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[FEEDBACK] Thoughts on current state of ARAM (8.11, event)

Ricje·6/4/2018, 1:11:13 AM·14 votes·9,306 views

So I've been playing ARAM since season 2, have played well over 8000 games and have seen many changes over the years. The most recent changes however baffle me. You can agree/disagree with my feedback, that is fine but keep it constructive. Let's not turn this thread into a flamewar/rant.

Let's start off with a few of the new items;

Ghostwalkers I can honestly say that these things ruin the spirit of ARAM. Not only do they make high mobile melee champions an even bigger pain to deal with but they also allow these same champions to escape after taking out an enemy. There is little to no counterplay here. CC-heavy comps (Alistar, Malphite, Amumu) now have an even easier time engaging. They not only have Mark/Dash but with these boots they now have TWO ways to completely shut down a team. Furthermore, these new boots allow a team which is melee-heavy to simply backdoor once the other team has an open nexus. Again: This goes against the spirit of ARAM. Worst part of this: It's Melee only.

Suggestion: Either remove them, make them accessable for all champions, allow the other team to damage you and force you out of the wall (just like Kayn) to offer SOME form of counterplay or redesign Mark/Dash to be ranged-only.

Spectral Cutlass Basically an uncontrollable Ekko ult without the health-regain. Riot please tell me; Where is the counterplay in a Zed using Mark/Dash followed up by this, ulting on someone immediately upon arriving, getting a free kill and return safely to the other side of the map? What about in combination with Ghostwalkers? You'd need a team of CC to instantly shut down the person using this item.

Suggestion: Add an AP version (Leblanc, Ekko, Fizz, Katarina and Akali wants to join in on the fun) or remove it.

Bloodletter's Veil The weakest of the event items. The other 2 are actives while this one's a passive. Good luck utilizing that "1 block for 2 seconds every 30 seconds" when the other team is focusing down a higher priority target.

Suggestion: Turn it into an active, change it so that it doesn't activate unless you're taking damage, increase it's active time to 5 seconds or reduce the cooldown on it to 15 seconds.

Gameplay changes I feel that the map is slightly smaller now and the inhibitor turrets (including fountain laser) seem to have a slight increase to their attack range. For example: The Inhibitor turret now seems to shoot you the moment you exit the brush next to it (which it did not on Howling Abyss) and the fountain laser now has a larger range as well at the open sides of the fountain (I've experienced it first hand). These changes were completely unnecessary.

Suggestion: Revert them.

Relic changes Not sure how I feel about this. On one side I'm happy that they were changed because it'd allow teams to get back some health if they're on the receiving end of the match. On the other side I feel they need to be reverted as it gives too much survivability for a team that can harass the other team at a turret 24/7. Giving them AoE heals (and small portions of mana) to keep them healthy while they slowly chip down the other team and their turret.

Suggestion: Make them "team owned". The 2 relics close to the turrets on the blue side now "belong" to the blue team and those on the red side now "belong" to the red team. Keep them as AoE but reduce their effectiveness for each additional player past 2 that does not belong to the team that "owns" the relic.

Dark Harvest

Glad to see that you listened to feedback. I appreciate the reduction. I still think it's a little bit too strong (as I mentioned multiple times in the past you'd need to reduce it to 3 souls per champion and 2 souls per cannon/super or buff Electrocute (reduce cooldown and slightly increase damage) to bring these 2 in line with eachother) but it's getting on the right track. I sincerely hope you keep this reduction (and actually reduce it to 3/2) once the event is over.

Other changes I feel that 8.11 somewhat shifted the meta. While I can't comment yet on whether this is a good or bad thing (because of these stupid event items) I can say that this shift in meta seems to have crippled/gutted many champions (mainly ranged squishies without any hard CC or burst). Even with the removal of Warmogs some tanks are still quite potent at shutting down a team and due to the new items (mainly Ghostwalkers in this particular case) I feel that they're an even bigger issue.

Luckily you stated > These changes will help us test ways to make ARAM better, and help us to gauge how open the ARAM community is to changes to the mode. Although they’re temporary, the gameplay changes that are well-received may return to stay in a future patch.

Which is why I'm providing you with feedback. The new items can stay away from regular ARAM once the event ends. As a regular ARAM player (I don't play SR or TT) I feel that they bring nothing but imbalance and make some champions way too hard to deal with (Fizz jumping in, doing massive damage, using E to get to a wall, activating boots to escape without taking damage for example) as well as shutting down a lot of champions' capability (slow ranged champions have no where to escape to for example if they're boxed in from 2 sides).

Positive changes

Champion select! I can now facepalm faster than ever when I see players reroll and we end up with a 5 AP/AD team without bruisers/CC/initiation :D Jokes aside though, I've actually made use of the new "champion pool" functionality a few times already and I'm glad you added that AND increased the free rotation. We've been asking for something against the ARAM account players for many years now and while you still have much work to do against them (just make every champion part of the free pool I'd say) it's definitely a step in the right direction so.... Thanks!

>And speaking of rerolls, we’re slightly increasing the rate at which you earn them. If you have no champions unlocked, you’ll earn a reroll about once every 2 games, increasing based on the number of champions owned. If you own every champion, you’ll earn one reroll each game, up to a max of two.

I must admit that I completely missed this part at first and I was quite surprised to see that I was getting 1 reroll per game so before reading this I assumed this went for everyone. Again: Thanks! I appreciate the effort you're putting in encouraging players to "play fair" as well as rewarding players that own all champions who would otherwise be at a "disadvantage" due to their big champion pool.

26 Comments

Neamean6/4/2018, 8:23:21 AM8 votes

They should make ghostwalker only activable when out of combat so it can't be use to escape.

Salamencę6/4/2018, 1:36:40 AM7 votes

Been playing since s3, over 7500 ARAM games. The new changes are for the most part are all bad imo. The ghostwalkers are disgustingly broken, the new lethality item is super broken and has some RIDICULOUS interactions (You can use the active and snowball someone as skarner and then drag them back to your fountain). The new AP item is meh.

I personally quite like the relic changes, but I agree that they should be team specific.

The big thing though, the removal of warmogs, was just dumb. Melee champions get poked to shit in ARAM and unless you have hard engage, you lose. Warmogs made it so melee comps didn't have to go into every fight with < 50% hp. At the very least, they should add warmogs back but add a cap to the amount of hp it regens (maybe up to 60% of your max hp). Regardless of what happens, it needs to be added back.

The nerf of dark harvest has me a bit on the fence, though I do realize it was overpowered. It was just so fun one shotting with Jarvan and other assassins without a cooldown like electrocute lol.

As far as the map changes go, I can say for a fact that everything you pointed out is correct. I have experienced every example on your list multiple times and they definitely should be reverted.

Urgash6/4/2018, 10:30:45 AM4 votes

Also as an aram player from EUW with more than 9000 games played since the aram queue, because we used to do it on custom games before that. I play Aram almost exclusively, and i own 95 champions but still people say i'm one of those nasty aram accounts that cheats the game.

I feel all the champion select things are good, more free champions i have no problem with that, the "bench" i think it's a great addition, no need to ask "anyone xxx" and if people reroll our only ad champ i can pick it up to avoid the dreaded full ap comp.

The new items, i'm not fond of them especially the boots. When you roll Kayn you feel totally cheated by the way, everyone has your E and they're stealthed in addition to that. The Warmogs removal is hard for tanks, and i think they should have given a new tank item as a compensation instead of the ones they added, and if the problem with Warmogs was dps building it, then up the Health cap to 4K, that should suffice to discourage them.

Also something i don't see anyone talking about is the accelerated pace of the game due to the experience added at level 3, it seem to be even more stomped or be stomped especially with the removal of warmogs. we now get our ultimates at 3 minish and it really helps ult-dependant champions but still many games end up beforre the 15 min mark, sometimes people just give up and open at 5-6 min it's crazy.

I Apologize if my english is not perfect, it ain't my mother tongue.

Jaspers6/4/2018, 8:40:38 AM3 votes

Agreed on Ghostwalkers, they are rediculous. I'd say just remove the stealth. Having a Yi suddenly appear in the backline slaughtering your team while you are the CC tank front line because he pressed the boots then his ult is not fun. You just end up thinking "How did he get there? Why is my team dead?"

It Hertz When IP6/4/2018, 4:57:32 PM3 votes

The issues with Ghostwalkers and Spectral Cutlass are the same ones as the issues with Mark/Dash when it was released: an added feature to help out immobile champions that got abused by already mobile ones.

I disagree with you on the Relic changes. The whole idea behind the Relics healing EVERYONE is that you're supposed to think before just mindlessly stepping on one because "we're low". Push the enemy back a bit first, or use the fact that you can essentially predict their movement over the next few seconds to aim your skillshots & AoE. I believe that after a few more weeks go by and everyone gets used to the new Relic system, their usage will get a lot more strategic.

WubbaLubbaDubDab6/4/2018, 11:30:22 PM3 votes

btw i dont understand why butcher's bridge isnt the standard aram map.that freljord map is so ugly an empty its just whiteness everywhere while butcher's bridge seems thats its full of life.if u want ppl to start playing some aram make it look good at least.howling abyss is such a bad map.

Barkhoof6/4/2018, 1:20:06 AM3 votes

Oh, Lordy, as a long-time ARAM player, I agree with everything you just said. I'm ok with the relic changes but everything else, it's basically word-for-word what I've been feeling.

Drugoth6/4/2018, 7:05:02 AM2 votes

I hope they keep the butchers bridge map though, it's awesome.

Tychusfindlay9186/4/2018, 4:19:21 PM2 votes

Still not a word from this guy about how awful it is to face poke comps that have one or two anti-hard engage champs with the removal of warmogs.

Clarity is most definitely an issue and it needs to disappear so mages cant shit fling from the start without a care.

IziMytTJd76/4/2018, 10:56:37 PM1 votes

You really missed on the power of all the new items. The boots are nowhere near as good as you make them seem. You are silenced during the active and the enemy can still see your silhouette. An you give up the chance to get ninja tabi or merc treads. Spectral cutlass active is fair on most champions. Only three or so champions actually can use it in a really effective way. The most broken thing about this item is the fact that it adds MORE lethality to your build.

But your feedback on item 4010 is a real head scratcher. This item provides you a spell shield as soon as you hit someone with a spell, which is right when you actually need it! As opposed to item 3102 which has its shield accidentally popped by a stray spell, and then you will never get it back until after you die. I think your evaluation of these items is way off. As an ARAM main, I've yet to see any of these items have a significant negative impact in the game.

Pika Fox6/5/2018, 4:17:03 PM1 votes

Revert harvest nerfs, keep everything else.

Mountain Warden6/5/2018, 4:27:20 PM1 votes

Besides the Dark Harvest nerfs and the removal of warmogs, I think everything is temporary. Both of those changes I highly approve. Warmogs especially was so broken on champs that utilized it. I also approve of the relic AOE effect. It really adds an extra dimension to this game mode giving you something else to fight over besides towers. I don't care for the special event items, especially the boots so I won't be sad to see them go. The map is also gorgeous and I sincerely hope the bring it back in some form of map rotation switching back and forth between butcher's bridge and howling abyss.

GodlyBane6/4/2018, 4:14:02 AM1 votes

My thoughts: its an amazing af change and im happy with it

Elewd6/4/2018, 7:08:13 AM1 votes

I like bloodletter as it feels like the most balanced new item, it has situational uses unlike the other 2 that feel oppresive on some champions and useless on others. went against a nocturne with cutlass and there was nothing i could do to protect my squishies, he cutlass, ulti'd thye died and he ported out regardless of cc

Baka Red6/4/2018, 12:39:39 PM1 votes

I only have about half the number of ARAMs played, but I agree with all your points, except two. The first is Health Relic. You aren't sure how you feel about that. I am certain that I like that. It is very good. The other one is the AP cutlass you play as an option. I would prefer option of having no cutlass for either AD or AP. Well, either Cutlass or Mark will have to be 'gone' for the other to exist - the combination is too abusive. I think that Mark is needed by Tanks. Cutlass alone might be too weak for assassins to use.

Other than those two subjects: Ghostwalkers.. we really have no need for those in ARAM, or they would need some heavy nerfing (I would prefer if they did not exist). If they have to exist, they must be weaker than Kayn wallwalking, not stronger as they are now.

Ahris6/4/2018, 12:54:15 PM1 votes

Bloodletter's Veil <- i want it to be 8 sec cd and active for 1 sec. This way at least it would be better than a banshee for dash users.

Ricje6/4/2018, 3:13:16 PM1 votes

Woa just got back and I'm quite surprised to see new responses as well as upvotes :o Thank you so much everyone! :)

{quoted}

Also as an aram player from EUW with more than 9000 games played since the aram queue, because we used to do it on custom games before that.

Exactly this! Was so much fun back then (with the exception of players "cheating" and buying stuff they weren't allowed to buy as well as going inside the jungle or even to other lanes) :p

Also something i don't see anyone talking about is the accelerated pace of the game due to the experience added at level 3, it seem to be even more stomped or be stomped especially with the removal of warmogs.

Personally speaking; I'm kind of neutral on this. On one side I don't mind it much because teams that are poke-heavy can't do as much damage poking anymore because of an earlier level 6 (resulting in the other team getting engage capabilities) but on the other side it makes them stronger faster because of the increase in ranks on their abilities. I don't like or dislike the change

{quoted}

Agreed on Ghostwalkers, they are rediculous. I'd say just remove the stealth. Having a Yi suddenly appear in the backline slaughtering your team while you are the CC tank front line because he pressed the boots then his ult is not fun. You just end up thinking "How did he get there? Why is my team dead?"

Not only with Master Yi though, unfortunately. Had quite a few "surprise surprise!" Jarvan players jumping on the backline insta-gibbing squishies as well as a Gragas coming out of a wall, belly-slam+ulting 3 of my teammates to their death. It if became more like Kayn's E but with a better visibility than the current "after images when nearby" and the ability to damage them with skillshots and knock them out of the wall (so you'd have some counterplay as they'd have to dodge skillshots) then I wouldn't really mind them as you'd have a proper indicator (no more "surprise surprise! Now give me my gold" attacks) and a way to do something about them. In its current iteration though I'd much rather just see it being removed.

{quoted}

They should make ghostwalker only activable when out of combat so it can't be use to escape.

It would, in my opinion, still be a problem as described above as they offer little to no counterplay. Mark/Dash can be dodged but a high-damage assassin unsuspectingly coming out of a wall can't.

SanKakU6/4/2018, 3:50:05 PM1 votes

I also immediately thought the map was smaller so I'm glad I'm not alone in this. I Like Bloodletter's Veil, but I wish it offered some defensive stat besides AP for shielding champs. I hate getting free champs in this mode and always will. I still think you guys should let us form a random champ pool for the mode to draw random champs from. The champ salvation option is cool, but lots of times you see people just leaving good champs in the dump for bad ones instead. Whether it means they don't own the champ or they simply don't like them can be hard to determine. Seeing top tier but low blue essence cost champs like Amumu and Annie just sitting in the dumpster and then your team gets destroyed utterly by a try hard team can be really aggravating and make you a target for 'it's just a game' flaming.

I own about half the champs and I don't like getting a champ I don't own only to roll into 2 other champs I don't own.

Raven Redeemed6/4/2018, 7:07:44 PM1 votes

I been playing aram since HA came out. Around 3k games I think.

I think the AD and AP items are great. Assassins historically have had a hard time on aram and these items help them adapt to the narrow space and perma-group.

The AD item could probably use some tuning (make the component item a one time use, swap stopwatch for some thing else, and increase the active CD a tad. I think its counter play is just fine. Its active announces the user’s intention to dive, they have to land mark or use a mobility CD to engage, the activation location can be camped by front line champs during a team fight, and the user has no control over the recall so if they need to stay longer (hello hourglass) for a kill or bailout sooner, too bad.

The AP item is just a good flat pen item for champs that don’t poke so much much like Kat.

I agree spooky boots are too strong on certain champs like engage tanks. It’s a really neat idea for an item but I’m not sure how to balance it.

Ztoka6/4/2018, 10:55:45 PM1 votes

Please add the ability to earn goodies on un-owned champs now that more are unlocked...