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Why Archangels is the "Go-to" Mana Item

Dog of Pavlov·3/23/2018, 4:58:08 PM·73 votes·4,836 views

The issue with the new mana items is that only one out of the three provides enough mana to last throughout an extended duration. Both Ludens and GLP provide beneficial aspects, but still they do not provide enough mana. Sure their base mana is higher than old Morello, but the reason that item solved the mana issues was because of its passive that granted a large amount of mana (35% max mana I believe?) for any assist or kill.

None of the current mana items have this passive, which means that in order to cope with high mana costs, you need an item that can provide enough mana to last an entire duration of an extended fight so you don't go oom in the middle of it. Archangels provides over 3x the amount of mana AND way more AP than the other 2 items (not to mention that super handy shield that is still busted after the nerfs), and until you increase the base mana of the other items or grant some mana % after a kill/assist like it used to, this problem won't get solved.

Champions that should be using Luden's Echo (like Ziggs for example) are simply buying Archangels because they don't want to go oom after a few spell rotations. You need to buff how mana is given in Ludens and GLP if you want them to be viable.

83 Comments

wildfox993/23/2018, 7:44:53 PM10 votes

i still can't understand why those items can't keep the item 3802 passive :/

sometimes upgrading them feels like a waste

Looknook3/23/2018, 5:44:53 PM8 votes

Even beyond just mana, archangel gives 20% cooldown reduction now and Luden’s no longer gives move speed. I don’t see a point in building Luden’s over Archangel on almost any champ, as it really just gives the little AP splash, which I always found to be underwhelming anyways.

FilDaFunk3/23/2018, 10:32:34 PM7 votes

Luden's is clearly meant for poking, but with so little mana, that clearly is counterproductive.

Purejoyce3/23/2018, 8:16:55 PM7 votes

Wow, you don't say? It's almost like they removed that passive, because they didn't want mages to be able to have unlimited mana, hmmmm

Rathar Dashing3/24/2018, 2:20:06 AM6 votes

What if, now hear me out, they buffed the other two items mana regen. item 3285 : Hitting a champion with the passive effect restores X% missing mana. (similar to item 1402 )

item 3030 : Hitting an enemy champion with this items active marks them for 10 seconds. If they die within that time, restore X% of your maximum mana.

Awf Meta3/23/2018, 6:55:01 PM6 votes

Or, reduce mana costs. Or, balance mana costs.

SpecterVonBaren3/23/2018, 8:47:37 PM6 votes

I'm pretty sure Ziggs takes it now because its always been an item he'd like, it just didn't give CDR. His spell spammy nature makes the item perfect for him now.

Anu3isII3/23/2018, 6:42:29 PM5 votes

I disagree. I believe that the passives/actives of Luden's and GLP are simply outweighed by Archangel's.

Archangel, when it transforms into Xerath's Embrace, offers a ton of mana, a lot more AP and a defensive active that is close to a second Barrier as Summoner Spell.

When compared to Luden's and GLP, it simply outshines them in every aspect, with a few cases where the champion lacks decent AP scalings, and would opt for more damage from the other two.

What I would suggest is buffing Luden's passive AP ratio by at least 10%, and buff GLP's active damage (and maybe its slow?) to at least further differentiate them.

Archangel should be a late game defensive item that helps AP casters stack a lot of mana and sustain.

Luden's should be a poke/DPS item that helps AP casters waveclear faster (and for less mana) and deal high AoE damage in fights.

GLP should be a burst item, that helps AP casters catch isolated targets and murder them in seconds, where Luden's would proc only once and Archangel's Mana and Shield simply don't matter.

Trist mid opop3/23/2018, 10:29:56 PM5 votes

Archannel grants 25% refund on mana costas

z63XnLCMwX3/23/2018, 5:18:14 PM4 votes

People just need to learn mana management. Pretty much 0 problems with mana after buying lost chapter.

Bern3/23/2018, 6:20:36 PM4 votes

There's a lot less shoving power before you have to base, yeah.

I still think that most important factor is 750g for tear versus 1100g for Lost Chapter, though. Tear is a feasible way to buy mana sustain on your first back. Lost Chapter is not.

AmazoX3/23/2018, 8:09:39 PM4 votes

What I don't understand is why they touched GLP? Aurelion Sol took an arrow to the knee because of the change without compensation to his defensive capabilities in any form.

Lunar Lunacy3/23/2018, 6:13:44 PM3 votes

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Jungles Mine3/23/2018, 10:32:00 PM3 votes

i think archangel is so good for the fact that even before its fully upgrade it gives around 80-90 AP where the other 2 are 80 and 90 with a little bit of burst about 70-120 after resistances. The AP will go up as you lvl and get mana per lvl or get a 2nd mana item making it super efficient with the shield active giving 300+ shield. So it basically gives more AP and a defensive item to help you survive any burst or a crit that could be crucial in deciding a fight. As well as providing the same CDR as the others. I think if they just removed 10% CDR from the item the other 2 options would become more prominent.

FirewaterDM3/23/2018, 6:59:36 PM3 votes

Archangels is balanced in that a sizeable number of AP champs can't easily stack it in a fast amount of time- there are outliers who are busted but still.

ZaneShadow3/24/2018, 5:29:06 AM3 votes

Wait, Ziggs has great synergy with Archangel. Like, I used to try and build around it before the cdr because of how good it should have been on him.

But that’s beside the point. I do agree that it is the most powerful, but thats not because of the mana, it’s the mana shield. Champs with it can become unkillable, and with this patch hopefully that changes. Because getting hit by Ludens Ori and being chunked for half my health has taught me that at least that item is really, really powerful. GLP I have hardly seen since it lost its health. Man I hope they give it its health back.

I do think that if someone like lux who is built around burst took it, that’d be the signal of brokenness. But jumping back to Ziggs, he was run in the bot lane for that little bit because he offered such long range power that could be spammed frequently. I’m surprised it didn’t resurge a bit with the new patch.

Rathar Dashing3/24/2018, 2:23:26 AM2 votes

Another reason I think people who would otherwise go with GLP over Archangels is that it locks them out of buying Gunblade and Protobelt.

C9 Squeeky 3/23/2018, 6:39:58 PM2 votes

I believe old Morello also gave you max mana upon leveling up as well

P0IS0N IVY3/24/2018, 11:36:24 PM2 votes

When Riot said they were doing a rework of mana items, I thought that meant they would give us more choices. Instead, they removed morellos as a mana item, tried to combine bits of it with tear, and then tacked some mana onto Luden's and GLP to call it a day. So it's no wonder people only buy archangel's now if they want mana. It's literally the only choice.

It seems like Riot wants to prevent mages from spamming abilities constantly, but considering there are champions without mana costs out there, mages are always going to be considered weak if they cannot consistently spam.