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Kindred/Bard "pure utility" type ultimates toxic for low ELO play?

EvilMerodach·10/6/2015, 5:07:39 PM·4 votes·1,968 views

Kindred's R kind of bothers me in that it has no inherent advantage depending on which team used it. In a Kindred vs Kindred mirror match, it literally doesn't matter which Kindred ulti'd, both sides have an equal advantage gained and lost from its use. That's like if Karthus Q just did neutral AoE damage.

I feel like it should at least heal 10% more for allies than enemies...or..something, a minor speed boost for allies only when it ends? Same with Bard's..I feel like if allies and enemies are both caught in the ulti at the same time, allies should leave stasis 10% sooner (to allow them to reposition/set up to kill the enemies caught in it). Kind of disliking all the skills put into the game lately that can potentially harm allies. It's not even for trolling reasons, trolls gonna troll, and there's always Anivia W for that. Just if you have a person inexperienced with the champion, they can make mistakes that effect you doubly so. Already bad to have someone who can miss their own skillshots/combos and throw a fight, now you got guys that can fuck up your skillshots/combos.

It's like the "I'm Singed, I'm helping" thing, except at least Singed's toss does damage. It can still turn a good skillshot into a bad one..but at the very least it did something bad to the enemy, even if it's only 50 damage, it's still something.

26 Comments

Meep Man10/6/2015, 6:06:15 PM3 votes

{quoted}

Kindred's R kind of bothers me in that it has no inherent advantage depending on which team used it. In a Kindred vs Kindred mirror match, it literally doesn't matter which Kindred ulti'd, both sides have an equal advantage gained and lost from its use. That's like if Karthus Q just did neutral AoE damage.

I feel like it should at least heal 10% more for allies than enemies...or..something, a minor speed boost for allies only when it ends? Same with Bard's..I feel like if allies and enemies are both caught in the ulti at the same time, allies should leave stasis 10% sooner (to allow them to reposition/set up to kill the enemies caught in it). Kind of disliking all the skills put into the game lately that can potentially harm allies. It's not even for trolling reasons, trolls gonna troll, and there's always Anivia W for that. Just if you have a person inexperienced with the champion, they can make mistakes that effect you doubly so. Already bad to have someone who can miss their own skillshots/combos and throw a fight, now you got guys that can fuck up your skillshots/combos.

It's like the "I'm Singed, I'm helping" thing, except at least Singed's toss does damage. It can still turn a good skillshot into a bad one..but at the very least it did something bad to the enemy, even if it's only 50 damage, it's still something.

They actually do have an advantage because they choose when the ultimate is used and where its used. Thats an advantage, and a big one, in and of itself.

Killstrado10/6/2015, 6:58:32 PM2 votes

I'm sorry so many people are having context issues, but I agree with what you're saying, trolls aside No spell should benefit an enemy, why they'd allow it is beyond me. They only thing any enemy should benefit from is the fact that you missed the spell not that you landed it.

Dreadlocks10/6/2015, 5:22:31 PM2 votes

Even Azir's wall doesn't fuck his own team over, at least they made that skill 1 sided. But I see your point, very interesting topic.

Zorae4210/6/2015, 6:58:40 PM1 votes

No different than a Kalista ulting you out of safety and back into range of the team chasing her. Or Tahm ulting someone into the middle of the enemy team before flashing away. Even ones that do "less to punish you for messing up" can have far greater consequences. Bad Janna ults can destroy the whole team. Even just missing an ability can screw over a whole team. Fail to land a Sona ult or some other CC, and watch the enemy carry melt the team.

All bad plays/poorly timed abilities can hurt the whole team. Just because it's not directly hurting them, doesn't make it any less severe.

Inphernal10/6/2015, 6:15:30 PM1 votes

Im not crying for nidalee buffs if i miss her Q, since that was just a player using a tool poorly.

I wont cry for kindred buffs if i misuse his ultimate since thats just a player using a tool poorly.

V Khat10/6/2015, 5:55:18 PM1 votes

Nah. It's not worse. You can get locked down by Anivia's Wall and Trundle's pillar. Piss of a Tahm Kench and he will eat you and throw you into the enemy turret with no minions.

Seriously, they can get you locked to a wall or a turret with those, and it's a free kill if you don't have summoners.

DrCyanide10/6/2015, 6:21:16 PM1 votes

It's no better or worse than a JarvanIV ultimate.

How many times have you found yourself, low health, trapped by your "I'm helping!" Jarvan ally as he ulted the enemy that was chasing you, pinning the 3 of you in his ult? It's happened a few times to me, and it sucks, but it's the minority of the time. Part of the reason it's a minority of the time is that Jarvan players learn how to play their champion, and get a feel for when they should and should not use their ultimate near allies.

It's the same with Bard, Tahm, and Kindred. Players who are new to them will make mistakes, regardless of their elo. But as they get a better understanding of the champion they'll use the ability smarter and smarter, and will help their team far more than they'll help the enemy team.