Suggestion for underlying Rank/LP for next season (SoloQ)

HeeroTX··1 votes·1,410 views

Here's a suggestion for how to to improve the SoloQ experience in the future. Step 1: allow players to EXPLICITLY swap roles in the lobby (this is already available technically, but for the main point it'd probably be necessary to make sure everyone is in the stated role), so if someone is autofilled sup, and jungle agrees to swap, then original jungle is now defined as support and vice versa Step 2: setup a litany of metrics for each role, for example: ADC = 1) CS, 2) KDA, 3) Objectives destroyed, 4) vision, 5) Damage dealt Step 3: Your final LP after the game is decided 34% on game result, and 66% on personal metrics Step 4: Weight on the given metrics is RANDOM for each game given a weight value from 0 - 100%

For best results, the metrics should all be considered items that are helpful to get the team TOWARDS the win, but by changing the metrics each game, you can't hyper focus on any one thing to "rig" the system. If I focus on KDA and the scoring is based on Objectives & vision, then I get screwed. Likewise if I spend all game split pushing and dropping wards while my team loses to a big teamfight and the scoring is on damage dealt then that's no gain for me.

This gives players more of a sense of "ownership" of their performance and you don't feel like a game with 4 randos where everyone else is feeding is a COMPLETE waste of time. It also reduces the effectiveness of boosting, since if in a duo, the weaker player won't gain as much (and might even decline) even if they win, and strong players can still advance, even if their team loses.

Keep the W/L as sole determinant for Flex, since the teams in there are more "built", but SoloQ really needs a way to allow for personal advancement without trying to force full "solo carry". "Gaming the system" is not a valid excuse anymore, because too many griefers already do that in the negative direction. (and even the unintentional feeders breed too much toxicity)

7 Comments

haaaaaaalp1 votes

Ranked should be a judge of personal skill and win/loss does that far better than the other stats you mentioned. Mobas aren't about who can get the most vision down or who can do the most damage, it is about who can best snowball the advantages their team has into a win.

HeeroTX1 votes

HOW does win/loss reflect PERSONAL skill in a 5v5 team game? LeBron James is/was widely considered the best basketball player IN THE WORLD. How does he only have 3 championships in a career that's almost 15 years long? Using W/L makes absolutely perfect sense for premade 5v5, because you know who's on your team and the team was (in some manner) built to play the game. Thus, you have a collective goal and its fair to have a collective rank. But if there's a city court where hundreds of people go to play basketball, do you think pure W/L would be an accurate assessment of your skill if you played 25 games and each game was with 4 random guys that I just throw at you each time under my assumption that "this seems fair".

And, over hundreds of games, YES it will theoretically play out that you'll EVENTUALLY be playing with 9 80-year olds and thus dominate the game for the W, but can you honestly tell me you won't be MORE toxic from playing 10 games with completely inept scrubs against several competent players with no credit for your individual ability simply because the only thing that matters is that your team lost? If you're competitive at all you're gonna unload on your teammates eventually for not being in the same league as the guys you're losing to.

Subdue1 votes

{quoted}

HOW does win/loss reflect PERSONAL skill in a 5v5 team game? LeBron James is/was widely considered the best basketball player IN THE WORLD. How does he only have 3 championships in a career that's almost 15 years long? Using W/L makes absolutely perfect sense for premade 5v5, because you know who's on your team and the team was (in some manner) built to play the game. Thus, you have a collective goal and its fair to have a collective rank. But if there's a city court where hundreds of people go to play basketball, do you think pure W/L would be an accurate assessment of your skill if you played 25 games and each game was with 4 random guys that I just throw at you each time under my assumption that "this seems fair".

And, over hundreds of games, YES it will theoretically play out that you'll EVENTUALLY be playing with 9 80-year olds and thus dominate the game for the W, but can you honestly tell me you won't be MORE toxic from playing 10 games with completely inept scrubs against several competent players with no credit for your individual ability simply because the only thing that matters is that your team lost? If you're competitive at all you're gonna unload on your teammates eventually for not being in the same league as the guys you're losing to.

If LeBron played in your city court group with randomized teams, What do you think his winrate would be?

haaaaaaalp1 votes

{quoted}

HOW does win/loss reflect PERSONAL skill in a 5v5 team game? LeBron James is/was widely considered the best basketball player IN THE WORLD. How does he only have 3 championships in a career that's almost 15 years long? Using W/L makes absolutely perfect sense for premade 5v5, because you know who's on your team and the team was (in some manner) built to play the game. Thus, you have a collective goal and its fair to have a collective rank. But if there's a city court where hundreds of people go to play basketball, do you think pure W/L would be an accurate assessment of your skill if you played 25 games and each game was with 4 random guys that I just throw at you each time under my assumption that "this seems fair".

And, over hundreds of games, YES it will theoretically play out that you'll EVENTUALLY be playing with 9 80-year olds and thus dominate the game for the W, but can you honestly tell me you won't be MORE toxic from playing 10 games with completely inept scrubs against several competent players with no credit for your individual ability simply because the only thing that matters is that your team lost? If you're competitive at all you're gonna unload on your teammates eventually for not being in the same league as the guys you're losing to.

Because skill in a moba is dependent on how well each player can take the advantages their team has and turn it into a win. Wins/losses is the best measure of that. League isn’t like the nba where two points in the first quarter is the same as two points in the fourth quarter, the values of each stat is extremely dynamic and the only thing which matters is which nexus falls in the end. You can (and many people have) won games on tryndamere doing zero damage to champions and placing close to no wards.

Also; I have no idea which system causes more toxicity. My position has always been that we overuse the term toxicity to the point where it has no meaning anymore. As a result, I just use the ranked system more indicative of skill.

ForFoxSakes1 votes

Doesnt work when you're already matched and in lobby. So youre a silver adc and plat jungler. get put into adc and u swap for jungle, wahts gonna happen? you team MMR just jumped. how will the matchmaking adjust while already matched?!

HeeroTX1 votes

Players can already swap roles now, this just means that your post game score will somewhat reflect the change rather than not. In your example, under current rules, you're put into adc you swap with jg, your team destroys opponent because of your lane advantage and you get more LP than you should because the MMR check is based on you being ADC and you ONLY get rated on the win, not any in-game metrics.

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