Boards›Gameplay

Jarvan IV Suggestions and Some Shield Value Comparisons

Gold Grenade·10/2/2019, 4:45:47 PM·4 votes·1,891 views

Jarvan IV Suggestions Cataclysm Requires champion to target, but actually targets ground under champion.

Issue: Requires both ground and champion targeting as conditions, but actually targets ground.

Result: Champion targeted does not take ult damage or AOE damage if they flash. They are also not pulled back in to the arena.

Suggestion: The target should receive the ult damage even if they flash to escape the arena. Anyone besides the targeted champion should be able to flash the ult AOE damage and arena.

Golden Aegis Issue: The scaling on the shield is actually a practical joke. Let's compare some shield scaling in the game at level 3 with no extra HP items and recommended runes for each champion:

Suggestion: Change the scaling value to bonus attack damage because percent health scaling is too low and doesn't make sense with the rest of the champion kit.

Some Shield Comparisons

JarvanIV Golden Aegis: Grants a shield that absorbs 60/85/110/135/160 (+0 [1.5% max Health] for each nearby enemy champion) damage for 5 seconds.

At level 3 Jarvan and one enemy champion in radius: One Ability Point: 71 Two points: 96

Starting value is a joke. Scaling is terrible. 12 second cooldown is good.

The %max health is too low to make sense with the rest of the champion kit and should be changed to bonus attack damage.

LeeSin Safeguard: Lee Sin rushes to target ally. If the ally is a champion, Lee Sin shields the ally and himself for 55/110/165/220/275 (+80% Ability Power) damage for 2 seconds and Safeguard's cooldown is reduced by 50%.

So at level 3 Lee Sin (self-cast): One Ability Point: 55 Two points: 110

Starting value is as a terrible joke. It's the nearest comparison early and needs a buff, but does have good base scaling. 12 second cooldown is pretty good. The AP scaling makes no sense and should be changed to bonus attack damage.

Sion Soul Furnace: Sion shields himself for 50/75/100/125/150 (+40% Ability Power) (+0) (8/9/10/11/12% of maximum Health) for 6 seconds. With Sion's passive, grasp, and overgrowth this scales quite well indeed.

Shield at Level 3: One point: 102 Two points: 134

Good starting value and good scaling. 14 second cooldown is ok. (the AP scaling makes no sense and should be changed)

Riven Calcluation done with and without starting AD items. Valor: Riven does a quick dash in the direction of your cursor and becomes shielded, blocking up to 95/125/155/185/215 (+100% bonus Attack Damage) for 1.5 seconds.

Shield at Champion Level 3: One Ability Point: 106 (114 with doran's blade, 116 with longsword) Two Ability Points: 146 (146 with doran's blade, 156 with longsword)

Too high starting value and too high scaling. Cooldown: One Ability Point: 11.4 seconds Two points: 10.45 seconds

Cooldown is too low. It should start at 14 and use the same scaling percentage it does now, or be flattened at 12 seconds. It's literally broken with current values AND doesn't cost mana, OR energy. (GOTTA SELL SKINS THOUGH!!!!!!)

Karma Inspire: Mantra Bonus: Energy radiates out from her target, strengthening the initial shield and applying Inspire to nearby allied champions. Target ally gains a shield, granting 40/45/50/55/60% Movement Speed for 1.5 seconds and absorbing 70/95/120/145/170 (+50% Ability Power) damage for 2.5 seconds. Mantra Bonus - Defiance: The shield overflows with energy, absorbing an additional NaN (+50% Ability Power) damage.

Shield: One Ability Point: 79 One Ability Point with spellthief's: 84 One Ability Point with doran's ring: 87 One Ability Point mantra: 113 One Ability Point mantra with spellthief's: 123 One Ability Point mantra with doran's ring: 129

Two points: 104 Two Ability Points with spellthief's edge: 109 Two Ability Points with doran's ring: 112 Two Ability Points mantra: 138 Two Ability Points mantra with spellthief's: 143 Two Ability Points mantra with doran's ring: 146

Cooldown: One Ability Point: 10 Two Ability Points: 9.5

Starting value is fine. With mantra it's a bit too high, or cooldown is a bit too low. At least these have mana costs ffs.

Kaisa This champion has a shield that reflects her first identity as a close-range AD carry. She has more range now, which is healthy, but the shield didn't get nerfed or removed to reflect her new longer-range so it causes her to be a bit... overpowered.

13 Comments

WoonStruck10/2/2019, 5:51:18 PM2 votes

Uhh, J4's shield scales with EACH champion hit.

Its not better in 1v1 scenarios, but its base value and scaling are almost ALWAYS better than other basic shields vs 2+ champions.

Why would they change the %HP to %AD when that would just push more people to go glass cannon (something they tend to discourage via nerfs)? Why not just buff the %HP if its too low?

You're also suggesting buffs to champions that don't need it. If you give every AD champion an AD scaling shield, the base value would either have to be nerfed significantly or the AD scaling would be so low that it would hardly be relevant...and they'd still probably need nerfs.

StormBladeMaster10/2/2019, 7:51:13 PM1 votes

No way dude, you are dreaming... These R changes on J4 are cancer. J4, like every jungler who is good at ganking is "cancer" in this meta because they dive pretty easy, they can perma gank, deal big dmg...

And J4 has a nice teamfight utility. If we can't flash his ultimate, then it's stupid. Jarvan has too much mobility, that why players must be able to dogde this ulti with perfect flash.

Or otherwise, you nerf the dmg.

For example : Cataclysm will only deal 100/200/300 + 50% AD and you can add a little stun of 1s on the primary target and 0,5s on other ennemy champs close to the primary target, so even if the dmg is not possible to dogde, it's not that much and it's add him more utility to teamfight with the little stun.

I agree his shield could be better, but i don't like your buff. It's promoting J4 assassin, which is cancer. You should buff the %hp ratio or the number of HP gained from the number of enemies champs. You could improve his "diver gameplay" without making him an assassin. If you buff his AD ratio, then you are making him an assassin or something like Riven.

I would also change his E who is making his gameplay way too much casual, i mean getting assist only for placing a flag is something that bug me and also this spell feels like boring.

I would do this :

Flag dmg : Reduced to 40/60/80/100/120 + 30% of total AD physical dmg.

I keep the AS passive.

When Jarvan will use his W near a flag, his W will be more powerful. The shield will be bigger, the flag will count as a champion. So his flag will have an interaction with his W.

The flag will create a small zone around him (200ua) for 8s who reduces the dmg taken for your teammates and you. It's would be 20/22,5/25/27,5/30% and J4 would have the double of this bonus, so 40/45/50/55/60%.

It's would allow J4 to towerdive more often, since he is a diver but also, he would have to take risks and if he wants assists, he will have to move "his ass". It's would make him more powerful if he can fight inside of the flag zone because he would reduce a lot of dmg, also making his clear easier because he would lose less hp.

These changes would actually make him more tanky making top lane viable again but with less dmg but with more skillcap.

And by the way, J4 gameplay is everything about utility. Q reduce armor which is good for your physical dmg teammates, W slow ennemies which is good for your teammates, E give AS buff and his ulti is a "zone CC" if we can describe it like this.

Düff McWhalen10/2/2019, 9:04:39 PM1 votes

Hey OP. I know you got bodied by a J4 and all, but don't touch my champion. He's in a perfect spot.