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Dear Riot, can we get a straight, no-nonsense description of what your vision for this game is?

test account·2/21/2015, 4:35:05 AM·125 votes·31,949 views

There's a lot of talk in your news posts and AMAs about things like "strategic diversity" and the like. But as of late, looking at the PBE and the recent changes you've made, it's really difficult to get any sort of idea what exactly you mean by all that. Especially given it feels like you're actively trying to weaken all but a handful of champions in specific roles, which I'm sure can't possibly be the case. Your patch notes specifically call out certain champions as being "fun and balanced" while simultaneously nerfing other very similar champions. The issue is mobility creep has been openly acknowledged, but the past few new champions have all had mobility in one form or another. In some cases, oodles of it.

I'm not looking to use this post to complain, decry decisions you've made on the PBE or in recent patches, or point fingers at new champions and call them the end of the world. I'm writing this post because I'm legitimately curious, and I'd like to see one of you discuss your plans for the game -- and answer a few questions -- without using buzzwords and in-house jargon that you've only vaguely defined to the players.

  • When you envision the game this time next year, what exactly do you see going on in it? How do you want or expect this season to play out?

  • When you refer to strategic diversity, do you mean that you want any and all champions to be a common and regular pick, their frequency only truly decided by their teamcomp? Or are you perfectly happy with the way things have traditionally been, with people generally flocking to the same 3 or 4 champions for each role outside of edge cases and "pocket picks," so long as there is some other form of...strategic diversity in another way? And if so, what is that strategic diversity, if not champion variety?

  • How exactly do you plan on dealing with mobility creep? Do you even think it's still a problem, or should we just expect every low-mobility character to eventually be reworked to keep up? If you're planning on doing something about it, but it's not going to be for a long, long time coming -- could you just tell us? Please?

Finally: Where are you taking this? What are your goals with all these changes? I know what you've said, but a lot of things really just don't seem to line up.

172 Comments

RiotGhostcrawler2/22/2015, 4:15:05 PM46 votes

When you envision the game this time next year, what exactly do you see going on in it? How do you want or expect this season to play out?

We want more champ diversity. A lot of the preseason changes were made with the goal of having games play out differently. Overall we are happy with the changes made to towers, objectives and the jungle, but it hasn't yet created the space for more champs. (I should add at least within one region - if you look world-wide, diversity is preety good, but that's largely because different champs are getting played in different parts of the world.) We knew the changes would be disruptive, meaning it might take players a few patches to explore the best strategies to use in the new environment, but things are starting to settle in now and diversity isn't where we want it to be.

When you refer to strategic diversity, do you mean that you want any and all champions to be a common and regular pick, their frequency only truly decided by their teamcomp? Or are you perfectly happy with the way things have traditionally been, with people generally flocking to the same 3 or 4 champions for each role outside of edge cases and "pocket picks," so long as there is some other form of...strategic diversity in another way? And if so, what is that strategic diversity, if not champion variety?

Strategic diversity refers both to champs and to the game itself. If every game is won with a similar comp (even if the champs are different) or every games be becomes a 5 dragon stack, then the risk still exists that the third game you play feels exactly like the previous two. On the topic of champ diversity specifically, it's not a reasonable expectation or a goal to have every champ played equally. Champs have different play styles and themes and that all factors in. But we can do better than we do today.

How exactly do you plan on dealing with mobility creep? Do you even think it's still a problem, or should we just expect every low-mobility character to eventually be reworked to keep up? If you're planning on doing something about it, but it's not going to be for a long, long time coming -- could you just tell us? Please?

Mobility is fun and useful or we wouldnt't keep adding it to kits. The problem is that too often it comes for free just to give a champ a little extra pizzazz. Roles that need a lot of mobility, like assassins, aren't a huge problem, but roles that already bring a lot to the table, especially mages and ADCs, can be. Even with these it doesn't need to be an ironclad rule that they can't dash, but they do need to pay for it elsewhere in their power budget. For these champs, we are less likely to nerf their movement mechanic and more likely to reduce their damage, survivability or control to pay for the mechanic.

Zarxis2/21/2015, 4:45:03 AM43 votes

LC$ Big Play$. Tons of cash. A quiet playerbase that spends lots of money.

-Rito Games

Keevalroy2/21/2015, 6:17:23 AM28 votes

The only response a thread like this could get is the delicately worded 6-12 paragraph response that you would expect from a politician, who puts an exorbitant amount of effort in saying absolutely nothing at all.

What we have seen in the past from these are them bringing up an issue we already knew existed months prior, acknowledging it exists, and then we are assured that it would be looked into. A notable example of this was the case with mobility and mobility creep...do I need to explain what happened or have we suffered enough of it?

Do we need to look at the win rate argument where a Rioter will say win rates make a difference in terms of strength while completely refuting that point saying it doesn't matter when talking about another champion?

That said, should their blatant favoritism be added to that list? Why are some champions able to walk out of nerf territory virtually unscathed while others of a lower power and pick rate are run over by the nerf truck and/or assigned an entirely new identity out of the blue regardless of player feedback?

We deserve answers for what Riot wants to do, because a lot of us are confused. This AMA-type of discussion also needs to be on the League boards - NOT ON REDDIT! I can't stress this last part enough, because along with the recent lack of proof that Riot holds up to their claims and philosophies, most Redditors can't prove they truly play League in the first place.

Edit: Wanted to point out that I'm not ignoring Reinboom reaching out to the community, this is unexpected and very much appreciated.

BluePolarizer2/21/2015, 4:42:33 AM14 votes

strategic diversity:

you get to choose from Lee Sin, Vi AND J4. What more could you possibly want?!

you get to choose between an AD or AP assassin mid now. You're nuts if you think this isn't diverse!

Condottiero2/21/2015, 11:41:02 PM9 votes

Meanings of popular catchphrases:

Counterplay = Skillshots, any ability which can be dodged. Any other type of ability is anti fun and lacks counterplay.

Mobility creep = Healthy for the game, since dodging a skillshot by dashing 999999 times is a true display of skill.

Toxic = Any champion who can't be balanced by changing a few numbers around is instantly deemed toxic and poorly designed, requiring an extensive rework to transform the champion into a skillshot based sustained damage dealer.

Strategic diversity = LC$BIGPLAY$

Fun = Skillshot based champion with an immunity to jungle ganks by being able to dash out.

Anti fun = Champion with reliable damage (Ryze, Mordekaiser, Annie)/ huge burst (Veigar, Talon)

/s

All it takes to fix everything wrong with League of Legends is to scrap the utterly stupid idea of "counterplay".

SleepyLionCub2/21/2015, 8:06:46 AM7 votes

Delete old non mobility champions, and replace them with champions who have 2 knockups 2 dashes, and 3 shields in their kits.

MrSlowDie2/21/2015, 6:37:36 AM6 votes

Riot : "Strategic Diversity" proceeded to make dragon more important and increase baron spawn time, so the 1-1-2+1 jungler strategy harder to break.

Arch Mage Magnus2/21/2015, 7:52:46 AM6 votes

You'd have better chances asking the producer of LOST what the T.V show was about.

SmokingPuffin2/21/2015, 5:53:47 AM3 votes

When you refer to strategic diversity, do you mean that you want any and all champions to be a common and regular pick, their frequency only truly decided by their teamcomp?

They definitely don't want this. They have a list of champions they explicitly don't support for competitive play. You know, Urgot, Poppy, Yorick, that sort of thing.

I think their ideal champion balance is one in which there is a clear niche for every champion -- you pick Kog to artillery people, you pick Vayne to shred tanks, you pick MF to AoE wombo combo, and so on. I think they also recognize they are light years away from achieving that goal.

And if so, what is that strategic diversity, if not champion variety?

I thought they were pretty clear about this. They want to support a variety of strategies to win the game and playstyles in each role. For example, they want you to be able to choose a jungler that farms for late game, or a jungler that pressures lanes, or a jungler who tries to live in the enemy jungle. At the team level, they want to support poke comps, engage comps, aoe comps, pick comps, split pushers, and so on. Strategic diversity means they don't want any one strategy to become dominant; it remains to be seen whether they will be successful at this.

I don't know that they will ever get to a spot where a wide range of champions are commonly picked. There's too much overlap in their designs. For example, it's pretty clear that Lucian and Graves will never be equally strong, and they are so similar that one will always be picked over the other.

How exactly do you plan on dealing with mobility creep? Do you even think it's still a problem, or should we just expect every low-mobility character to eventually be reworked to keep up?

I don't believe they have said that mobility creep is a problem. They recognize it's happening, but I haven't heard them say that they want to lower the amount of mobility in the game. I think they want to revisit champs that seem to not be paying enough value for their mobility Kassadin, and they also want to take a look at the immobile champions that aren't seeming to get enough value in exchange for being immobile Varus.