the enemy is easier with those plants, but the weaker ones can get totaly rect... So i dont think those plants or the removal of smite buffs increases fun, rather the excactly oppisite :/

"Stratigic Decision" will be LOWERED to:

  1. smite enemy champion
  2. smite for a tiny bit of hp(its only usefull in the early game, mid to late its the same as the krugs buff) and
  3. Epics. If you take the warding smite item you are down to 2!...

While you had:

  1. Krugs(for early AA junglers, later close to useless, but could be used for Scuttle or a bit faster tower push)
  2. Gromp(lategame for tanks, early for slow clearspeed),
  3. lets combine red and blue smite buff here beeing ~same level like the new smite buff,
  4. Wolfs, usefull vs counterjunglers and to detect possible wards/traps
  5. Raptors, a better version of the swepper, because it only activates when a ward is detected
  6. vs Champs
  7. Epics Sooo "more" stratigic options? I dont think so.

"Diversity" technicly yes, making every smite a heal, makes some picks better, but it will not be super important, the stun from krugs, tick dmg from gromp are roundabout the same impact of a 10% max hp smite(which will have a longer cd btw) (IF you have 600Hp, the smite gives you 60... i would rather stun red or the big raptor and maybe cc chain them too, instead of this "60" hp back, and dont forget scuttle will get its resistance reduced if you dont have any cc and have krugs buff!!! But the "Gameplay" will not be any different, its just a smite with a 1 time only effect, so it might be even less then the current version.

So we can see that the smite changes are basicly terrible.

Plants may be "interesting" but they need some tweaks till they become a "stratigic decision", if youre interested in some ideas, i can give you some.

So what would be better? Changing the smite buffs! How?! Here:

  • smiting Krugs now reveals a monster, if they hit them with an AA/Ability for 2-3 seconds.
  • smiting Scuttle increases the duration of the zone by x1.5/x2
  • smiting Gromp slows attacker AS by 10% (works on monster too) possible red and blue smite changes: (remember only for the jungler to get)
  • smiting Red gives an extra buff for a short time (30s ish or for the full duration) (could be Attackspeed, movementspeed or even a bit of armor)
  • smiting Blue gives an extra buff too, again 30s or the full duration ( Cdr, movementspeed or a bit of MR)
  • smiting Raptors gets rid of the reveal of the VisionPlant
  • smiting Wolfs gives a bit more movementspeed for the jungler/team in the part where the wolf was smited and VERY IMPORTANT!!! the ghost gets changed to the Devour Wolf!

Or even completly change some buffs. This would make the jungle more interesting, even more stratigic decision making, and possibly a better diversity too. But in the end the "stratigic" decision will be reduced to: "Thats the best, in that certain situation" everytime, which is, unfortunly, close to impossilbe to avoid.

And lastly "judging" an incomplete features as a final product may be bad, but giving concerns, other balance options, new ideas is the best thing for a incomplete feature to make it COMPLETE and possible BETTER at its release. But to get those you need to think about every possible scenario, the best and the worst case should be view as the norm! Thats how you make balancing work.

Spoofghoul10/31/2016, 9:48:41 AM1 votes

i quite often pick smite as a laner

one of the reasons is the wide variety of buffs available to me when i take smite. smiting gromp when having to deal with harass & poke in lane. Taking mr krug down if i decide it's time to shove wave and push down a turret Smiting enemy wolves for vision, and easily taking down scuttlers for extra vision too, taking raptors for ward clearing And always having a smite ready for when anybody on team wants to go for a neutral objective

And let us not forget red/blue smite and the cheap jungle items

Stealing buffs in general from the enemy jungler is also really good especially raptors, but one of my personal favorites is smiting their red at the start of the game when they are playing a jungler who needs it to stay healthy on his first clear. they start fighting it get low on hp and then smite it only to realize it didn't heal them and now they got to back off and recall. This is so hard, they wasted their smite, and either a significant duration of redbuff, or they got to do it allover and this will cost them even more time. the unexpected oh shit i have to recall delays them so much also due to losing their available smite, it usually makes them a non factor for the entire lanefase because they end up being 2 levels behind everyone else for a big part of it and it becomes downright dangerous to gank someone if you aren't full health. meanwhile they will also be subject to being your junglers bitch. he can now invade with impunity

BushidoBlade11/1/2016, 9:55:21 PM1 votes

smite buffs were good, and this new jungle environment is useless. raptor smite and wolf smite were easily the best buffs since vision control wins games. now we have some consumable environment shit that helps immobile junglers get into dragon/baron pit, and junglers who need healing get some more hp. tbh the changes that riot is implementing is some gimmicky shit that is stupid af.