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Spam Ganks are annoying and Farming Junglers struggle: How does reducing Jungle Xp improve anything?

Rαy·10/31/2019, 1:22:20 PM·42 votes·14,841 views

I don't get the logic behind this. Riot is encouraging the spam gank meta with every single jungle change even further. I'm a jungle main myself and hate being forced to crawl up some laners' ass the whole time. I want to master counterjungling, not just brainlessly destroy botlane for the 20th game in a row.

People don't complain about this role, because its camps are too valuable - they complain about this role because it is forced to sit in their lane every 20 seconds due to its camps not being valuable enough.

I used to be a midlane main back in seasons 3-4 and when I recently tried out the role again, I was incredibly disappointed, as it boils down to who gets gangbanged the hardest. There is barely any interaction with your lane opponent anymore. You push the lane, then you either roam to bamboozle botlane or you just get bamboozled yourself.

How does forcing junglers NOT to farm their camps improve anything?

36 Comments

AIQ10/31/2019, 2:33:00 PM14 votes

[deleted]

StormBladeMaster10/31/2019, 5:10:12 PM7 votes

Yeah it's horrible, the lane that suffer the most from this is bot lane.

Yesterday, we had a Lee sin jungle in our team but he was so bad. The enemy Kayn was constantly ganking over and over. We didn't feed, we played pretty safe but you can't carry when you are under pressure. We couldn't play aggresive or take drakes because Kayn was always here.

And Lee sin who is supposed to be an early champ couldn't do a thing... He ignored us and prefered gank top lane. BTW he failed his ganks top.

And at one moment, they were 4 on bot lane. We was undertower and they dived us at lvl 8-9.

Also, Kayn ganked a lot Mid lane and our Tristana mid ragequit and spammed "Open mid" in the chat.

It's horrible, i don't want to play like this. This ganking fiesta need to end. Jungling should be playing around jungle objectives, farming and ganking but not ganking 24/7, it's so stupid.

But if you have a bad jungler, you can't get objectives because he has smite and you don't. Smite is needed to do drake or nashor. If you have a bad jungler, you are left on your lane without any possibilities to defend yourself from ganks or from hard pushing or hard counterpick.

I mean top can be bad, we can still carry if bot win. Mid can be bad, alright, we can carry if bot win. Jungle lose, we lose too because enemy jungler is putting pressure on bot lane and we can't play correctly when we are under pressure.

And if bot lane lose, usually the game is lose too. Because bot lane is the most important lane (2 people), unless your top and mid are feed, carring a team where bot lane and jungle lose hard is impossible.

The thigh guy11/1/2019, 1:34:24 AM6 votes

It doesn’t. Riot is trying to force a fast meta by making only 2 lanes matter and turning the other three people in the game into supports for the 2 lanes that will matter.

LightswornLance10/31/2019, 9:18:33 PM4 votes

Did you not read the notes? They decreased the camp gold and exp by 5% but decreased the camp spawn timers from 2:30 to 2:00 which is an overall 12% increase if you are optimally farming. You can also get level 3 from either side now with gromp being boosted in exp and krugs being reduced. I expect my boy Graves to be meta again :)

iPogoZ10/31/2019, 9:52:17 PM2 votes

How are farming junglers struggling? Ekko, Karthus, Zac, Mundo, Olaf, evelynn and Nunu are all heavy farming junglers that are high teir junglers, additionally there are high win rate niche pick farming junglers like AP Shyvana or Kindred. The big issue I see with farming junglers is people who don't know how to optimize the XP they get from camps, Usually if you start red, full clear red side then go blue wolves gromp scuddle, back then just go crugs, raptors, wolves, gromp and repeat that as camps respawn, you can build a huge xp lead due to abusing early catchup xp on raptor camp and getting fast respawns on high xp camps such as crugs and raptors.

ViperVenom11/1/2019, 2:58:38 AM2 votes

The xp nerf from the start of season 9 needs to be at least partially reverted.

Theres no point to strategic invading anymore, you only do it to farm efficiently, it wont put the enemy behind because as long as they participate in at least 1 kill you fall behind from invading instead of going for kills/assists.

Raiyza10/31/2019, 7:20:10 PM2 votes

I'm guessing the goal is to reduce jungler dependance. A master jungler will take over the game pretty quickly in this meta.

XJ9999999999999911/1/2019, 3:36:24 AM2 votes

jungle sux

Daddy Ants11/1/2019, 11:19:06 AM2 votes

Non-Buff camps are also getting their spawn timer reduced from 2:30 to 2:00.

A power farming Master Yi will pull ahead of a spam ganking J4 for example.

BigFBear11/1/2019, 1:49:56 PM2 votes

Because it's not a XP reduction at the end. Yeah the camps have a bit less XP but the Spawn time is reduced too so overall it's 13%+ XP for good clear pathing.

Talisid11/1/2019, 2:18:55 AM1 votes

Its a tough balance to strike. Too much jungle xp/gold and Karthus just sits in the jungle for 30 mins and then starts one shotting people. Too little xp/gold and junglers just end up doing their best River Shen impression.

PzyXo10/31/2019, 9:36:24 PM1 votes

I honestly miss the s7/early s8 jungling. Was fun for the jungler to go on many ways, either gank much and push your lanes to win. Or farm yourself with dark harvest and carry the game (most of the times), or counter jungle to make the enemy jungler flame you instead of doing something ...etc Now its just either gank the fucking botlane or lose the game. Annoying and cancerous, I can't even play Kayn as I used to...

IMelchorI11/1/2019, 11:50:33 AM1 votes

nerf jungle xp + increase jungle camp spawn rate = more time spent farming and less spent ganking

this change nerfs ganking junglers who permacamp lanes and only take camps now and then

Dingding12311/1/2019, 5:06:29 AM1 votes

Let's list the honest pros and cons of the exp changes:

Pros:

  • no matter what shenanigans, botlane has less chance of running away with games without other lanes having a say
  • top laners will be (more) relevant without having to cheese
  • more viable jungle paths, now if tanks only had a way to deal with Scuttle...
  • yi/noct don't hit 6 as early

Cons:

  • the losing jungler will still have next to zero impact on the game
  • sharing wave exp will hinder both laners more, meaning nothing barring kills or holding lanes solo will help junglers catch up

Catastrophes:

  • solo laners will go completely buckwild after getting an early lead and average K/D/A junglers will no longer be able to do anything about it; expect Yasuo Ekko and assassins trying to pop off every game...I mean even moreso than already...
Theorex11/1/2019, 6:57:38 AM1 votes

LC$

Crescent Dusk10/31/2019, 11:36:06 PM1 votes

{quoted}

I don't get the logic behind this. Riot is encouraging the spam gank meta with every single jungle change even further. I'm a jungle main myself and hate being forced to crawl up some laners' ass the whole time. I want to master counterjungling, not just brainlessly destroy botlane for the 20th game in a row.

People don't complain about this role, because its camps are too valuable - they complain about this role because it is forced to sit in their lane every 20 seconds due to its camps not being valuable enough.

I used to be a midlane main back in seasons 3-4 and when I recently tried out the role again, I was incredibly disappointed, as it boils down to who gets gangbanged the hardest. There is barely any interaction with your lane opponent anymore. You push the lane, then you either roam to bamboozle botlane or you just get bamboozled yourself.

How does forcing junglers NOT to farm their camps improve anything?

Nerfing ganks is outright r%%%%%ed.

If you're not a strong 1v1 jungler and they increase jungle xp then that means the Udyr/Warwick/Xin Zhao/Shaco/Master Yi/Lee Sin take even more of your camps in invades and gain even more levels over you as you become useless far more quickly from being massively outleveled.

Ganks are the only way junglers that are not strong early duelists can keep up in xp and gold.

Nerfing them is stupid because early game duelists will benefit doubly, from gaining even more jungle xp off invades on top of the fact they're already strong gankers.

GigglesO11/1/2019, 12:53:27 AM1 votes

They nerfed exp but also reduced respawn timers. Farming exp is overall up...

Also with the duo lane exp nerf taxing is now more punishing.

Spicy Rice11/1/2019, 1:25:51 AM1 votes

reducing exp = more camps needed to stay up in levels

this means more time needed in the jung farming which is bad for gank heavy jungs and good for farming junglers. At the same time, it becomes more punishing to fail a gank and get counterjungled.

IronyAndSublime11/1/2019, 2:50:56 PM1 votes

It appears Riot is in favor of XinZhao LeeSin and Ekko now...